The coronavirus scam

Jefferson

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He's admitted to contracting the virus along with his wife. If it's all a "scam" then why has he done that considering the conspiracy nut outfits that actually aligned, namely Q-Anon and the Covid deniers?

The scam isn't the existence of the virus. The scam is hyping the virus trying to make everyone think this is the second coming of the bubonic plague.

Why did he downplay it so much and is on record for doing so and liking doing it?

The alternative would be for Trump to have given a state of the union message on national TV, telling everyone that the next bubonic plague has just hit our shores and wishing everyone good luck. Can you imagine the chaos and rioting that would have resulted the next day? Can you imagine what would have happened to the stock market? Trump was smart for not taking your advice.

Why did he declare a national emergency?

He hasn't told me.

So now that I've answered your questions, please answer mine:
Why no increase in average monthly deaths this year? See https://theologyonline.com/forum/pol...68#post2770968
 

The Barbarian

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The scam isn't the existence of the virus. The scam is hyping the virus trying to make everyone think this is the second coming of the bubonic plague.

Haven't heard anyone say that. The worst I saw was "the second coming of the 1918 flu pandemic." Who was saying it was the second coming of the bubonic plague? Got a link for that?

The alternative would be for Trump to have given a state of the union message on national TV, telling everyone that the next bubonic plague has just hit our shores

Why would just telling the truth not be an option? Trump is capable of telling the truth; I've heard him do it several times.

Can you imagine the chaos and rioting that would have resulted the next day?

When the previous administration told the truth about Ebola and H1N1, both of which would have been worse if they didn't take quick action, there was no chaos or rioting.

Can you imagine what would have happened to the stock market?

My portfolio didn't change noticeably.

So now that I've answered your questions, please answer mine:
Why no increase in average monthly deaths this year?


There was, according to CDC.

Up to 204,691 extra deaths in the U.S. so far in this pandemic year
The pandemic leaves its mark in the number of lives ended

https://www.salon.com/2020/08/14/up-...-year_partner/

Can you explain the "200,000 excess deaths" you referenced in your recent tweet?
We can observe trends from the number of deaths reported each year, on a weekly basis. When we see large deviations in the numbers for a time period, we call that excess deaths. Looking at 2020 since March, the raw number of excess deaths
is 200,000 more people than a normal year. When we try to understand that, COVID-19 is the most rational and likely explanation. If you don't believe it's COVID-19, try to pinpoint why this year has been so different than any other. Why would a new disease that kills people not be the cause?
https://hub.jhu.edu/2020/09/01/comor...us-deaths-cdc/

Current Government data here:
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/c...ess_deaths.htm
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
The scam isn't the existence of the virus. The scam is hyping the virus trying to make everyone think this is the second coming of the bubonic plague.

According to who exactly? The bubonic plague?! There are wingnuts who think Covid-19 doesn't exist at all Jefferson.

The alternative would be for Trump to have given a state of the union message on national TV, telling everyone that the next bubonic plague has just hit our shores and wishing everyone good luck. Can you imagine the chaos and rioting that would have resulted the next day? Can you imagine what would have happened to the stock market? Trump was smart for not taking your advice.

That's just garbage and as lame an excuse for defending Trump's lies as it can get. Nobody has compared Covid-19 to the equivalent of the bubonic plague so this is just flat out pathetic Jefferson. Do you just give the spray tanned travesty a free pass for anything he says no matter what? He lied to you and all of the American people and was happy to do so, all on record.

He hasn't told me.

So now that I've answered your questions, please answer mine:
Why no increase in average monthly deaths this year? See https://theologyonline.com/forum/pol...68#post2770968

Well, you haven't, you've just given me some bat crazy stuff that can't be taken remotely seriously and Barb has already addressed you. No more to add to that.
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass
1461-web.png
 

Jefferson

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WHO warns against COVID-19 lockdowns due to economic damage

The World Health Organization has warned leaders against relying on COVID-19 lockdowns to tackle outbreaks — after previously saying countries should be careful how quickly they reopen.

WHO envoy Dr. David Nabarro said such restrictive measures should only be treated as a last resort, the British magazine the Spectator reported in a video interview.

“We in the World Health Organization do not advocate lockdowns as the primary means of control of this virus,” Nabarro said.

“The only time we believe a lockdown is justified is to buy you time to reorganize, regroup, rebalance your resources, protect your health workers who are exhausted, but by and large, we’d rather not do it.”

Nabarro said tight restrictions cause significant harm, particularly on the global economy.

“Lockdowns just have one consequence that you must never, ever belittle, and that is making poor people an awful lot poorer,” he said.

He added that lockdowns have severely impacted countries that rely on tourism.

“Just look at what’s happened to the tourism industry in the Caribbean, for example, or in the Pacific because people aren’t taking their holidays,” Nabarro told the outlet.

“Look what’s happened to smallholder farmers all over the world. Look what’s happening to poverty levels. It seems that we may well have a doubling of world poverty by next year. We may well have at least a doubling of child malnutrition.”

The UN agency previously warned countries against lifting lockdowns too soon during the first wave of the virus.

“The last thing any country needs is to open schools and businesses, only to be forced to close them again because of a resurgence,” said Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus.

But Tedros had urged countries to bolster other measures, including widespread testing and contact tracing, so they could safely reopen and avoid future lockdowns.

“We need to reach a sustainable situation where we have adequate control of this virus without shutting down our lives entirely, or lurching from lockdown to lockdown — which has a hugely detrimental impact on societies,” he said.
 

The Barbarian

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During this pandemic, people in the United States are dying at rates unparalleled elsewhere in the world.

A new report in the Journal of the American Medical Association finds that in the past five months, per capita deaths in the U.S., both from COVID-19 and other causes, have been far greater than in 18 other high-income countries.

"It's shocking. It's horrible," says
Dr. Ezekiel J. Emanuel, a professor of health policy and medical ethics at the University of Pennsylvania and one of the authors of the study.

"The United States really has done remarkably badly compared to other countries," he says. "I mean, remarkably badly."

The
study looks at per capita death rates in 2020 in 18 countries with populations larger than 5 million people and per capita gross domestic product levels above $25,000 per year. It breaks out deaths attributed to COVID-19 and examines how total deaths in the U.S. are higher than normal this year. This so-called "all-cause" mortality takes into account fatalities that may have been due to the coronavirus but were never confirmed or were due to other factors such as people not seeking medical care during the crisis.



Overall deaths in the United States this year are more than 85% higher than in places such as Germany, Israel and Denmark after adjusting for population size. Deaths in the U.S. are 29% higher than even in Sweden, "which ignored everything for so long," Emanuel says. Sweden made a point of refusing to order strict social restrictions and never went in to a full lockdown. "We have 29% more mortality than we should have if we'd followed Sweden's path and Sweden virtually did nothing."

Even looking just at confirmed COVID-19 deaths, the number of people dying since May 10 — again after adjusting for population size — is on average 50% higher than every other country in the study. In addition, the rate people are dying in the U.S. has stayed far above everywhere else. Emanuel says the current elevated mortality rates are important because they eliminate the chaotic early months of the pandemic when testing, treatment and reporting varied dramatically around the globe.

The rate of COVID-19 deaths in the U.S. since June 7 is 27.2 per 100,000 people. In contrast, in Italy, the death rate is down to 3.1 per 100,000.

"It's not like Italy has some secret medicine that we don't," Emmanuel says. "They've got the same public health measures we've got. They just implemented them effectively and we implemented them poorly." If the U.S. had managed to keep its per capita death rate at the level of Italy's, 79,120 fewer Americans would have died.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health...cebook.com&utm_campaign=npr&utm_medium=social
 

The Barbarian

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Thanks to Trump's bungling, the COVID-19 pandemic has killed more Americans than we lost in combat during the Civil War. By the time it's over, one American in every thousand Americans will be dead from COVID-19.

That is Trump's legacy.

Edit: As the infection rate spikes toward the previous high, the death toll is now projected to be closer to 400,000 Americans dead.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-...irus-deaths-projection-400000-by-end-of-year/

The "scam" that Trump claimed was a "hoax" is now devastating many states. The lack of a coordinated federal effort to contain the pandemic will condemn many more Americans to death.
 
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ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
Thanks to Trump's bungling, the COVID-19 pandemic has killed more Americans than we lost in combat during the Civil War. By the time it's over, one American in every thousand Americans will be dead from COVID-19.

That is Trump's legacy.

So your prediction is that the pandemic that was going to destroy life on earth as we know it is now going to end up having a 1/10th of one percent fatality rate?

A fatality rate of 0.001? :freak:

Tell me again why we closed the economy?
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
Thanks to Trump's bungling, the COVID-19 pandemic has killed more Americans than we lost in combat during the Civil War. By the time it's over, one American in every thousand Americans will be dead from COVID-19.

That is Trump's legacy.

Edit: As the infection rate spikes toward the previous high, the death toll is now projected to be closer to 400,000 Americans dead.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-...irus-deaths-projection-400000-by-end-of-year/

The "scam" that Trump claimed was a "hoax" is now devastating many states. The lack of a coordinated federal effort to contain the pandemic will condemn many more Americans to death.

Not to mention the fact that he knew how serious it was going to be, while telling the public that it was all under control and would even magically disappear...
 

The Barbarian

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Banned
Not to mention the fact that he knew how serious it was going to be, while telling the public that it was all under control and would even magically disappear...

The scientific consensus was that the disease would have a death rate (deaths/number of people seeking medical care for the disease) of between 1.5 and 3.5 percent. It's closer to the higher number than to the lower number...


5,874,771
Cases which had an outcome:
5,646,501 (96%)Recovered / Discharged
228,270 (4%)Deaths
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

According to epidemiologists at Columbia University, over a hundred thousand lives would have been saved, if Trump had acted earlier:

US could have avoided at least 130,000 COVID-19 deaths, Columbia University study says
https://www.kxxv.com/news/national/c...ity-study-says
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
The scientific consensus was that the disease would have a death rate (deaths/number of people seeking medical care for the disease) of between 1.5 and 3.5 percent. It's closer to the higher number than to the lower number...


5,874,771
Cases which had an outcome:
5,646,501 (96%)Recovered / Discharged
228,270 (4%)Deaths
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

According to epidemiologists at Columbia University, over a hundred thousand lives would have been saved, if Trump had acted earlier:

US could have avoided at least 130,000 COVID-19 deaths, Columbia University study says
https://www.kxxv.com/news/national/c...ity-study-says

And considering he's on record for admitting to knowing how serious the virus was, why didn't he act earlier?

Won't matter a bit to the MAGA! crowd though.
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass
The US just topped 1,100 coronavirus deaths a day.

The US is now well into the dreaded fall surge, fueled by indoor socializing, outbreaks at schools and pandemic fatigue.

More than 1,100 new deaths were reported Wednesday -- the highest daily toll in more than a month, according to data from Johns Hopkins University.

The 31 states are reporting at least 10% more new Covid-19 cases this week compared to last week: Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Connecticut, Florida, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Nebraska, Nevada, New Jersey, New Mexico, North Dakota, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Texas, Tennessee, Vermont, Wisconsin, West Virginia and Wyoming.
 

The Barbarian

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Banned
And Bunker Boy is still hiding in the WH, telling us that "we've turned a corner", "it's going to go away like a miracle", it's all "under control",...etc.

Trump says he's going to flee America if he loses. He can't. Americans can't go to other countries because he botched the pandemic.
 

Stripe

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Bunker Boy is still hiding in the WH... Trump says he's going to flee America if he loses.
:rotfl: You're delusional.
Americans can't go to other countries because he botched the pandemic.
:rotfl: You're delusional. For instance, Taiwan has barred travelers regardless of where they are from.

Your hatred of Donaldtrump disables you from useful contributions to a sensible discussion.


Entry and Exit Requirements (Updated: August 13, 2020):

Beginning on June 29, Taiwan allows foreign nationals who wish to travel to Taiwan for reasons other than tourism to apply for a special entry permit with a Taiwan representative office overseas. U.S. citizens in the United States may contact the Taipei Economic and Cultural Representative Office (TECRO).
All foreign nationals except for those who hold Alien Resident Certificates (ARCs), documents proving they are in Taiwan for diplomatic or official purposes or to fulfill business contracts, or special entry permits are prohibited from entering Taiwan.

https://www.ait.org.tw/covid-19-information

 

Jonahdog

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Banned
What should our goal be? Lock ourselves in the basement like Joe?

No, act rationally. Listen to the science. Wear masks, social distance, wash your hands. Yes, the economy is in the tank, figure out how to move forward and at the same time work on the public health issues. But certainly dont have rallies where you dont care if the majority of attendees crowd together without masks.
 
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