ECT The Hidden Mystery

S

Squeaky

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Interplanner said:
The Gospel was not the mystery, Jerry, says Gal 3:8-9. Judaism believed that all the nations were to be blessed through them. The mystery was rather that the basis of inheritance and sharing between Jewish and Gentile believers was the Gospel not the Law. Eph 3:5-6. 'through the Gospel' is the key phrase there, written to clash with 'through the law' which for practical purposes does not only mean the laws and traditions but also the land promise.
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I said
Well this verse says the mystery is Christ in us. Which can only be proven by the revelations of Jesus Christ.
And first one has to crucify all their emotions and feelings. Or they are not even Christ's yet.

Gal 5:24
24 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
(NKJ)
 
Jerry Shugart

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
Interplanner said:
The Gospel was not the mystery, Jerry, says Gal 3:8-9.
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That is the "good news" given to Abraham, not the "good news" mentioned in this verse:

"Now to him who is able to establish you in accordance with my gospel, the message I proclaim about Jesus Christ, in keeping with the revelation of the mystery hidden for long ages past" (Ro.16:25).​

The "good news" which Abraham heard had not been kept secret for long ages past because that "good news" was found in the OT Scriptures for thousands of years.
 
D

Danoh

New member
Jerry Shugart said:
That is the "good news" given to Abraham, not the "good news" mentioned in this verse:

"Now to him who is able to establish you in accordance with my gospel, the message I proclaim about Jesus Christ, in keeping with the revelation of the mystery hidden for long ages past" (Ro.16:25).​

The "good news" which Abraham heard had not been kept secret for long ages past because that "good news" was found in the OT Scriptures for thousands of years.
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And yep, again :thumb:
 
D

Danoh

New member
Squeaky said:
I said
Well here is where I see something you don't. Or you see something I don't.

mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you
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No.

Paul wants them to fully know the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles.

The riches of the glory of this mystery of Christ among the Gentiles, in them.

This is unique, Pauline Mystery Truth.

A truth unique to the Body of Christ that God is presently forming - not in, nor through Israel - but in, and among the Gentiles through Christ: The very Lord of Glory Himself in them.

He wants them to fully know the riches of said glory and its intended impact in their lives both in Glory one day, and in the here and now - now - that they might then live it out in the here and now - just as God has meant for it to function in them in the here and now.
 
S

Squeaky

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Danoh said:
No.

Paul wants them to fully know the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles.

The riches of the glory of this mystery of Christ among the Gentiles, in them.

This is unique, Pauline Mystery Truth.

A truth unique to the Body of Christ that God is presently forming - not in, nor through Israel - but in, and among the Gentiles through Christ: The very Lord of Glory Himself in them.

He wants them to fully know the riches of said glory and its intended impact in their lives both in Glory one day, and in the here and now - now - that they might then live it out in the here and now - just as God has meant for it to function in them in the here and now.
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I said
I know. The evidence of Jesus Christ being in you is His revelations. That is what I have been sharing with everyone. When you are Christs. And all the evidence of it. We know we haven't made it to Christ until we have crucified all our emotions.

Gal 5:24-25
24 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
(NKJ)

We understand that just saying it does not make it so. It takes evidence. Evidence from Christ.

Eph 4:11-13
11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers,
12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ,
13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ;
(NKJ)

Eph 3:17-19
17 that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; that you, being rooted and grounded in love,
18 may be able to comprehend with all the saints what is the width and length and depth and height--
19 to know the love of Christ which passes knowledge; that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.
(NKJ)
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Squeaky said:
I said
I know. The evidence of Jesus Christ being in you is His revelations. That is what I have been sharing with everyone. When you are Christs. And all the evidence of it. We know we haven't made it to Christ until we have crucified all our emotions.

Gal 5:24-25
24 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
(NKJ)

We understand that just saying it does not make it so. It takes evidence. Evidence from Christ.

Eph 4:11-13
11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers,
12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ,
13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ;
(NKJ)

Eph 3:17-19
17 that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; that you, being rooted and grounded in love,
18 may be able to comprehend with all the saints what is the width and length and depth and height--
19 to know the love of Christ which passes knowledge; that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.
(NKJ)
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What Paul is talking about here is not subjective. It is not the individual's transformation. It is how the message of Messiah would spread among the Gentiles. Not whether it would but how it would. He explained this in Eph 3:5-6. And Ephesians is a kind of generic general letter to all Christians based on Colossians (this view is based on the theory that a longer piece probably came after a shorter one.).

The mystery never was just that the message of Messiah would reach the nations. That is all over the OT as far back as Gen 3. It was HOW. The how is not through the law, as Judaism supposed. It is through the Gospel.

This is why there is the type of issue in Colossians that there is: there is a neo-Judaism (resulting at the same place, but claiming to have heard directly from the same angels which administered the law 1400 years earlier) and it disqualifies those who believe on Messiah. That is the vain philosophy that has started, not philosophy in general, that disturbs Paul. It regenerated a bunch of commands and said you are not really a believer until you are keeping all of them, even though they don't work like the dying and rising in Christ does.

If you pay attention to the kind of issue being battled in a given letter, it will tell you what the issues are. Your head will not be full of 2P2P thoughts and fittings, but historical ones.
 
S

Squeaky

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Interplanner said:
What Paul is talking about here is not subjective. It is not the individual's transformation. It is how the message of Messiah would spread among the Gentiles. Not whether it would but how it would. He explained this in Eph 3:5-6. And Ephesians is a kind of generic general letter to all Christians based on Colossians (this view is based on the theory that a longer piece probably came after a shorter one.).

The mystery never was just that the message of Messiah would reach the nations. That is all over the OT as far back as Gen 3. It was HOW. The how is not through the law, as Judaism supposed. It is through the Gospel.

This is why there is the type of issue in Colossians that there is: there is a neo-Judaism (resulting at the same place, but claiming to have heard directly from the same angels which administered the law 1400 years earlier) and it disqualifies those who believe on Messiah. That is the vain philosophy that has started, not philosophy in general, that disturbs Paul. It regenerated a bunch of commands and said you are not really a believer until you are keeping all of them, even though they don't work like the dying and rising in Christ does.

If you pay attention to the kind of issue being battled in a given letter, it will tell you what the issues are. Your head will not be full of 2P2P thoughts and fittings, but historical ones.
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I said
lol I have no idea of what your trying to say here.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Squeaky said:
I said
lol I have no idea of what your trying to say here.
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He is not talking about the individual changes inside each believer. He is talking about the Gentile believers as a group now enjoying Messiah.

The mystery is not that they WOULD. The mystery is HOW they would.

The fact that they would, one day, is EVERYWHERE in the OT.

HOW they would was not seen until the time of the Gospel because Judaism thought that they (Judaism, the Law as known in 1st century times) was to be the conduit. Instead the Gospel was the conduit. The Gospel is how the nations share in everything promised to ancient Israel, which was the promise of God's redemptive gospel. This is what Eph 3:1-6 is saying, following the complete list of things shared in ch 2B.
 
S

Squeaky

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Interplanner said:
He is not talking about the individual changes inside each believer. He is talking about the Gentile believers as a group now enjoying Messiah.

The mystery is not that they WOULD. The mystery is HOW they would.

The fact that they would, one day, is EVERYWHERE in the OT.

HOW they would was not seen until the time of the Gospel because Judaism thought that they (Judaism, the Law as known in 1st century times) was to be the conduit. Instead the Gospel was the conduit. The Gospel is how the nations share in everything promised to ancient Israel, which was the promise of God's redemptive gospel. This is what Eph 3:1-6 is saying, following the complete list of things shared in ch 2B.
Click to expand...

I said
I showed it to you.
Col 1:27
27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the

glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
(NKJ)
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Squeaky said:
I said
I showed it to you.
Col 1:27
27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the

glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
(NKJ)
Click to expand...


Yes, and you is the collective plural (all of the Gentile believers). This does not DEFINE the mystery, it only says WHERE it is understood (but of course, Paul was Jewish). To define the mystery go to Eph 3:5-6; Ephesians (the letter) is considered the 'parent' letter of Colossians. Colossians is one specific application to one specific group.
 
S

Squeaky

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Interplanner said:
Yes, and you is the collective plural (all of the Gentile believers). This does not DEFINE the mystery, it only says WHERE it is understood (but of course, Paul was Jewish). To define the mystery go to Eph 3:5-6; Ephesians (the letter) is considered the 'parent' letter of Colossians. Colossians is one specific application to one specific group.
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I said
That is away to intellectual and deceiving. That is how Jesus taught me He was in me and that I should trust the revelations He is about to give me. This was 25 years ago. And for 25 years I have received over 2000 of these revelations. And everyone of them has been proven to me, over and over.

Col 1:27
27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the
glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
(NKJ)
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Squeaky said:
I said
That is away to intellectual and deceiving. That is how Jesus taught me He was in me and that I should trust the revelations He is about to give me. This was 25 years ago. And for 25 years I have received over 2000 of these revelations. And everyone of them has been proven to me, over and over.

Col 1:27
27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the
glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
(NKJ)
Click to expand...




OK, but that does not change what the text originally and historically meant about 'Christ out among the Gentiles.' And it does not change Eph 3:5-6 about the Gospel.
 
S

Squeaky

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Interplanner said:
OK, but that does not change what the text originally and historically meant about 'Christ out among the Gentiles.' And it does not change Eph 3:5-6 about the Gospel.
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I said
I don't know what you mean by original text. look I know what God has given me. The bible that He has given me. The hidden mystery for my times period. And what I have got has worked just the way the Holy Spirit has told me it is suppose to work.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Squeaky said:
I said
I don't know what you mean by original text. look I know what God has given me. The bible that He has given me. The hidden mystery for my times period. And what I have got has worked just the way the Holy Spirit has told me it is suppose to work.
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Yes, Christ is "in" believers, but that text (Col 2) was saying something particular about the fact that so many Gentiles had become believers. It should be compared to the end of Rom 16 where the fact of so many Gentile believers is an 'order' (a royal decree or enactment) by God in his kingdom. You didn't just read about it; it was taking place in front of everyone.
 
S

Squeaky

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Interplanner said:
Yes, Christ is "in" believers, but that text (Col 2) was saying something particular about the fact that so many Gentiles had become believers. It should be compared to the end of Rom 16 where the fact of so many Gentile believers is an 'order' (a royal decree or enactment) by God in his kingdom. You didn't just read about it; it was taking place in front of everyone.
Click to expand...

I said
Christ isn't in believers until they start receiving the revelations of Jesus Christ.
 
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