The Late Great Urantia Revelation

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Caino

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Look HoW!.... Its very very Hard To HAVE a conversation with GOD!, aN, Oh! hOw very very Easy iT iS To Gossip about hIm!

Like :thumb:

The thousands of different doctrines which rely on the Bible fetish is a testament to how people tend to see what they want in the Bible.


Caino
 

Caino

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The earliest "fetish" was used to stand guard over primitive barter markets:


The Beginnings of Trade​



(775.1) 69:4.1 Just as marriage by contract followed marriage by capture, so trade by barter followed seizure by raids. But a long period of piracy intervened between the early practices of silent barter and the later trade by modern exchange methods.

(775.2) 69:4.2 The first barter was conducted by armed traders who would leave their goods on a neutral spot. Women held the first markets; they were the earliest traders, and this was because they were the burden bearers; the men were warriors. Very early the trading counter was developed, a wall wide enough to prevent the traders reaching each other with weapons.

(775.3) 69:4.3 A fetish was used to stand guard over the deposits of goods for silent barter. Such market places were secure against theft; nothing would be removed except by barter or purchase; with a fetish on guard the goods were always safe. The early traders were scrupulously honest within their own tribes but regarded it as all right to cheat distant strangers. Even the early Hebrews recognized a separate code of ethics in their dealings with the gentiles.


(775.4) 69:4.4 For ages silent barter continued before men would meet, unarmed, on the sacred market place. These same market squares became the first places of sanctuary and in some countries were later known as “cities of refuge.” Any fugitive reaching the market place was safe and secure against attack.

(775.5) 69:4.5 The first weights were grains of wheat and other cereals. The first medium of exchange was a fish or a goat. Later the cow became a unit of barter.

(775.6) 69:4.6 Modern writing originated in the early trade records; the first literature of man was a trade-promotion document, a salt advertisement. Many of the earlier wars were fought over natural deposits, such as flint, salt, and metals. The first formal tribal treaty concerned the intertribalizing of a salt deposit. These treaty spots afforded opportunity for friendly and peaceful interchange of ideas and the intermingling of various tribes.

(775.7) 69:4.7 Writing progressed up through the stages of the “message stick,” knotted cords, picture writing, hieroglyphics, and wampum belts, to the early symbolic alphabets. Message sending evolved from the primitive smoke signal up through runners, animal riders, railroads, and airplanes, as well as telegraph, telephone, and wireless communication.

(775.8) 69:4.8 New ideas and better methods were carried around the inhabited world by the ancient traders. Commerce, linked with adventure, led to exploration and discovery. And all of these gave birth to transportation. Commerce has been the great civilizer through promoting the cross-fertilization of culture.



Caino
 

Aimiel

New member
Look HoW!.... Its very very Hard To HAVE a conversation with GOD!, aN, Oh! hOw very very Easy iT iS To Gossip about hIm!
It's only hard if you've never had one. Once you do, you find out that it's not only easy but that you can do so ANY time you wish. God isn't mute, as most people assume. He has something timely to say to every soul, He simply isn't called upon or His answers aren't heard (mainly because they are rarely the answers that one is looking for or would suspect that God might say). He speaks, it takes a listening ear to hear.
 

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
free will & destiny.......

free will & destiny.......

One of the evils of the church is that it usurps authority and enforces man made doctrines which keep people in ignorance and fear.

The church has long used the false idea of bible perfection to control it's followers even when the bible has so many obvious flaws and contradictions. When those flaws are pointed out the "conspiracy theorist" double down and dig in even deeper into belief in a false history and false reality.


This is all related to Lucifer’s rebellion.


Caino

The UB's portrayal of the Lucifer Rebellion is interesting, in that free will was glorified but taken out of the bounds of purposeful wisdom and the eternal vision of souls in sacred service to the Father, in the marriage of wills, unto the ends of time. It prescribed its own liberties to 'self' above the greater good of all, where rightful submission to divine law and divinely appointed governors is the naturally ordained path to progress and true ascension in Spirit.

Whether one looks at this or any story as religious or cosmic mythos, the story still carries its teaching principles which correlate to our own experience, and the practice of true spiritual liberties in a rightful way. With the grant of free will, as far as that freedom of choice allows....we can choose all possible options which eventuate all possible destinies.


pj
 

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
Sleeping Subject = SS

Sleeping Subject = SS

Just like the followers of Jesus, those associated with the Urantia revelation had to throw out some of their most cherished, life long religious foundations as these new revelations were superior. Over the years they started to realize just how much their own beliefs were changed by this new information.

Oddly enough though, the "sleeping subject" who was the oracle of the revelation, remained indifferent, uninterested in the entire matter.


Caino

Interestingly, I wonder if we will ever know who the SS was. A theory assumed by one was that it could have been Egdar Cayce,...however his teachings advocated reincarnation which the UB dismisses. - the moral and ethical teachings however are very similar in principle. It remains to be seen if any more of the info. in the UB will bear out as true and valid supporting it as a true revelation-source for the coming generations.


pj
 

Charity

New member
It's only hard if you've never had one. Once you do, you find out that it's not only easy but that you can do so ANY time you wish. God isn't mute, as most people assume. He has something timely to say to every soul, He simply isn't called upon or His answers aren't heard (mainly because they are rarely the answers that one is looking for or would suspect that God might say). He speaks, it takes a listening ear to hear.

I think you mean Tasting God is as hearing! If talking sences, I'm talking about a voice, a conversation. :) you can't define a voice for him! Adam did!
 

Aimiel

New member
I think you mean Tasting God is as hearing! If talking (senses), I'm talking about a voice, a conversation. :) you can't define a voice for him! Adam did!
No, I mean having a conversation with Him. He isn't dead, as most people suppose. He isn't an 'idea' or myth. He is alive and wants to have a dynamic relationship with every soul alive.
 

Charity

New member
I feel the UB that the UB authors have felt that they have tasted the lord! An are certainly not saying Things as deadly as God said?
They are certainly observing taste without walking right up the throne an obstructing evolution of growth: an dictating the terms of search?
 

Caino

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I feel the UB that the UB authors have felt that they have tasted the lord! An are certainly not saying Things as deadly as God said?
They are certainly observing taste without walking right up the throne an obstructing evolution of growth: an dictating the terms of search?

True, you won't find doing any of the evil things the Bible authors claimed God did.


Caino
 

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
God can do what he wants?

God can do what he wants?

True, you won't find doing any of the evil things the Bible authors claimed God did.


Caino


And such is the paradox, a 'God' who is supposed to be the origin and essence of Goodness, allowing for the potential and de-struction of evil in the arising of creation and free will. But thats another chapter ;)

As far as the OT is concerned, where the God of Israel commands wholesale genocide,....well,....something to make your eyebrows raise........but then again, the excuse is 'God' can do as He pleases :rolleyes: :idunno:



pj
 

Caino

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And such is the paradox, a 'God' who is supposed to be the origin and essence of Goodness, allowing for the potential and de-struction of evil in the arising of creation and free will. But thats another chapter ;)

As far as the OT is concerned, where the God of Israel commands wholesale genocide,....well,....something to make your eyebrows raise........but then again, the excuse is 'God' can do as He pleases :rolleyes: :idunno:



pj

History was generally written by the survivors, the victors, so naturally their tactics are justified >in their minds< as superstitious people tend to see EVERYTHING, victory or defeat, feast or famine as coming from God.

1 Samuel 16:14 Now the Spirit of the LORD had departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the LORD tormented him.

When the elite Hebrew priest class edited, redacted and rewrote the OT books during the Babylonian captivity, they elevated themselves above the Gentile world based solely on arrogance and racial pride. They NEVER claimed to be writing for God, it's nowhere in those books but the religious authorities have consistently manipulated dues paying members of their respective social organizations by using the supposed divine authorship of these corrupt books as a basis for control.

But Jesus taught something radically different then the arrogant theology of the Jews, he preached and practised the idea that ALL men and women of the earth are Sons and Daughters of the living God. Jesus taught and demonstrated that God is good.


Caino
 

Caino

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Ecclesiastical jurisdiction

Ecclesiastical jurisdiction

Wikipedia:

Catholic canonical jurisdiction

General concept and classification

"The Church founded by Christ for the salvation of men needs, like every society, a regulating power (the authority of the Church). The Decree "Lamentabili sane", of 3 July 1907, rejects[1] the doctrine that Christ did not desire to found a permanent, unchangeable Church endowed with authority."​

more:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecclesiastical_authority

Jesus of the UB:


"The religions of authority can only divide men and set them in conscientious array against each other; the religion of the spirit will progressively draw men together and cause them to become understandingly sympathetic with one another. The religions of authority require of men uniformity in belief, but this is impossible of realization in the present state of the world. The religion of the spirit requires only unity of experience — uniformity of destiny — making full allowance for diversity of belief. The religion of the spirit requires only uniformity of insight, not uniformity of viewpoint and outlook. The religion of the spirit does not demand uniformity of intellectual views, only unity of spirit feeling. The religions of authority crystallize into lifeless creeds; the religion of the spirit grows into the increasing joy and liberty of ennobling deeds of loving service and merciful ministration."

more:
 

bucksplasher

New member
Wikipedia:

Catholic canonical jurisdiction

General concept and classification

"The Church founded by Christ for the salvation of men needs, like every society, a regulating power (the authority of the Church). The Decree "Lamentabili sane", of 3 July 1907, rejects[1] the doctrine that Christ did not desire to found a permanent, unchangeable Church endowed with authority."​

more:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecclesiastical_authority

Jesus of the UB:


"The religions of authority can only divide men and set them in conscientious array against each other; the religion of the spirit will progressively draw men together and cause them to become understandingly sympathetic with one another. The religions of authority require of men uniformity in belief, but this is impossible of realization in the present state of the world. The religion of the spirit requires only unity of experience — uniformity of destiny — making full allowance for diversity of belief. The religion of the spirit requires only uniformity of insight, not uniformity of viewpoint and outlook. The religion of the spirit does not demand uniformity of intellectual views, only unity of spirit feeling. The religions of authority crystallize into lifeless creeds; the religion of the spirit grows into the increasing joy and liberty of ennobling deeds of loving service and merciful ministration."

more:

The "religion of the spirit" allows black to be called white and visa versa. That's why they take no stand on abortion, or euthanasia and other real life issues.

When everyone is "right" something is wrong. tWINs

PS usually the only wrong accepted by "spirit" religions is saying something is wrong.
 

Caino

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The "religion of the spirit" allows black to be called white and visa versa. That's why they take no stand on abortion, or euthanasia and other real life issues.

When everyone is "right" something is wrong. tWINs

PS usually the only wrong accepted by "spirit" religions is saying something is wrong.

Yep, those who rejected and killed Jesus made pretty much the same human-minded argument.

Nowhere in the UB will you find an institutional pride that allows black to be called white or paedophiles to be retained as priest.

Faith in an institution, or a book isn't the same as living faith/trust in the indwelling spirit of God.


Caino
 

bucksplasher

New member
Yep, those who rejected and killed Jesus made pretty much the same human-minded argument.

Nowhere in the UB will you find an institutional pride that allows black to be called white or paedophiles to be retained as priest.

Faith in an institution, or a book isn't the same as living faith/trust in the indwelling spirit of God.


Caino

Nowhere in the teaching of the Church can you find pedophiles approved by this Church. tWINs

PS You can find misplaced hope in their reformation however.
 

Caino

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Nowhere in the teaching of the Church can you find pedophiles approved by this Church. tWINs

PS You can find misplaced hope in their reformation however.

Fair enough Bucksplasher, but had you read the book that you criticize then you would know what it says about honesty:


....."Falsehood is not a matter of narration technique but something premeditated as a perversion of truth. The creation of new pictures out of old facts, the restatement of parental life in the lives of offspring — these are the artistic triumphs of truth. The shadow of a hair’s turning, premeditated for an untrue purpose, the slightest twisting or perversion of that which is principle — these constitute falseness. But the fetish of factualized truth, fossilized truth, the iron band of so-called unchanging truth, holds one blindly in a closed circle of cold fact. One can be technically right as to fact and everlastingly wrong in the truth."


The religion of the spirit vrs the religion of authority


"The religion of the physical senses and the superstitious fears of natural man, the Master refused to belittle, though he deplored the fact that so much of this primitive form of worship should persist in the religious forms of the more intelligent races of mankind. Jesus made it clear that the great difference between the religion of the mind and the religion of the spirit is that, while the former is upheld by ecclesiastical authority, the latter is wholly based on human experience.


155:5.8 Until the races become highly intelligent and more fully civilized, there will persist many of those childlike and superstitious ceremonies which are so characteristic of the evolutionary religious practices of primitive and backward peoples. Until the human race progresses to the level of a higher and more general recognition of the realities of spiritual experience, large numbers of men and women will continue to show a personal preference for those religions of authority which require only intellectual assent, in contrast to the religion of the spirit, which entails active participation of mind and soul in the faith adventure of grappling with the rigorous realities of progressive human experience.


155:5.11 The religion of the spirit means effort, struggle, conflict, faith, determination, love, loyalty, and progress. The religion of the mind — the theology of authority — requires little or none of these exertions from its formal believers. Tradition is a safe refuge and an easy path for those fearful and halfhearted souls who instinctively shun the spirit struggles and mental uncertainties associated with those faith voyages of daring adventure out upon the high seas of unexplored truth in search for the farther shores of spiritual realities as they may be discovered by the progressive human mind and experienced by the evolving human soul.


155:5.13 Pointing out each of the twenty-four and calling them by name, Jesus said: “And now, which one of you would prefer to take this easy path of conformity to an established and fossilized religion, as defended by the Pharisees at Jerusalem, rather than to suffer the difficulties and persecutions attendant upon the mission of proclaiming a better way of salvation to men while you realize the satisfaction of discovering for yourselves the beauties of the realities of a living and personal experience in the eternal truths and supreme grandeurs of the kingdom of heaven? Are you fearful, soft, and ease-seeking? Are you afraid to trust your future in the hands of the God of truth, whose sons you are? Are you distrustful of the Father, whose children you are? Will you go back to the easy path of the certainty and intellectual settledness of the religion of traditional authority, or will you gird yourselves to go forward with me into that uncertain and troublous future of proclaiming the new truths of the religion of the spirit, the kingdom of heaven in the hearts of men?”


155:6.1 And so, while they paused in the shade of the hillside, Jesus continued to teach them regarding the religion of the spirit, in substance saying:


155:6.4 Your religion shall change from the mere intellectual belief in traditional authority to the actual experience of that living faith which is able to grasp the reality of God and all that relates to the divine spirit of the Father. The religion of the mind ties you hopelessly to the past; the religion of the spirit consists in progressive revelation and ever beckons you on toward higher and holier achievements in spiritual ideals and eternal realities.


155:6.5 While the religion of authority may impart a present feeling of settled security, you pay for such a transient satisfaction the price of the loss of your spiritual freedom and religious liberty. My Father does not require of you as the price of entering the kingdom of heaven that you should force yourself to subscribe to a belief in things which are spiritually repugnant, unholy, and untruthful. It is not required of you that your own sense of mercy, justice, and truth should be outraged by submission to an outworn system of religious forms and ceremonies. The religion of the spirit leaves you forever free to follow the truth wherever the leadings of the spirit may take you. And who can judge — perhaps this spirit may have something to impart to this generation which other generations have refused to hear?


155:6.8 Every race of mankind has its own mental outlook upon human existence; therefore must the religion of the mind ever run true to these various racial viewpoints. Never can the religions of authority come to unification. Human unity and mortal brotherhood can be achieved only by and through the superendowment of the religion of the spirit. Racial minds may differ, but all mankind is indwelt by the same divine and eternal spirit. The hope of human brotherhood can only be realized when, and as, the divergent mind religions of authority become impregnated with, and overshadowed by, the unifying and ennobling religion of the spirit — the religion of personal spiritual experience.


155:6.9 The religions of authority can only divide men and set them in conscientious array against each other; the religion of the spirit will progressively draw men together and cause them to become understandingly sympathetic with one another. The religions of authority require of men uniformity in belief, but this is impossible of realization in the present state of the world. The religion of the spirit requires only unity of experience — uniformity of destiny — making full allowance for diversity of belief. The religion of the spirit requires only uniformity of insight, not uniformity of viewpoint and outlook. The religion of the spirit does not demand uniformity of intellectual views, only unity of spirit feeling. The religions of authority crystallize into lifeless creeds; the religion of the spirit grows into the increasing joy and liberty of ennobling deeds of loving service and merciful ministration.


156:6.10 The issues of battle are clearly drawn as the Master and his associates prepare to begin the proclamation of a new religion, the religion of the spirit of the living God who dwells in the minds of men.


173:3.3 Jesus did not despise the Pharisees and Sadducees personally. It was their systems of teaching and practice which he sought to discredit. He was hostile to no man, but here was occurring the inevitable clash between a new and living religion of the spirit and the older religion of ceremony, tradition, and authority."




Caino
 

Caino

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The Melchizedek missionary school 1500 BC had 7 commandments which were the foundation of Moses' commandments. Abraham was a student of the school and eventfully made the covenant with God through Melchizedek.

THE SALEM RELIGION

93:4.1 The ceremonies of the Salem worship were very simple. Every person who signed or marked the clay-tablet rolls of the Melchizedek church committed to memory, and subscribed to, the following belief:

1. I believe in El Elyon, the Most High God, the only Universal Father and Creator of all things.

2. I accept the Melchizedek covenant with the Most High, which bestows the favor of God on my faith, not on sacrifices and burnt offerings.

3. I promise to obey the seven commandments of Melchizedek and to tell the good news of this covenant with the Most High to all men.

93:4.5 And that was the whole of the creed of the Salem colony. But even such a short and simple declaration of faith was altogether too much and too advanced for the men of those days. They simply could not grasp the idea of getting divine favor for nothing—by faith. They were too deeply confirmed in the belief that man was born under forfeit to the gods. Too long and too earnestly had they sacrificed and made gifts to the priests to be able to comprehend the good news that salvation, divine favor, was a free gift to all who would believe in the Melchizedek covenant. But Abraham did believe halfheartedly, and even that was "counted for righteousness."

93:4.6 The seven commandments promulgated by Melchizedek were patterned along the lines of the ancient Dalamatian supreme law and very much resembled the seven commands taught in the first and second Edens. These commands of the Salem religion were:

1. You shall not serve any God but the Most High Creator of heaven and earth.

2. You shall not doubt that faith is the only requirement for eternal salvation.

3. You shall not bear false witness.

4. You shall not kill.

5. You shall not steal.

6. You shall not commit adultery.

7. You shall not show disrespect for your parents and elders.

93:4.14 While no sacrifices were permitted within the colony, Melchizedek well knew how difficult it is to suddenly uproot long-established customs and accordingly had wisely offered these people the substitute of a sacrament of bread and wine for the older sacrifice of flesh and blood. It is of record, "Melchizedek, king of Salem, brought forth bread and wine." But even this cautious innovation was not altogether successful; the various tribes all maintained auxiliary centers on the outskirts of Salem where they offered sacrifices and burnt offerings. Even Abraham resorted to this barbarous practice after his victory over Chedorlaomer; he simply did not feel quite at ease until he had offered a conventional sacrifice. And Melchizedek never did succeed in fully eradicating this proclivity to sacrifice from the religious practices of his followers, even of Abraham.

93:4.15 Like Jesus, Melchizedek attended strictly to the fulfillment of the mission of his bestowal. He did not attempt to reform the mores, to change the habits of the world, nor to promulgate even advanced sanitary practices or scientific truths. He came to achieve two tasks: to keep alive on earth the truth of the one God and to prepare the way for the subsequent mortal bestowal of a Paradise Son of that Universal Father.

93:4.16 Melchizedek taught elementary revealed truth at Salem for ninety-four years, and during this time Abraham attended the Salem school three different times. He finally became a convert to the Salem teachings, becoming one of Melchizedek's most brilliant pupils and chief supporters.



Caino
 

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
The "religion of the spirit" allows black to be called white and visa versa. That's why they take no stand on abortion, or euthanasia and other real life issues.

A true religion of Spirit would naturally uphold true and divine values, in accordance with spiritual principles.

When everyone is "right" something is wrong. tWINs

I dont think anyone is proposing that everyone is right about everything they believe or practice :think:


pj
 
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