The Trinity

[popsthebuilder]

And I explained that to you. But since you require more, you can ponder this. Why did Job repent if he was so perfect?

Job. 42:6 Wherefore I abhor myself, and repent in dust and ashes.





He deceived pharaoh, and told Sarah to claim she was his sister instead of his wife.

Gen. 12:11-13 And it came to pass, when he was come near to enter into Egypt, that he said unto Sarai his wife, Behold now, I know that thou art a fair woman to look upon: Therefore it shall come to pass, when the Egyptians shall see thee, that they shall say, This is his wife: and they will kill me, but they will save thee alive. Say, I pray thee, thou art my sister: that it may be well with me for thy sake; and my soul shall live because of thee.​

He died in the faith. Heb. 11:13 These all died in faith,... Genesis 5:23 "And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years"



:chuckle:



We'll see, shall we?



You poor soul. You go against scripture all the time, and you hate to be corrected, too.



Don't be a hypocrite with that false gratitude.

Job: 42. 3. Who is he that hideth counsel without knowledge? therefore have I uttered that I understood not; things too wonderful for me, which I knew not. 4. Hear, I beseech thee, and I will speak: I will demand of thee, and declare thou unto me. 5. I have heard of thee by the hearing of the ear: but now mine eye seeth thee. 6. Wherefore I abhor myself, and repent in dust and ashes. 7. And it was so, that after the LORD had spoken these words unto Job, the LORD said to Eliphaz the Temanite, My wrath is kindled against thee, and against thy two friends: for ye have not spoken of me the thing that is right, as my servant Job hath. 8. Therefore take unto you now seven bullocks and seven rams, and go to my servant Job, and offer up for yourselves a burnt offering; and my servant Job shall pray for you: for him will I accept: lest I deal with you after your folly, in that ye have not spoken of me the thing which is right, like my servant Job.


Abraham did instruct his wife to say she was his sister out of fear for for his own life. He was corrected and did repent of such.

Enoch did not die.

You are misinterpreting the scripture.

If you would like I can show you the verses that say he was lifted up to GOD and did not ever witness death. I can reinforce this plain truth written in scripture with the book of Enoch if you like. And before you say it isn't in the bible, please do consider that it is actually in the Coptic Ethiopian Bible.

Show me to be wrong and I will gladly admit it.

You've only shown your own pride here so far.

Taking singular verses out of their original context to suite your vanity is called cherry picking, and I won't even entertain it.

 

[popsthebuilder]

I know.
I didn't disagree with that.

Because the sacrificial animal was also called "perfect".

Exodus 12:5 KJV
(5) Your lamb shall be without blemish, תּמיםa male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats:


The same word scripture uses for:


Genesis 17:1 KJV
(1) And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect תּמים.




And yet there needed to be a "better" sacrifice than the "perfect" animal sacrifice.
So, if the animal was "perfect" in the westernized definition of "as good as can possibly be, nothing better", then there was no need for another sacrifice because nothing can be better than perfect.
But in scripture we read that those "perfect" sacrificial animals could never take away sin, and therefore there needed to be a BETTER sacrifice than those PERFECT animal sacrifices.
Meaning that in scripture there can be something BETTER than PERFECT.


In like manner, we have the old covenant law being described as good and holy.
And yet, it was faulty and needed a better covenant.

Hebrews 8:7 KJV
(7) For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

I agree.

The flaw of their sacrifice is that it wasn't of themselves.

 

[popsthebuilder]

"It"?
This is what I've been talking about.
You just can't make stuff up as suits your fancy. If it isn't supported in scripture, it isn't right.


John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Nor are you addressing the verse I posted.

So what was your point exactly?

I'm sorry I missed it.

 

[God's Truth]

Hey, Bright Raven,

Congratulations on a wonderful and successful Thread!! You picked just the RIGHT SUBJECT!!

There is God the Father, there is Jesus the Son, and there is the Holy Ghost of God. Three all in One. They are all three the Trinity. See Matt. 28:19KJV. Tell me what you see. What did Jesus prompt us to do?? Get with the Program.

Jesus is God's Son. They are two different beings, but also One in Spirit. And the Holy Ghost is One in Spirit. There are three beings, but also One in Spirit. Get it now?? Who did Jesus pray to when He was on the cross: His Father, God. He was not praying to Himself, so they are two different beings. Who did God refer to when He said, "Let US make man in OUR image." Who was God talking to except Jesus.

You'll find out when you go to Heaven.

This of course, is not for you Bright Raven. I'm just making a comment to everyone here.

I Thank God For Your Thread, BR!!

Michael

You call yourself a prophet after saying that?

Do you not know God the Father is Spirit?

Do you not know Jesus is the Spirit?

There is only one Spirit, it proves that they are three and the same.

 

[God's Truth]

Job: 42. 3. Who is he that hideth counsel without knowledge? therefore have I uttered that I understood not; things too wonderful for me, which I knew not. 4. Hear, I beseech thee, and I will speak: I will demand of thee, and declare thou unto me. 5. I have heard of thee by the hearing of the ear: but now mine eye seeth thee. 6. Wherefore I abhor myself, and repent in dust and ashes. 7. And it was so, that after the LORD had spoken these words unto Job, the LORD said to Eliphaz the Temanite, My wrath is kindled against thee, and against thy two friends: for ye have not spoken of me the thing that is right, as my servant Job hath. 8. Therefore take unto you now seven bullocks and seven rams, and go to my servant Job, and offer up for yourselves a burnt offering; and my servant Job shall pray for you: for him will I accept: lest I deal with you after your folly, in that ye have not spoken of me the thing which is right, like my servant Job.


Abraham did instruct his wife to say she was his sister out of fear for for his own life. He was corrected and did repent of such.

Enoch did not die.

You are misinterpreting the scripture.

If you would like I can show you the verses that say he was lifted up to GOD and did not ever witness death. I can reinforce this plain truth written in scripture with the book of Enoch if you like. And before you say it isn't in the bible, please do consider that it is actually in the Coptic Ethiopian Bible.

Show me to be wrong and I will gladly admit it.

You've only shown your own pride here so far.

Taking singular verses out of their original context to suite your vanity is called cherry picking, and I won't even entertain it.

Hi pops,

glorydazed has so many false teachings and ways about her that it is normal to see one go after her. However, I do want to say that Abraham made a mistake by having a child with Hagar;and, he did tell his wife to hide the fact she was his wife... I would also like to say that Enoch did not experience death. He did not have to experience his physical body dying, but it does not mean his physical body went to heaven. There was only one man who went to heaven with his physical body, Jesus.

There are people who are called perfect and pleasing to God. They are called those things because they had a heart to do what God said to do, and they did do what God said to do, and when they did make a mistake, they repented of that sin.

Glorydazed says we do not have to do what Jesus says to do because he was not speaking to us but rather to the Jews. That nonsense goes against having a heart for God. She also goes against the truth that we have to repent of our sins. She takes away from the truth that doing what God says is how to please Him and be a person after God's own heart.

 

[God's Truth]

So... What's your problem?


I can refer to GOD as "IT" of I so choose.

I'm not declaring GOD be limited to the image of GOD or a person or three people.

If you've got a problem with that then state it and support it with scripture not cherry picked to suite your agenda.

It isn't that you can't see my points.

It's that you refuse to allow yourself to not be deceived by your own pride. Of course you can't even see this as you haven't researched yourself to any real end.

If you start to admit to yourself, the things plainly stated in scripture then your faith only crap goes right out the window along with some other things.

Hi pops,

I do not think it is appropriate to call the Holy Spirit 'It'. The Holy Spirit is called a 'he' in the scriptures. We are our spirit, and if only in our spirit, we would be called 'he' or 'she'.
I also believe that we cannot refer to the Father as a Mother too. If God wanted us to refer to Him as Mother, would there not be scriptures revealing that to us?

 

[God's Truth]

I agree.

The flaw of their sacrifice is that it wasn't of themselves.

No that is not the flaw of the sacrifice. How can it be the flaw of the sacrifice when God said to sacrifice animals? The sacrifice of animals was to make one outwardly clean. It was a teaching tool and shadow of Jesus, for Jesus is the Lamb and his blood cleans us inside and outside.

God required of the people to do animal sacrifices. However, God did not like it that they would sin, do a righteous act like give a blood offering but not really be sorry for their sins. Giving a blood offering and not really be sorry for your sin was like giving a filthy rag offering.
One still had to give the blood offering though. Jesus is the last offering once and for all. Now someone has to actually repent of their sins to be cleaned, to use the blood of the Lamb.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Hi pops,

I do not think it is appropriate to call the Holy Spirit 'It'. The Holy Spirit is called a 'he' in the scriptures. We are our spirit, and if only in our spirit, we would be called 'he' or 'she'.
I also believe that we cannot refer to the Father as a Mother too. If God wanted us to refer to Him as Mother, would there not be scriptures revealing that to us?

That is a good point. But I personally find that the One Creator GOD of all existence and creation can not and should not be limited to any sexualities.

That being said, I personally, could refer to GOD as IT or HE or SHE or whatever other term I so choose as long as it is a term of utter respect and honor between me and GOD.

Can you show me where in the bible we are instructed to refer to GOD, even the Spirit, as man, or woman (he/ she).

Please understand that the Bible was written when men where above women, and held all power; unto the extent to even when I was in grammar school it was politically correct to refer to an asexual, or one in whom you didn't perceive the sexuality of, as "he".

I don't care about political correctness to any extent. So, I do hope that you understand me when I say my reference to GOD almighty is between Us ( they being the Capital U of course), and I ask again, with pointed yet neutral pleas; do provide scripture saying explicitly that we are to consider and refer to GOD almighty as a he/ man.

Isaiah: 56. 8. The Lord GOD which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather others to him, beside those that are gathered unto him. 9. All ye beasts of the field, come to devour, yea, all ye beasts in the forest. 10. His watchmen are blind: they are all ignorant, they are all dumb dogs, they cannot bark; sleeping, lying down, loving to slumber. 11. Yea, they are greedy dogs which can never have enough, and they are shepherds that cannot understand: they all look to their own way, every one for his gain, from his quarter. 12. Come ye, say they, I will fetch wine, and we will fill ourselves with strong drink; and to morrow shall be as this day, and much more abundant.

Evidently these words aren't for you? Is that your logic? Surely not.

2 Kings: 20. 18. And of thy sons that shall issue from thee, which thou shalt beget, shall they take away; and they shall be eunuchs in the palace of the king of Babylon.

Daniel: 2. 11. And it is a rare thing that the king requireth, and there is none other that can shew it before the king, except the gods, whose dwelling is not with flesh. 31. Thou, O king, sawest, and behold a great image. This great image, whose brightness was excellent, stood before thee; and the form thereof was terrible. 32. This image's head was of fine gold, his breast and his arms of silver, his belly and his thighs of brass, 33. His legs of iron, his feet part of iron and part of clay. 34. Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces. 35. Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth. 37. Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory. 38. And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold. 39. And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee, and another third kingdom of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth. 40. And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise. 41. And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay. 42. And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken. 43. And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay. 44. And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever. 45. Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter: and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure.

(busy, be back later to finish. Please respond anyway)

 

[marhig]

1 Corinthians: 15. 20. But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. 21. For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 22. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

(I agree with what you say in reference to 1 Corinthians 11

Matthew: 28. 18. And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 19. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20. Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

(I see here that all was given to the Christ and is now His. Concluding to me that there is no need of division between Christ (Spirit) and GOD (Spirit) as far as mans perceptions are concerned.)

Revelation: 3. 4. Thou hast a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy. 5. He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. 6. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches. 8. I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name. 9. Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. 10. Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. 11. Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. 12. Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name. 13. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches. 15. I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. 16. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. 17. Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: 18. I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. 19. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. 20. Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. 21. To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne. 22. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.


(and again; while there is obvious division to be made between the temple of GOD and GOD in fullness, this doesn't correlate a division of spirit to me, and indeed shows the common denominator is indeed the Singular Spirit, while the dividing line is indeed the vessel with limited capacity.

peace dear friend and sister.

We are not against one another, but learning and terrifying one another.

Please continue in your perseverance and patience towards us; each and everyone.

I know you will.

Of course we're not against each other

But still, I can't see from those verses how Jesus is the father. Sorry.

 

[marhig]

By saying GOD can't do things in any way whatsoever because it isn't readily conceivable to the human mind.

I don't think I said that pops?

 

[marhig]

Jesus is God come as a Son of Man in the flesh.

Jesus did have to be obedient and he did.

He remained in his Father's love because he obeyed.

John 15:10 If you obey my commandments, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commandments and remain in his love.

Well if he remained in his father's love because he obeyed, then he isn't the father.

 

[marhig]

Jesus is explaining that what he says and does is from God the Father.

Look at other scriptures where Jesus says he is doing the Father's work.

John 6:38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me.

John 4:34 Jesus explained, "My food is to do the will of Him who sent Me and to finish His work.


Jesus is explaining that he did not come as a Man to live as a man, i.e. get married, have children, make a home, and acquire wealth.

So if what Jesus says comes from God the father, and that he's doing his father's work, then he's not the father.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Of course we're not against each other

But still, I can't see from those verses how Jesus is the father. Sorry.

Oh.... My stance is a hard one to explain.

It isn't that Jesus was the Father, but that the Spirit of the Father was synonymous with the Spirit that filled the temple (Jesus). I do not claim that the temple is greater than the substance there of, or the offering greater than the altar.

I do claim, however, that now, at this time, and forever more, that Christ(the Spirit of GOD) is synonymous with the fullness of GOD as far as any mere mortal can tell and should conclude.

peace sister.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Do you see how you are borderline limiting the capacities of an all powerful all knowing Spirit to fit into limited comprehension?

I do agree that we cannot witness the utter fullness of GOD though.

You say that the Spirit cannot be the FATHER because the FATHER cannot both encompass all, and too send out HIS Spirit.

Yet GOD is indeed all encompassing and in all and all exist through IT, so how then do you justifiably limit HIM?

peace, sorry for the blunt, to the point approach; but I am busy and the time for tarrying about is so beyond past.

I have been teetering to be honest, though I do apologize for seeming to be against you.

These minor differences we do see are surely for our benefit and the benefit and sake of all.

and again;

peace

 

[marhig]

Oh.... My stance is a hard one to explain.

It isn't that Jesus was the Father, but that the Spirit of the Father was synonymous with the Spirit that filled the temple (Jesus). I do not claim that the temple is greater than the substance there of, or the offering greater than the altar.

I do claim, however, that now, at this time, and forever more, that Christ(the Spirit of GOD) is synonymous with the fullness of GOD as far as any mere mortal can tell and should conclude.

peace sister.

Ah right, so do you now believe that Christ is the father, now that he's in heaven? Or that he is equal to the father now he is in heaven, or that he is equal to the father and is God?

Sorry I'm just trying to understand what you believe.

Thanks

 

[popsthebuilder]

Ah right, so do you now believe that Christ is the father, now that he's in heaven? Or that he is equal to the father now he is in heaven, or that he is equal to the father and is God?

Sorry I'm just trying to understand what you believe.

Thanks

I believe now that they are indeed singular in Spirit at this time and forever more, and when He does enter in the remnant, very great and terrible will that day be.

The body being now the men and women that make up the congregation of the faithful to GOD alone, are indeed in subjection to GOD though in HIS time will they bring forth even greater things than are recorded to date.

 

[popsthebuilder]

No that is not the flaw of the sacrifice. How can it be the flaw of the sacrifice when God said to sacrifice animals? The sacrifice of animals was to make one outwardly clean. It was a teaching tool and shadow of Jesus, for Jesus is the Lamb and his blood cleans us inside and outside.

God required of the people to do animal sacrifices. However, God did not like it that they would sin, do a righteous act like give a blood offering but not really be sorry for their sins. Giving a blood offering and not really be sorry for your sin was like giving a filthy rag offering.
One still had to give the blood offering though. Jesus is the last offering once and for all. Now someone has to actually repent of their sins to be cleaned, to use the blood of the Lamb.

It has always been a sacrifice of purity for the sake of creation, not the sacrifice of creation for the sake of your impurity.

Sacrifice is of self.

 

[marhig]

I believe now that they are indeed singular in Spirit at this time and forever more, and when He does enter in the remnant, very great and terrible will that day be.

The body being now the men and women that make up the congregation of the faithful to GOD alone, are indeed in subjection to GOD though in HIS time will they bring forth even greater things than are recorded to date.

Ah right, no I believe differently, I don't believe that Christ and the father are the same spirit, although they are one, as in they have the same nature, full of love, mercy and forgiveness. And those who are truly born of God are at one with them, only not in the fullness that Jesus had the spirit, because we still sin and live by the will of our flesh, we are led by Satan and love our flesh before we know God, but I believe that once we know God, and the more we turn from sin and obey God, the stronger we become in the Spirit and he helps us to overcome our flesh and this world through Christ Jesus and the stronger we then become in God and the world should mean nothing to us.

Jesus never sinned, he never fell for satan's temptations, so he had full power of the Spirit, and he was in the fullness of God bodily, but I believe that God is so much more and I believe that we couldn't comprehend him fully with us being human in this flesh. I also believe that the father is over everything, but he has given Christ full rule in the heavens and in earth.

 

[God's Truth]

Well if he remained in his father's love because he obeyed, then he isn't the father.

He came as a Son. When God the Father came as a Man, He had to obey God the Father.

 

[God's Truth]

So if what Jesus says comes from God the father, and that he's doing his father's work, then he's not the father.

God came as a Son of Man. Why wouldn't he say he is doing the Father's work? You are merely denying and denial is not a defense of the truth.