ECT Does the book of James contradict Paul's epistles? How?

Livelystone

New member
Faith consists of what you believe more than how much you believe.

Works done by faith, done through faith, or because of the hearing of faith, are works being done by God that cannot be done by man.

Kindness and generosity are good works but they are not works that prove faith........ anyone can be kind and all should be....... what the heck, the largest contributors to large charities are almost always atheists (like Bill Gates)

Works that prove faith are works of God being done through the person who has faith. It is the "true faith" within a person that is the main reason behind why God did a particular miracle through the person with faith.

There are lots of good Samaritans in the world, but it is only the presence of signs and wonders following behind a person's ministry; that points to and proves the presence of faith with works within the person.
 
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Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
He admits it-he is not a bible believer, as he corrects the bible.

"Faith in James should have been translated "believing" not faith."-bible corrector oatmush




Identify this "God's word, " "scripture, you cite, that "is given by inspiration," that we can press to our hearts, and declare, "This is the pure, true, sound, right, by definition, without error word of God, scripture, that the LORD God promised to preserve forever. I believe every word of it." Does it have a name? Where can I get a copy?

Again-as I predicted...


I guarantee you, that this bible correcting fraud, posing as a bible believer, will not give us a straight answer. They never do, as bible correctors/mystics/agnostics, such as oatmush, love to lord over the sheep, and talk you out of your faith in the bible.


The book of James say a lot about you John.


Jas 1:26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.


Jas 1:19 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath:
Jas 1:20 For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.
Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

Jas 4:11 Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.
Jas 4:12 There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?

Jas 3:1 My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.
Jas 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.
Jas 3:3 Behold, we put bits in the horses' mouths, that they may obey us; and we turn about their whole body.
Jas 3:4 Behold also the ships, which though they be so great, and are driven of fierce winds, yet are they turned about with a very small helm, whithersoever the governor listeth.
Jas 3:5 Even so the tongue is a little member, and boasteth great things. Behold, how great a matter a little fire kindleth!
Jas 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
Jas 3:7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:
Jas 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.
Jas 3:9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.
Jas 3:10 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.
Jas 3:11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
Jas 3:12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh.
Jas 3:13 Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom.
Jas 3:14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
Jas 3:15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
Jas 3:16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

Jas 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
 

Livelystone

New member

iIguess I need some help in what (or who) you are saying amen too, because IMO you and I have been on same page over several subjects now

So I am thinking maybe I am not reading you correctly?

Does this mean in your opinion all those compassionate atheists who are the main supporters of the largest charities in the world supporting many of the worlds unfortunates who without the love, compassion, and generosity of these atheists for their fellow mankind, are therefore getting credit for having faith with works even though they do NOT believe in God?

Maybe I lost the place of who you are agreeing too, because IMO what I just wrote is not what I have thought (admired) about you, and just need you to set me straight :)

Blessings to you, and to yours

Doug
 

Levolor

New member
Doug/Livelystone,

My apologies for not explaining my single word post, but will now do so. :)

My Amen was in response to Lazy Afternoon's posting of scripture.

Now, as for what you have posted below, could you direct me to the post you are referring to as I have not seen it?

Again, my apologies for not having been clear that my response was in regard to Lazy Afternoon's post and caused confusion.

Thank you for your blessings and may you and yours also be as blessed.



iIguess I need some help in what (or who) you are saying amen too, because IMO you and I have been on same page over several subjects now

So I am thinking maybe I am not reading you correctly?

Does this mean in your opinion all those compassionate atheists who are the main supporters of the largest charities in the world supporting many of the worlds unfortunates who without the love, compassion, and generosity of these atheists for their fellow mankind, are therefore getting credit for having faith with works even though they do NOT believe in God?

Maybe I lost the place of who you are agreeing too, because IMO what I just wrote is not what I have thought (admired) about you, and just need you to set me straight :)

Blessings to you, and to yours

Doug
 

patrick jane

BANNED
Banned
The book of James say a lot about you John.


Jas 1:26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.


Jas 1:19 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath:
Jas 1:20 For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.
Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

Jas 4:11 Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.
Jas 4:12 There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?

Jas 3:1 My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.
Jas 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.
Jas 3:3 Behold, we put bits in the horses' mouths, that they may obey us; and we turn about their whole body.
Jas 3:4 Behold also the ships, which though they be so great, and are driven of fierce winds, yet are they turned about with a very small helm, whithersoever the governor listeth.
Jas 3:5 Even so the tongue is a little member, and boasteth great things. Behold, how great a matter a little fire kindleth!
Jas 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
Jas 3:7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:
Jas 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.
Jas 3:9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.
Jas 3:10 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.
Jas 3:11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
Jas 3:12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh.
Jas 3:13 Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom.
Jas 3:14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
Jas 3:15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
Jas 3:16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

Jas 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

good post. i did what i did for a reason. unorthodox, i admit. no envy here, though, and no grand plan of hiding a multitude of sins, or saving anyone's soul from death. Jesus Christ did that. we can all benefit from the book of James. La, do you know any MAD pentecostals ? - :patrol:
 

Arsenios

Well-known member
The book of James say a lot about you John.


Jas 1:26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.


Jas 1:19 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath:
Jas 1:20 For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.
Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

Jas 4:11 Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.
Jas 4:12 There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?

Jas 3:1 My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.
Jas 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.
Jas 3:3 Behold, we put bits in the horses' mouths, that they may obey us; and we turn about their whole body.
Jas 3:4 Behold also the ships, which though they be so great, and are driven of fierce winds, yet are they turned about with a very small helm, whithersoever the governor listeth.
Jas 3:5 Even so the tongue is a little member, and boasteth great things. Behold, how great a matter a little fire kindleth!
Jas 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
Jas 3:7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:
Jas 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.
Jas 3:9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.
Jas 3:10 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.
Jas 3:11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
Jas 3:12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh.
Jas 3:13 Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom.
Jas 3:14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
Jas 3:15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
Jas 3:16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

Jas 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Very sweet post...

Arsenios
 

Arsenios

Well-known member
Does this mean in your opinion all those compassionate atheists who are the main supporters of the largest charities in the world supporting many of the worlds unfortunates who without the love, compassion, and generosity of these atheists for their fellow mankind, are therefore getting credit for having faith with works even though they do NOT believe in God?
Doug

Above MY pay grade...

We will be judged according to our actions...

I am persuaded that, at the dread and Last Judgement, there will be atheists far ahead of me in the line of Salvation...

I was an atheist my first 36 years...

Arsenios
 

patrick jane

BANNED
Banned
Very sweet post...

Arsenios

LA avoids me. people call her - him, i don't know. but never a clear answer. politician type responses at times. so, are you orthodox. what ? where ? is that your real picture ? i like your St. Arsenios post. first, i thought you were smug, now i see some very good and also witty posts. people don't like that. or truth - :nono:
 

Arsenios

Well-known member

I went and read your really good post, and did not notice you dealing with what to me is core in James [IAKOVOS], which is this:

James 2:22
βλεπεις οτι η πιστις συνηργει τοις εργοις αυτου
You are seeing that the faith (of him) was synergizing with the works of him

και
AND...

εκ των εργων η πιστις ετελειωθη
out of the works the faith was made perfect

To put it into better and a little less wooden English:

You are seeing that (his) faith was co-working with his works,
and out of (his) works was (his) faith perfected.


This is very much at odds with most western Protestant theology,
because most are loathe to concede that one's faith
is brought to maturity in the works of faith that one does...

The works of faith mature the faith of a person...
Without the works of faith, faith is stillborn...
With the works if faith, faith grows and matures...

Everyone KNOWS this instinctively...
Most DENY it theologically...

Arsenios
 

Arsenios

Well-known member
LA avoids me. people call her - him, i don't know. but never a clear answer. politician type responses at times. so, are you orthodox. what ? where ? is that your real picture ? i like your St. Arsenios post. first, i thought you were smug, now i see some very good and also witty posts. people don't like that. or truth - :nono:

I do go some over the edge on occasion, but try to retract and apologize when indicated... But mostly I just seek to talk normally about matters theologic as they impact the practice of the Faith Christ died to establish upon this earth...

Beautiful are the feet of those who walk in the Way of the Lord!

Yes, I am Orthodox...

PM me for where...

Arsenios is my name and my Saint...

The pic is of Fr. Kristiansen, a Russian Monk, featured with others in a book titled: "Everyday Saints"...

They lived through the Communist atheist persecutions of the last century...

And are VERY rare souls indeed...

Their stories will give you courage and hope and awe...

Nothing quite like Saints in persecutions...

Arsenios
 

patrick jane

BANNED
Banned
I do go some over the edge on occasion, but try to retract and apologize when indicated... But mostly I just seek to talk normally about matters theologic as they impact the practice of the Faith Christ died to establish upon this earth...

Beautiful are the feet of those who walk in the Way of the Lord!

Arsenios

mine are stinky. not - so really, what's your claim to fame ? sorry. i didn't read. you answered already
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
LA avoids me. people call her - him, i don't know. but never a clear answer. politician type responses at times. so, are you orthodox. what ? where ? is that your real picture ? i like your St. Arsenios post. first, i thought you were smug, now i see some very good and also witty posts. people don't like that. or truth - :nono:

Sometimes I might avoid a post or poster, but just so you know how it is with me, I write this.

I am a man, married, great grandchildren, and in the church I can not speak of publically, and living thousands of miles away from you.


I have known the Lord personally for 50 years who speaks to me often, especially when treated badly by other people, most of whom are religious of one kind or another who do not like be questioned on their beliefs.

People of the general world treat me with more respect and more fairly than religious people.

I only visit the board from time to time, (sometimes too long) read a lot of posts, give my point of view and then do other things.

So I could easily miss your posts, as well as avoid speaking about things I know nothing about, or are not for me to comment on.

I know you have a good heart and I am glad to have known you to some degree that I have.

LA
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
The book of James say a lot about you John.


Jas 1:26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.


Jas 1:19 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath:
Jas 1:20 For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.
Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

Jas 4:11 Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.
Jas 4:12 There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?

Jas 3:1 My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.
Jas 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.
Jas 3:3 Behold, we put bits in the horses' mouths, that they may obey us; and we turn about their whole body.
Jas 3:4 Behold also the ships, which though they be so great, and are driven of fierce winds, yet are they turned about with a very small helm, whithersoever the governor listeth.
Jas 3:5 Even so the tongue is a little member, and boasteth great things. Behold, how great a matter a little fire kindleth!
Jas 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
Jas 3:7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:
Jas 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.
Jas 3:9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.
Jas 3:10 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.
Jas 3:11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
Jas 3:12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh.
Jas 3:13 Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom.
Jas 3:14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
Jas 3:15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
Jas 3:16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

Jas 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Thanks!!! Coming from a Christ rejector, I take that as a compliment, child of the devil!!
 
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