The Trinity

[Rosenritter]

That's statistically speaking of course. I don't care what the statistics say when I know a thing to be true, and God is the Trinity. You and all different subtle difference non-Trinitarians are wrong, wrong, and wrong. Because your message is bad news. It means that the Church that Jesus built, somewhere along the line, completely failed utterly, and the gates of hell prevailed against her, and that's horrible news Gt, but no non-Trins care about that, but you should, because in the absence of overwhelming interest in conspiracy theories, people choose to believe the good news, when they have a choice between believing the good news, or believing the bad news.

If we are Christians, then our faith should be in Christ, rather than in that any particular leader or group think might be inerrant.

Matthew 16:15-18 KJV
(15) He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
(16) And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
(17) And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
(18) And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

1 Corinthians 10:4 KJV
(4) And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

Revelation 1:18 KJV
(18) I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Christ is the Rock and Jesus has the keys of death and hell, and it was against him that the gates of hell did not prevail.

Pick any church association or any individual person, regardless of their title or titles, and they are going to have something "wrong." That isn't a catastrophe, because our faith shouldn't be placed in anything less than our High Priest, the mediator between God and men, Christ Jesus.

If your faith is based on that one particular church is inerrant in respect to a doctrine formulated over several hundred years, a doctrine that goes beyond what Christ and his apostles chose to specifically teach and reveal, then you are building your faith on something other than the Rock.

Matthew 7:24-27 KJV
(24) Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
(25) And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
(26) And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
(27) And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

It is not an epic tragedy if the Catholic church doesn't have everything 100% right. Nor is it an epic tragedy if you or me or other people don't have things 100% right in every aspect. The important things are spelled out clearly, not models or theories that we have to build for ourselves or repeat verbatim with mindless recitation from creeds. Through faith in God and Christ, his grace and forgiveness of sins covers errors in understanding, and if something is so very important to know, he can tell us when we see Him face to face.

And again, a good man might err in many things, and not be damned; so that his error were not directly against the promises that are in Christ’s blood, neither that he held them maliciously, ... and though all be false, yet should I not be damned, so long as I had no obstinacy therein: for the faith that I have in Christ’s blood should swallow up that error, till I were better taught.

 

[God's Truth]

No, Jesus talking to already SAVED and already BELIEVERS:

They didn't have the Holy Spirit yet, and they would not, if they did not keep obeying.

So many ways you all want to twist the truth. No one will get out of obeying, no matter how much they try.

the Comforter that the Father will send because I will pray the Father, He (the Comforter/Holy Spirit) will teach you all thing... He (the Comforter/Holy Spirit) will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment....He (the Comforter/Holy Spirit) will abide with you forever...

When you pick and choose only the verses that acquiesce to your doctrine, it shows the incompleteness of your doctrine.

John 8:31 Then Jesus said to those Judeans who had believed him, "If you continue to follow my teaching, you are really my disciples.

John 14:23 Jesus replied, "Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them.

 

[God's Truth]

He comforts those who are saved.

Those who are saved are those who obeyed. See Acts 5:32.

Not one scripture can be put aside, so don't even think about it.

 

[God's Truth]

Pretty much. You must retain some of the rosary you learned to pray when you were younger, all that's in the Creed.

It is in the Bible, and it is written plainly.

 

[Rosenritter]

I'm sorry I don't agree, many call themselves priests, many say that they are washed from their sins and don't live accordingly, look at what many priests etc. have been up to with children. They are not priests of God. A true man of God is made so by the power of the Holy Spirit, and you will know those who are washed in the blood of Christ by their lives, because they will be like him.

Many people profess to belong to God, but their lives and mouths show us otherwise. Those who are Christ's have Christ with them, and if Christ is with them, in and through them, then they are covered in his blood, and if their sins are truly washed away, then their lives will be changed and their old life gone and they will be walking in the Spirit in a new and living way by the will of God, not caring for the things of this world, and putting God first in their lives and truly following Jesus and bringing that love of God and life of Christ to others. Not only with lip service, but in their lives also, as they will be living it out, they are not proud, and haughty, but lowly and humble and they are servants not masters, it's the word that comes from that gives them the power, as it's from God. And their sins and flesh will be dying, put to death by the Spirit and they will be alive in God, born anew, into a new and living way, worshipping God in Spirit and in truth.

These are God's true church and Christ is their head and God is their heart and they love them with their all.

I grant that it is possible for someone to thwart what God would have them be. If this should happen, it is his prerogative to fashion it into something else or destroy it as unworthy.

Jeremiah 18:2-4 KJV
(2) Arise, and go down to the potter's house, and there I will cause thee to hear my words.
(3) Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold, he wrought a work on the wheels.
(4) And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.

If we are washed in Christ's blood and cleansed in his forgiveness of sins, we should be responsive to the hand of the potter, and be fashioned as he wills.

 

[God's Truth]

Your user account name is offensive.

I am sure God's Truth is offensive to you.

I'm sure I don't know what you mean by "that," but of course you can say whatever you want about whomever you want. lain:
It's your non-Trintarianism that's bitter, Gt. It's a miserable story if the Church hasn't already got the Trinity right, right from the start. It's apocalyptic. End of days censored. I prefer good news to bad news, and usually the case for bad news being true is overwhelming, but in this case, with the Trinity, the case for the bad news being true is not even a "more likely than not likely" judgment, let alone the gold standard "beyond all reasonable doubt" judgment.

That's statistically speaking of course. I don't care what the statistics say when I know a thing to be true, and God is the Trinity. You and all different subtle difference non-Trinitarians are wrong, wrong, and wrong. Because your message is bad news. It means that the Church that Jesus built, somewhere along the line, completely failed utterly, and the gates of hell prevailed against her,

How can the gates of Hell keep IN the Catholic church when it was never there?

Think about it, you don't know enough so you should stop trying to preach and teach.

 

[lifeisgood]

They didn't have the Holy Spirit yet, and they would not, if they did not keep obeying.

So many ways you all want to twist the truth. No one will get out of obeying, no matter how much they try.

John 8:31 Then Jesus said to those Judeans who had believed him, "If you continue to follow my teaching, you are really my disciples.

John 14:23 Jesus replied, "Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them.

You, gt, are willfully, boastfully, knowingly, vehemently searing your own mind picking verses out of its original context parroting your doctrine.

 

[God's Truth]

Perhaps I am repeating something someone has already said in this thread so far, but I'll say it anyway. Jesus said in Matt. 28:19KJV, "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost;..."

There is only ONE God, ONE Jesus, and ONE Holy Ghost. I believe in the Trinity!! I don't really care if you don't agree with my deduction or not. I'm not trying to be mean or uppity. It is just how I believe. Believe what you want to. I just have that in my relationship with God, Jesus, and someone whom has been visited by the Holy Ghost three times, most recently a few days ago!! I can tell the real Holy Spirit from Satan's version of it also, so don't think I was deceived whatsoever. I could tell you other secrets, but I refrain from saying them to ears that won't hear.

Much Love In God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit!!

Michael

The trinity doctrine is false. Check out more carefully what the Catholics want to teach you; Catholics and many others.

 

[God's Truth]

You, gt, are willfully, boastfully, knowingly, vehemently searing your own mind picking verses out of its original context parroting your doctrine.

Prove it.

 

[lifeisgood]

So many ways you all want to twist the truth. No one will get out of obeying, no matter how much they try.

The only one accusing the brethren of such libel is you, gt.

Even you, gt, the one who so boastfully boasts of obeying ALL of Jesus' commandments HAVE NEVER OBEYED TO BE SAVED. Not even you, oh, boastful one. Because when one asks you, gt, 'did you gt, did you do this commandment of Jesus?' What is your answer, gt? 'Oh, no that one commandment was not for me, but I, gt, boastfully, vehemently declare that I, gt, obey ALL of Jesus' commandments, but you guys don't.'

Even AFTER you say boastfully, arrogantly declaring that you, gt, OBEYED ALL of Jesus' commandments TO BE SAVED, you then turn around and say 'Nah, but not that one. Nah, that other one either. But I, gt, OBEY ALL of Jesus' commandments.'

You are searing — literally “cauterizing” — your own mind, gt with your own two little hands.

 

[God's Truth]

The only one accusing the brethren of such libel is you, gt.

Even you, gt, the one who so boastfully boasts of obeying ALL of Jesus' commandments HAVE NEVER OBEYED TO BE SAVED. Not even you, oh, boastful one. Because when one asks you, gt, 'did you gt, did you do this commandment of Jesus?' What is your answer, gt? 'Oh, no that one commandment was not for me, but I, gt, boastfully, vehemently declare that I, gt, obey ALL of Jesus' commandments, but you guys don't.'

Even AFTER you say boastfully, arrogantly declaring that you, gt, OBEYED ALL of Jesus' commandments TO BE SAVED, you then turn around and say 'Nah, but not that one. Nah, that other one either. But I, gt, OBEY ALL of Jesus' commandments.'

You are searing — literally “cauterizing” — your own mind, gt with your own two little hands.

No, lifeisgood, no scripture anywhere does Jesus tell us we no longer have to obey.

 

[lifeisgood]

Prove it.

I don't have to prove it, you are doing it yourself with your own two little hands, for all those who have eyes to see. You are literally “spiritually scar tissuing” your own mind with your vehement desire and practice of plucking verses out of its literal original context and demanding that others do the same.

God forbid that I should obey such a one as you. I choose to obey my Lord and my Savior Jesus Christ who said, 'Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.' Nothing there about UNbeliever OBEY and then I, Jesus, will give you rest.

Be careful not to boastfully, vehemently want to be counted with the ones the Lord says: Hebrews 3:11 - So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.

Don't forget the Lord said: Hebrews 4:3 - For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Hebrews 4:5 - And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

 

[God's Truth]

I don't have to prove it, you are doing it yourself with your own two little hands, for all those who have eyes to see. You are literally “spiritually scar tissuing” your own mind with your vehement desire and practice of plucking verses out of its literal original context and demanding that others do the same.

God forbid that I should obey such a one as you. I choose to obey my Lord and my Savior Jesus Christ who said, 'Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.' Nothing there about UNbeliever OBEY and then I, Jesus, will give you rest.

Be careful not to boastfully, vehemently want to be counted with the ones the Lord says: Hebrews 3:11 - So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.

Don't forget the Lord said: Hebrews 4:3 - For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Hebrews 4:5 - And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

lol

 

[lifeisgood]

No, lifeisgood, no scripture anywhere does Jesus tell us we no longer have to obey.

You arrogant, smug, conceited, pompous, presumptuous, egotistical, proud, puffed up, self-important, stuck up one who says you have OBEYED ALL of Jesus’ commandments and then when asked, says, ‘no, not that one. That one either.’

You, gt, have NEVER OBEYED not even ONE of Jesus’ commandments, much less, obeyed ALL of Jesus’ commandments TO BE SAVED for He has never asked you to OBEY TO BE SAVED. He has asked you, gt, to BELIEVE TO BE SAVED.

And, no gt, I am not insulting you, YET.

And please don’t bring your usual, ‘you are insulting me’ veneer to the table because it will be thrown in the garbage.

And, YES, you are searing, cauterizing, your own mind with your own two little hands, and no one is helping you, by plucking verses out of its literal original context and parroting your doctrine.

 

[lifeisgood]

lol

Rejecter of God's Truth, smugly, proudly, presumptuously using 'God's Truth' as her banner.

One who takes God's Truth out of its literal original context and parrots your doctrine, searing, cauterizing, your own mind with your own two hands, with nobody's help, while many here have been warning you, continuously, lovingly, patiently, sometimes even forcefully, of the peril you have chosen to place yourself in and because WE STILL CARE we keep on warning, however, there will be a day when the Lord is going to say, 'Do not pray for this people nor offer any plea or petition for them; do not plead with me, for I will not listen to you.'

You arrogant, smug, conceited, pompous, presumptuous, egotistical, proud, puffed up, self-important, stuck up one who says you have OBEYED ALL of Jesus’ commandments and then when asked, says, ‘no, not that one. That one either.’

 

[Veritas veritate]

The Trinity

Hiya and thanks for replying, although I'm in some agreement, I see it a bit differently, the finished work of Christ is the setting up of the gospel and bringing us a new and living way, ready to reconcile all those who believe in the ministry of reconciliation to God. He was about his father's business from the age of 12. And when he started preaching, he healed and saved, and he said that the father had given him work to finish

The finished work is not the setting up of the Gospel, for the gospel is Jesus Christ. Salvation has been given to all men: however, the salvation given to all men (reconciliation, justification to life) is not the same salvation (preservation, forgiveness of sins, sealing of the Holy Spirit) that one is given upon acknowledging and having faith that Christ is the Savior). I find that too many do not know or see that there are two different words translated as "saved" throughout the New Testament. Since I am at work using my phone, I am not able to present each word to you, but I trust that you have the means to search and see for yourself.

But salvation is through faith by the grace of God.

Yet, which is it that actually grants salvation? Is it granted BY the grace of God from where the gift of salvation originates? Or Is it granted BY the faith we have which is the conduit through which it is received?

This I don't agree with you here, once we are saved, we are to obey God. And if we don't obey God and live by his will then we can be cut off, this is shown in many verses in the New testament, we are to carry on in his goodness.

Once we are sealed by the Holy Spirit we WILL obey God, because we will be a new creation: loving what He loves and hating what He hates.
Christ's continual intercession for us to the Father is what sustains our salvation, not our obedience.

If we turn away from God once we have known him, then we are putting our flesh before him and we are no longer being saved.

It is impossible to turn away from God once we have known Him. "Eternal" life is to know God and Jesus whom he has sent. If we turn away from God, it is because we do not know him to begin with, no matter how many good works and obedience have been performed. (See Hebrews chapter 6)

God won't leave his Spirit with those who choose the way of the devil. The flesh and world are of the devil, if we choose to live by the will of them then we can't expect God to stay with us. God won't be mocked!

Amen to the first sentence! However, since the flesh and the world are "of the devil" as you put it, it is implied that if we choose to live by the will of them, we never accepted the Gospel of Jesus Christ or have known God to begin with...

We have to obey from the beginning, the first word Jesus spoke when be began to preach was repent, straight away he gives us an option, repent or not. We have choices from the start, believe or not, repent or not, follow or not and obey and do the will of God, or not.

We have to obey from the beginning of what? If it is to obtain salvation, it must be from the beginning of our lives, never falling a single time until our death. We know this to be impossible. Moreover, in order for us to have the ability to obey, we had to have been given life before hand. Since God is immutable, and everything in the physical is a type of the spiritual, why do we think that spiritual birth is any different than our physical birth? If we need to be given physical life before we can do anything physically, it follows that we must also need to be given spiritual life before we can do anything spiritually. It is impossible for us to please God outside of the imputed righteousness of Christ.

God is love, and those who truly follow him will have their hearts filled with his love, and God's goodness, mercy, forgiveness and love will be seen in and through them. This is the life of Christ in God's children, his true church.

Amen, but all of the above is because God has given the life of Christ in God's children, not to sustain the life of Christ in God's children.



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[lifeisgood]

The trinity doctrine is false. Check out more carefully what the Catholics want to teach you; Catholics and many others.

The Trinity/Triunity of God is NOT a RCC invention.

The Bible clearly spells out for all who have eyes to see that Father, Son, Holy Spirit is the Trinity/Triunity of God.

That is if you have not plucked out your own eyes so that you can neither physically see much less spiritually see searing, literally cauterizing, your own mind in the process.

 

[Veritas veritate]

The Trinity

I don't think you know that is why you do not talk about it.

Nice try...

Did you obey anything your parents, teachers, boss, the law says?

Why can't you tell me how we can obey without first being given the life to do so?


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[Veritas veritate]

At that time the RCC did not even exist yet.

Could you provide from the New Testament

• the papacy;
• worship/adoration of Mary;
• the immaculate conception of Mary;
• the perpetual virginity of Mary;
• the assumption of Mary;
• Mary as co-redemptrix and mediatrix;
• petitioning saints in heaven for their prayers,
• apostolic succession,
• the ordinances of the RCC functioning as sacraments,
• infant baptism,
• confession of sin to a priest,
• purgatory,
• indulgences,
• the equal authority of church tradition and Scripture;
• praying to dead people

You forgot limbo, and it's abolishment. Nobody knows where the babies went...


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[Nihilo]

Well pops is right as that is the revelation that Peter had from the father.

Matthew 16

And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

The Bible's not the teacher's edition, or the answer key. Anybody can "prove" whatever they want from Sacred Scripture. That's because it's not the answer key, or the teacher's edition.

And pops isn't a moron!

Then why act like a moron?