Deaths from gunfire USofA

The Berean

Well-known member
The fact you have to ask the question is proof positive you would never accept an answer.

Well, there you go again, delusionally thinking you know what I think. Must be tough having the ability to read other people's minds, right? My question wasn't directed at you, anyway. The reason I asked the question is because I genuinely want to understand what solutions other people have.
 

Truster

New member
Well, there you go again, delusionally thinking you know what I think. Must be tough having the ability to read other people's minds, right? My question wasn't directed at you, anyway. The reason I asked the question is because I genuinely want to understand what solutions other people have.

I don't need to read your mind your past history is proof positive.
 

The Berean

Well-known member
You aren't interested in genuine discussion. I say something, you mock it, I say something else, you call me evil for being a liberal and we all go home exactly as we are now. Let's just skip it and I will wait for someone interested in genuine discussion. :up:

Excuse me? When did I ever call you or liberals in general evil? Until today I don't believe you and I have ever had any direct conversations on TOL. Perhaps, you are confusing me with someone else? :idunno:
 

PureX

Well-known member
Ok, now we are getting somewhere. Can you link to the thread(s) with your solutions. I'd like to read them. :up:
No, I'm not going to bother. There are too many of these threads for me to remember.

The solution is to license gun ownership and use similar to the way we license motor vehicle ownership and use. The goal of which is not to deny a citizen's right to own or use firearms, but to sensibly regulate such ownership and use for the safety and security of society as a whole.

But the gun nuts will accept no further regulation of any kind, for any reason, even though the regulations we have now are almost completely useless, and many thousands of Americans die each year because of it.
 

The Berean

Well-known member
No, I'm not going to bother. There are too many of these threads for me to remember.

The solution is to license gun ownership and use similar to the way we license motor vehicle ownership and use. The goal of which is not to deny a citizen's right to own or use firearms, but to sensibly regulate such ownership and use for the safety and security of society as a whole.

But the gun nuts will accept no further regulation of any kind, for any reason, even though the regulations we have now are almost completely useless, and thousands of American die each year because of it.

Ok, now that is a reasonable solution and I agree with that. :up: I would add firearms safety training to that as well.
 

PureX

Well-known member
Ok, now that is a reasonable solution and I agree with that. :up: I would add firearms safety training to that as well.
Yes, just as we have to take driver's training to drive a motor vehicle, we should have to take weapons training to own deadly weapons. And just as we have to take proficiency tests, both practical and written, to obtain a license to operate motor vehicles at various levels and degrees of expertise and risk, so too we should have to prove our proficiency to achieve various levels of weapons ownership licensing.

If you want to carry a pistol on your hip like a cop, you should have to be just as proficient as any cop at how and when you can and cannot take it out and fire it, and at hitting your target without hitting bystanders. And you'd better be willing to wear a body-cam with your pistol, and be willing to accept liability if you screw up. Because that's what the cops are going to have to do, soon enough.

But if you want to use a rifle or shotgun for hunting, you certainly would not have to go through that much training. Mostly, you'd just need to know safety and wildlife hunting laws and procedures. And register your firearms, of course.

If you want assault weapons, you should be able to show why you need them. Which I doubt most people could. But they should be allowed with a special license for those who have a real need of them.

It's simple reason, really. The idea is that we want to keep the guns away from the people who are likely to abuse them: drunks, drug addicts, ragers, brawlers, stalkers, criminals, the mentally unstable, blind people, etc.,. It's not rocket science. A good system could be set up, but first we have to topple the sacred cow of the NRA. And the insanity that has been spawned by it.
 

Rusha

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
No, I'm not going to bother. There are too many of these threads for me to remember.

The solution is to license gun ownership and use similar to the way we license motor vehicle ownership and use. The goal of which is not to deny a citizen's right to own or use firearms, but to sensibly regulate such ownership and use for the safety and security of society as a whole..

I don't see a problem with that. I would even add that anyone with a past that includes a criminal history of violence should be denied.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
Yes, just as we have to take driver's training to drive a motor vehicle, we should have to take weapons training to own deadly weapons. And just as we have to take proficiency tests, both practical and written, to obtain a license to operate motor vehicles...

i wouldn't disagree with that much

why not extend the concept to voting?
 

gcthomas

New member
Yes, just as we have to take driver's training to drive a motor vehicle, we should have to take weapons training to own deadly weapons. And just as we have to take proficiency tests, both practical and written, to obtain a license to operate motor vehicles at various levels and degrees of expertise and risk, so too we should have to prove our proficiency to achieve various levels of weapons ownership licensing.

If you want to carry a pistol on your hip like a cop, you should have to be just as proficient as any cop at how and when you can and cannot take it out and fire it, and at hitting your target without hitting bystanders. And you'd better be willing to wear a body-cam with your pistol, and be willing to accept liability if you screw up. Because that's what the cops are going to have to do, soon enough.

But if you want to use a rifle or shotgun for hunting, you certainly would not have to go through that much training. Mostly, you'd just need to know safety and wildlife hunting laws and procedures. And register your firearms, of course.

If you want assault weapons, you should be able to show why you need them. Which I doubt most people could. But they should be allowed with a special license for those who have a real need of them.

It's simple reason, really. The idea is that we want to keep the guns away from the people who are likely to abuse them: drunks, drug addicts, ragers, brawlers, stalkers, criminals, the mentally unstable, blind people, etc.,. It's not rocket science. A good system could be set up, but first we have to topple the sacred cow of the NRA. And the insanity that has been spawned by it.

Also, fix the criminal justice system to encourage criminals to be unarmed.

It would need police to be better than they seem to be right now to make more efforts to de-escalate rather than push an emotional or disturbed to violence that could have been avoided. This is key - if criminals think that will get shot anyway, they will feel the need to be armed.

Increase the differential in sentencing for those heavily armed/lightly armed/unarmed, so that carrying a gun might seem more risky for those habitually getting arrested.

Limit access to assault weapons, concealable weapons and those that are more lethal, such as high velocity ammunition. Householders would be better off with shotguns, for example.

As gun ownership and criminal use declines, restrict carrying rights, so guns become household defence, then reduce from there. The fewer householders who feel the need to be armed, the fewer career criminals who will need to be armed.

Destroy all confiscated firearms, instead of selling them on, to reduce the black market of untraceable weapons. Register all firearms and require licenses, testing and reasons.

Try the first step, then move down the list as confidence improves.
 

The Berean

Well-known member
You just posted one.

I see productive discussion is not your strong suite. Let's review here. I asked Q to post a solution to the large number of gun deaths in America. Then you jumped in and responded that I don't want a solution. But I wasn't talking to you in the first place. Then you went on some silly rant about how you know me. So if you want to have a productive discussion then by all means lets have a productive discussion. But if you just want to be a jackass then that it is also your perogative to emabarrass youself. I have been on TOL for over 12 years. The long time TOLer's know I am reasonable person about 99.9% of the time. It's your move.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
If you want assault weapons, you should be able to show why you need them.


you do realize, don't you, that what's called an "assault weapon" is just a semi-auto rifle with some scary-looking features, right?

they're not machine guns
 

The Berean

Well-known member
Yes, just as we have to take driver's training to drive a motor vehicle, we should have to take weapons training to own deadly weapons. And just as we have to take proficiency tests, both practical and written, to obtain a license to operate motor vehicles at various levels and degrees of expertise and risk, so too we should have to prove our proficiency to achieve various levels of weapons ownership licensing.

If you want to carry a pistol on your hip like a cop, you should have to be just as proficient as any cop at how and when you can and cannot take it out and fire it, and at hitting your target without hitting bystanders. And you'd better be willing to wear a body-cam with your pistol, and be willing to accept liability if you screw up. Because that's what the cops are going to have to do, soon enough.

But if you want to use a rifle or shotgun for hunting, you certainly would not have to go through that much training. Mostly, you'd just need to know safety and wildlife hunting laws and procedures. And register your firearms, of course.

If you want assault weapons, you should be able to show why you need them. Which I doubt most people could. But they should be allowed with a special license for those who have a real need of them.

It's simple reason, really. The idea is that we want to keep the guns away from the people who are likely to abuse them: drunks, drug addicts, ragers, brawlers, stalkers, criminals, the mentally unstable, blind people, etc.,. It's not rocket science. A good system could be set up, but first we have to topple the sacred cow of the NRA. And the insanity that has been spawned by it.

I agree with all of this. :up:
 

Quetzal

New member
Excuse me? When did I ever call you or liberals in general evil? Until today I don't believe you and I have ever had any direct conversations on TOL. Perhaps, you are confusing me with someone else? :idunno:
I apologize Berean, for whatever reason I thought you were GM. My fault! :shut:
 
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