This 'Generation' Shall Not Pass Away Till All Be Fulfilled

musterion

Well-known member
Man I can't think of a better way to explain it to ya.
But I'll try.

It is in the subjunctive mood because the phrase, standing alone, does not convey the condition/stipulation.
Only the additional info following the subjunctive gives the condition/stipulation.

To use some examples you gave earlier .... (and I will color code them)
Might you eat some spinach?
Were I to eat spinach, I would get sick.
Should I get sick, I would not be able to go to work.
If you were unable to go to work, you would not be paid.


In the first one - no additional info (condition/stipulation) is given, so the possibilities of what will happen when/if you eat spinach are left open.
Might get sick and might not.
Standing alone, the phrase is left wide open as to the possibilities.

In the next 3, additional info follows the subjunctive so it now has a condition/stipulation and is no longer left wide open as to the possibilities.


Were I to eat spinach, [if left alone, this phrase has no condition and is left wide open for possibilities] I would get sick. [this additional info does give a condition and therefore modifies the red subjunctive phrase]

The green additional info modifies the uncertainty of the red phrase.


Not trying to be dense (it comes naturally) but that leaves me back where I started. If His point was that "this generation" would not pass UNLESS and UNTIL all those things had been fulfilled (which I already believed) then the "this generation" cannot have passed since all those things have not yet been fulfilled. Which would preclude preterism, which for me is the most important thing here...these things certainly were not fulfilled in 70 AD, but they will be.
 

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
Which translation isn't correct, the KJ or the one I posted? Not arguing, just asking.

I don't believe that the KJV is correct because the way that the word "generation" is used. The first century generation did not see all of the things come to pass.

I cannot understand what the translation which you provided says so therefore I am not equipped to pass judgmemt on it.
 

musterion

Well-known member
I don't believe that the KJV is correct because the way that the word "generation" is used. The first century generation did not see all of the things come to pass.

Agreed.

I cannot understand what the translation which you provided says so therefore I am not equipped to pass judgmemt on it.

Young's is interesting...

Verily I say to you, this generation may not pass away till all these may come to pass.

Young evidently recognized the conditionality of an [itself untranslated] and tried drawing it out with may.

This page has a neat note I hadn't noticed before. Hover on an and a popup says 'with-the-prerequisite.' To me, that makes sense....that generation would not pass away with the prerequisite that all those things had come to pass. The fact that they didn't means that that generation cannot have passed away. That generation will someday see these things come to pass.

So who does that leave us for options on who that generation was/is/will be? Since Israel as a nation did cease to exist (and some would say still does not exist as such), I see only two.

a. Believing Jews, the circumcision

b. Unbelieving Jews

Since there is now neither Jew nor Gentile in Christ, I have to assume He meant unbelieving Jews, who have exited all along and have never been wiped out, OR the Jews of God's renewed dealings with Israel (yet future).
 
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intojoy

BANNED
Banned
What passage, son?

“Now from the fig tree learn her parable: when her branch is now become tender, and putteth forth its leaves, ye know that the summer is nigh; even so ye also, when ye see all these things, know ye that he is nigh, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all these things be accomplished. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.”
**Matthew‬ *24:32-35‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/mat.24.32-35.asv
 

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
“Now from the fig tree learn her parable: when her branch is now become tender, and putteth forth its leaves, ye know that the summer is nigh; even so ye also, when ye see all these things, know ye that he is nigh, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all these things be accomplished. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.”
**Matthew‬ *24:32-35‬ *ASV‬‬

I take it that you are referring to the word "ye"?

Earlier the same day the Lord Jesus used the same pronoun "ye" in regard to those who were not members of the then present generation but instead will belong to a future generation:

"For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord" (Mt.23:39).​

Earlier His disciples had indeed said,"Blessed is He that cometh in the name of the Lord" (Mt. 21:9) so if we are to believe the words of the Lord Jesus then at some time in the future there will be some Jews belonging to a future generation who will say those words. And the Lord used the pronoun "ye" to refer to those who will belong to a future generation.

With that fact established we can understand that the word "ye" in the following verse can refer to Jews belonging to a future generation. Therefore the prounoun can be in reference to not only the Israelites living in the then present generation but also to all of Israelites throughout time:

"So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This family shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled"
(Mt.24:33,34).​
 
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