ECT why don't you say the Our Father?

[turbosixx]

AND JUST WHAT WAS THE RSULT OF THEM FOLLOWING JESUS' INSTRUCTIONS INSO FAR AS THEY HAD NO IDEA WHAT THE CONCLUSION OF THE RESULT WOULD BE? THEREFORE, THEIR OBEDIENCE WOULD NOT ONLY LEAD TO THEM INTO THE NEW CHRIST CENTERED TERRITORY OF THE PENTECOSTAL EXPERIENCE; THE "COMING UPON" OF THE HOLY SPIRIT AND THAT BY IT, 3000 PEOPLE WOULD BE CONVERTED AND ADDED TO THE CHURCH THAT HAD BEGUN IN JOHN 20:22! IN OTHER WORDS, IT WAS THE POWER OF GOD THAT COULD ONLY PERFORM IT!

GET MY POINT NOW??

Yes, I believe we are in agreement. Jn 20:22 is after Jesus offered himself to God as I had said. That is when he became Lord and Christ and his kingom was established. All the faithful of old were added at that time, then on Pentecost is when it was first proclaimed and man for the first time had a chance to repsond to the gospel.

Luke 24:46 and He said to them, "Thus it is written, that the Christ would suffer and rise again from the dead the third day, 47and that repentance for forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in His name to all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem.

 

[turbosixx]

this tells me that His kingdom already existed

what does it tell you?

It tells me your seeing what you want and not applying reason and logic as you have said. Why would he pray "thy kingdom come" if it was already in existance?

In your understanding, when was it established?

36Therefore let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made Him both Lord and Christ-this Jesus whom you crucified."

When was he made Lord and Christ?

 

[chrysostom]

It tells me your seeing what you want and not applying reason and logic as you have said. Why would he pray "thy kingdom come" if it was already in existance?

In your understanding, when was it established?

36Therefore let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made Him both Lord and Christ-this Jesus whom you crucified."

When was he made Lord and Christ?

when Jesus says
My kingdom is not of this world

do you know the meaning of 'is'?

 

[turbosixx]

when Jesus says
My kingdom is not of this world

do you know the meaning of 'is'?

Yes, he is describing his kingdom, that doesn't mean it has been established.

When he describes the kingdom in this parable, has it be established?

Mark 4:30 And He said, "How shall we picture the kingdom of God, or by what parable shall we present it? 31 It is like a mustard seed, which, when sown upon the soil, though it is smaller than all the seeds that are upon the soil, 32 yet when it is sown, it grows up and becomes larger than all the garden plants and forms large branches; so that the birds of the air can nest under its shade."

If it has, why did he pray "thy kingdom come"?

 

[chrysostom]

Yes, he is describing his kingdom, that doesn't mean it has been established.

When he describes the kingdom in this parable, has it be established?

Mark 4:30 And He said, "How shall we picture the kingdom of God, or by what parable shall we present it? 31 It is like a mustard seed, which, when sown upon the soil, though it is smaller than all the seeds that are upon the soil, 32 yet when it is sown, it grows up and becomes larger than all the garden plants and forms large branches; so that the birds of the air can nest under its shade."

If it has, why did he pray "thy kingdom come"?

thy kingdom come
is
nebulous

My kingdom is not of this world
is
not

do you know the meaning of 'is'?

 

[turbosixx]

thy kingdom come
is
nebulous

My kingdom is not of this world
is
not

do you know the meaning of 'is'?

"Eimi" is a verb of being, such as "is" or "am" or "are". If Jesus is not describing the nature of his kingdom but stating that it actually exist and has always existed, then please help me to reconcile these passages.

Future:
Dan. 2:44 In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom
Matt. 10:7 And as you go, preach, saying, 'The kingdom of heaven is at hand.'

Past:
Col 1:13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

I agree that God has always been king over his kingdom, so what does all this mean?

 

[chrysostom]

I agree that God has always been king over his kingdom, so what does all this mean?

it means
His kingdom is available to us
we can get there
but
we have to do our part

 

[Cross Reference]

Yes, I believe we are in agreement. Jn 20:22 is after Jesus offered himself to God as I had said. That is when he became Lord and Christ and his kingom was established. All the faithful of old were added at that time, then on Pentecost is when it was first proclaimed and man for the first time had a chance to repsond to the gospel.

Luke 24:46 and He said to them, "Thus it is written, that the Christ would suffer and rise again from the dead the third day, 47and that repentance for forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in His name to all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem.

You are too confused to receive anything at this time. Try reading the Bible again __ for the first time. Come again when you have questions about entering the kingdom of God as the violent, who take it by force.

 

[turbosixx]

it means
His kingdom is available to us
we can get there
but
we have to do our part

I agree we have to do our part. When did it become available to us?

 

[chrysostom]

I agree we have to do our part. When did it become available to us?

do you say the apostles creed?

I believe in God, the Father Almighty, Creator of Heaven and earth;
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son Our Lord,
Who was conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried.
He descended into Hell; the third day He rose again from the dead;
He ascended into Heaven, and sitteth at the right hand of God, the Father almighty; from thence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy Catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body and life everlasting.
Amen.

few wonder why He descended into hell

it was to get all the good souls who lived and died before Him

few understand this
no one was saved prior to this
they had to wait

to answer your question
it was available shortly after He died

 

[genuineoriginal]

why don't you say the Our Father?

it has come to our attention
that
many here do not say the Lord's prayer
and
I am sure others would like to know why

why don't you tells us why?

Since I have never been to confessional, I have never been assigned the abuse of the Our Father prayer as penance.

Matthew 6:7 7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.​

However, that does not mean that I do not pray the prayer that Jesus gave as an example of how we should pray.

Matthew 6:9 9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.​

 

[turbosixx]

do you say the apostles creed?

I believe in God, the Father Almighty, Creator of Heaven and earth;
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son Our Lord,
Who was conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried.
He descended into Hell; the third day He rose again from the dead;
He ascended into Heaven, and sitteth at the right hand of God, the Father almighty; from thence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy Catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body and life everlasting.
Amen.

few wonder why He descended into hell

it was to get all the good souls who lived and died before Him

few understand this
no one was saved prior to this
they had to wait

to answer your question
it was available shortly after He died

I do not say the apostles creed. I haven't seen it in the bible.

I agree no one was saved before his sacrifice, because the blood of animals can not forgive sins. Here is another reference to his trip to hades. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit. 19 After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— 20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built.

I agree, after his perfect sacrifice.

 

[Cruciform]

I do not say the apostles creed. I haven't seen it in the bible.

Sure you have, right here.

 

[DAN P]

Since I have never been to confessional, I have never been assigned the abuse of the Our Father prayer as penance.

Matthew 6:7 7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.​

However, that does not mean that I do not pray the prayer that Jesus gave as an example of how we should pray.

Matthew 6:9 9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.​

Hi and the reason you were never told , is because YOU or they might turn to Judaism , THEN the " Our Father " might make sense , especially during the Great Tribulation !!

dan p

 

[genuineoriginal]

Hi and the reason you were never told , is because YOU or they might turn to Judaism , THEN the " Our Father " might make sense , especially during the Great Tribulation !!

dan p

The great tribulation has been going on since 70 CE, but it will end soon.

 

[DAN P]

The great tribulation has been going on since 70 CE, but it will end soon.

Hi and sorry you did not stay with the OP as I have not seen the 12 apostles sitting on 12 Thrones , the Jews back in the LAND and the book of the Revelation being fulfilled , so just tell me what verse you are talking about ??

So you know it will end SOON , so how SOON !!

DAN P

 

[DAN P]

The great tribulation has been going on since 70 CE, but it will end soon.

Hi and sorry you did not stay with the OP as I have not seen the 12 apostles sitting on 12 Thrones , the Jews back in the LAND and the book of the Revelation being fulfilled , so just tell me what verse you are talking about ??:bang:

DAN P

 

[genuineoriginal]

Hi and sorry you did not stay with the OP as I have not seen the 12 apostles sitting on 12 Thrones , the Jews back in the LAND and the book of the Revelation being fulfilled , so just tell me what verse you are talking about ??

If you knew what the scriptures say about the great tribulation, you would know that the 12 apostles do not sit on the 12 thrones during the great tribulation, the Jews are exiled from the land during the great tribulation, and that only the first five seals of Revelation make up the great tribulation, which ends on the sixth seal.

 

[God's Truth]

It tells me your seeing what you want and not applying reason and logic as you have said. Why would he pray "thy kingdom come" if it was already in existance?

In your understanding, when was it established?

36Therefore let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made Him both Lord and Christ-this Jesus whom you crucified."

When was he made Lord and Christ?

Jesus was always Lord and Christ.

John 6:69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.

 

[God's Truth]

You said "this program has reason, logic, meaning, and purpose", I'm not sure how you could come to that conclusion from applying that to scripture.

The Kingdom had a beginning and I believe it was upon Jesus offering himself to God.

Dan. 2:44 In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom which will never be destroyed, and that kingdom will not be left for another people; it will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, but it will itself endure forever. 45Inasmuch as you saw that a stone was cut out of the mountain without hands

I haven't seen anyone disagree that "those kings" refer to the Roman Empire which was in control when Jesus lived.

Jn. 18:36 Jesus answered, "My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, then My servants would be fighting so that I would not be handed over to the Jews; but as it is, My kingdom is not of this realm."

It's a spiritual kingdom.

Jesus prayed "thy kingdom come" because he had a hard road ahead and had to suffer. After his sacrifice, God gave him all authority therefore he is our king and high priest and he is ruling over his kingdom now.

We have God's kingdom inside us when we drink Jesus' blood and eat his flesh; we are then given the Holy Spirit. That is when we enter the realm of the Spirit. We are seated with Christ, even while we are living on this earth.

"He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son," Colossians 1:13