toldailytopic: Is belief in the trinity necessary for salvation?

[meshak]

*
The trins are mighty and numerous

Trins are numerous but they are not mighty at all with their witness. There is no ways you can be mighty without being obedient to Jesus.

because God always intended to save the multitudes, many will come and many have come

You are numerous because you have been attracting them with half truth without telling them responsibility as His servants. Lip serving will not save, friend.

 

[oatmeal]

That does not mean that his nature is greater than all. His personhood is greater than all but not nature. The nature is the same in character with the Son and Spirit, 1 John 5:20, Acts 5:4. You don't understand the difference between person and nature and that is why you are currently a damned heretic.

Ooo! a damned heretic! Not just a heretic, but a damned one!

I know God will like that! Are you going to forbid that speak or teach in the name of Jesus Christ?

God is greater than all. Do you know what that means?

It means that God is greater than all.

That is why Jesus Christ had no problem with being subordinate to God, because God is greater than Jesus Christ.

In some characteristics, all believers, including Jesus Christ are equal to God, because of God's love and grace and mercy to believers, including Jesus Christ.

God is greater than all.

oatmeal

 

[oatmeal]

The same nature as humans have now. In the genus of being Adam's nature consisted of a hypostatized rational faculty and a physical human body with all tendency toward righteousness. This original righteousness is not something essential to him but natural in the sense that it was the tendency in which man was created.

OOOO! look at all his big words!

You must be educated.

OOOooooo!

Acts 4:13

"Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus."

God is spirit, God is invisible, Jesus Christ is not, because that is why they could see and touch Jesus.

Jesus Christ is not God.

It is maybe too simple for your "educated" mind to comprehend.

God's word is that simple, I think that is why so many trins miss the simple truths. They think truth has to be complicated.

oatmeal

 

[oatmeal]

*
The Logos was made flesh and we beheld his glory as of the Father, full of grace and truth....the law came from Moses but grace and truth came from Jesus Christ.

Here John identifies Jesus Christ as the Logos who was in the beginning with God and who was God and who made all things.

Only a very decietful person would deny it. YOU are that deceitful one

Totton,

The Logos was made flesh and we beheld his glory as of the Father,

God's word, his words in Genesis 3:15 became flesh, the promised seed of the woman became flesh.

God's word, his words in Isaiah 53 became flesh, his sufferings happened like God had the prophet Isaiah and others prophecy about.

God's word, his words in Micah 5:2 became flesh, Jesus Christ was born in Bethlehem of Judah, and he came to be a ruler to God's people. But God's people rejected him and crucified him. Just like God's word said would happen. God's word came to pass. As it always does.

God's word becomes flesh, some times inspite of men's unbelief, some times because people believe. Mary believed, she had a human for a son, not spirit. God is spirit

You are boring me.

full of grace and truth....the law came from Moses but grace and truth came from Jesus Christ.

So are you saying the Jesus is God because grace an truth came by him? The law came by Moses, there fore Moses must be god. In truth, that is what God says of him in Exodus 7:1, now you will have to change the name of your doctrine to include Moses. Quadnity? Father and Son and Holy Spirit and Moses.

Am I decietful? or deceitful? or both? maybe I have a dual nature?

Man is created in God's image, therefore man must be God.

After all Hebrews 1:3,

"Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high: "

says Jesus is the image of God, and you use that to prove Jesus is God.

so how many men are there? Over six billion.


Your count of the quadnity is off by way over six billion.

Six billion and four nity?

Start using your brain cells. You have them for a reason.

You do not use them.

We, who do use our brains, can see the falsehood of the trinity very easily.

How was Jesus in the beginning with God?

Jesus' gennesis, his birth, his origin is given in Matthew 1:18

Until God created the heavens and the earth, there was no heavens and earth. that is the gennesis of the heavens and earth, its creation.

Jesus Christ's beginning point, his gennesis is described in Matthew 1:18

oatmeal/ fiber for the mind.

 

[Lon]

OOOO! look at all his big words!

You must be educated.

OOOooooo!

Acts 4:13

"Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus."

God is spirit, God is invisible, Jesus Christ is not, because that is why they could see and touch Jesus.

Jesus Christ is not God.

what? I'm sick and having a hard time following, yet this makes absolouely no sense at all? Good grieff!

It is maybe too simple for your "educated" mind to comprehend.

God's word is that simple, I think that is why so many trins miss the simple truths. They think truth has to be complicated.

oatmeal

 

[oatmeal]

Look, Lon has nothing to say!

God is good.

God stopped the mouth of the lion Lon.

I am safe!

oatmeal

 

[Lon]

Look, Lon has nothing to say!

God is good.

God stopped the mouth of the lion Lon.

I am safe!

oatmeal

Well. As a I said I'm sick. Really sick at the moment. I get these bouts with bronchitus where I'm out of it. at the same time, I think you'd have a bit to say in my absense and it is is sad what progressesses, what you have to say when I'm not always althogether here. Jesus is God and youn miss it. (maybe wait until I'm not on nyquill?) even so, I don't think you get a lot of attention.) I probably shoudn't type on Nyquill, that's for sure.

 

[oatmeal]

Well. As a I said I'm sick. Really sick at the moment. I get these bouts with bronchitus where I'm out of it. at the same time, I think you'd have a bit to say in my absense and it is is sad what progressesses, what you have to say when I'm not always althogether here. Jesus is God and youn miss it. (maybe wait until I'm not on nyquill?) even so, I don't think you get a lot of attention.) I probably shoudn't type on Nyquill, that's for sure.

Psalm 103:3

I Peter 2:24

 

[Lon]

Look, Lon has nothing to say!

God is good.

God stopped the mouth of the lion Lon.

I am safe!

oatmeal

I hate being sick! Medicine leaves me less then adequate. Maybe someone will come and defend me or take my place. I am so sick right now. ickkk, just pray for me/love me at the moment, this is terrible! you know how cold medicine affects the brain.

 

[meshak]

It is maybe too simple for your "educated" mind to comprehend.

God's word is that simple, I think that is why so many trins miss the simple truths. They think truth has to be complicated.

oatmeal

I dont think they even know what they are talking about. They are just parroting what they have been taught by their organization.

 

[Lon]

I haven't a clue why I type when I'm sick. I think it's therapueutic or something.

I"ll let ya know when I'm back. When I have bronchitus.......not reallly here....

 

[meshak]

I haven't a clue why I type when I'm sick. I think it's therapueutic or something.

I"ll let ya know when I'm back. When I have bronchitus.......not reallly here....

I hope you get well very soon.

Now go to sleep.

 

[sky.]

I hate being sick! Medicine leaves me less then adequate. Maybe someone will come and defend me or take my place. I am so sick right now. i, just pray for me/love me at the moment, this is terrible! you know how cold medicine affects the brain.

Get some rest Lon so you can feel better. God is in control of His Kingdom.

 

[oatmeal]

I dont think they even know what they are talking about. They are just parroting what they have been taught by their organization.

Having been a 'trin' for a short time, I don't want to disgrace them but shake them as to wake them.

There are times, I am sure, I come across really rude, but the angel smote Peter to wake him up. He must have been tired.

Acts 12:7

Rebuking them sharply may be the need.

Thanks for coming back to the arena.

Lions and tigers and bears, oh my!

Your presence is appreciated.

oatmeal

 

[meshak]

Having been a 'trin' for a short time, I don't want to disgrace them but shake them as to wake them.

There are times, I am sure, I come across really rude, but the angel smote Peter to wake him up. He must have been tired.

Acts 12:7

Rebuking them sharply may be the need.

Thanks for coming back to the arena.

Lions and tigers and bears, oh my!

Your presence is appreciated.

oatmeal

First time when I became His servant, I did not even know anything about the trinity doctrine, but when I realize how they have been using this doctrine to slander non-trins, I just dont trust their sincerity of their faith. Their doctrines are all centered in popularity to get peoples' approval and getting more members and power from the beginning of their history.

 

[eameece]

Yes.

John 8:24 24 Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

There is no He in the greek in this verse, it literally says If you do not believe that I AM, you will die in your sins.

I AM is the name for God given to moses when moses asked God who to tell the hebrew people, sent him to them.

Exodus 3:14 4 God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’”

Later in John 8:58 Christ says this:

58 Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

Jesus directly called Himself the same I AM speaking to moses.

So yes, according to Christ Himself, you must believe that He is God, or you will die in your sins.

The I AM is the same I AM in all of us. "Sin" is forgetting that.

 

[eameece]

The essence of man is rationality. A proportional image of God.

Define "rationality"

I think some of the postings on TOL would "disprove" that famous idea.

First of all, a definition of "man" leaves out half of humanity. Some "definition."

Reason is one faculty among others of humans. That is not a definition.

Humans are infinite and unfathomable, just as God is.

 

[Drake Shelton]

Ooo! a damned heretic! Not just a heretic, but a damned one!

I know God will like that! Are you going to forbid that speak or teach in the name of Jesus Christ?

God is greater than all. Do you know what that means?

It means that God is greater than all.

That is why Jesus Christ had no problem with being subordinate to God, because God is greater than Jesus Christ.

In some characteristics, all believers, including Jesus Christ are equal to God, because of God's love and grace and mercy to believers, including Jesus Christ.

God is greater than all.

oatmeal

You avoided everything I said. You can't answer me because my doctrine is the orthodoxy of the scriptures and the holy fathers.

 

[Drake Shelton]

eameece

Define "rationality"

Reason, thinking.

Reason is one faculty among others of humans. That is not a definition.

Wrong. The mind is the faculty. You are confusing the faculty with the mode of the faculty.

Humans are infinite and unfathomable, just as God is.

Asserting it does not prove it.

 

[godrulz]

Wrong on all counts. Read the original nicene creed. It says, "of the essence". Not "the ONE same nature" or the one substance. Nicene Creed teaches generic unity not numeric unity. The nicene creed teaches 3 beings, 3 things. The one God is the Father-auto-theos. The other two extend from the One God;'s nature and are subordinate, not at the level of nature but at the level of person. You believe in only one person. It is sabellian heresy.

I do not believe in modalism. Essence=nature=substance=being. The creed does not say it all and is subject to interpretation. It does not read 3 beings, but 3 personal distinctions. Read the Athanasian creed for even greater clarity (google it).