The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?

[Bright Raven]

Be concerned about yourself.

No one can can do anything to get themselves Saved.

God's choosing of those whom He Saved by His Grace
took place before the world began 1 Tim. 1:9.

You must realize that you have no choice in the matter of Salvation!

~~~~~

I have no problem. I believe the scriptures not the rantings of a madman like Calvin.

Romans 10:9-10 King James Version (KJV)

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

And if you don't believe it, why did Paul write it.

2 Timothy 3:16 King James Version (KJV)

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

 

[Nanja]

I have no problem. I believe the scriptures not the rantings of a madman like Calvin.

Romans 10:9-10 King James Version (KJV)

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

And if you don't believe it, why did Paul write it.

2 Timothy 3:16 King James Version (KJV)

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Who's talking about Calvin? What do the scriptures say?

Regarding Rom. 10:9-10, confess means to be in agreement with.
And how can one be in agreement with God, and believe that God
raised Jesus from the dead unless he has been given a New Heart:
New Birth Ezek. 36:26-27; Gal. 5:22.

The heart of a carnal, spiritually dead man, is deceitful above all things,
and desperately wicked:

Jer. 17:9
The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

~~~~~

 

[Bright Raven]

Who's talking about Calvin? What do the scriptures say?

Regarding Rom. 10:9-10, confess means to be in agreement with.
And how can one be in agreement with God, and believe that God
raised Jesus from the dead unless he has been given a New Heart:
New Birth Ezek. 36:26-27; Gal. 5:22.

The heart of a carnal, spiritually dead man, is deceitful above all things,
and desperately wicked:

Jer. 17:9
The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

~~~~~

Good for you! You're on your way.

2 Corinthians 5:17 King James Version (KJV)

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Thank you for affirming my salvation.

 

[Nanja]

Good for you! You're on your way.

2 Corinthians 5:17 King James Version (KJV)

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Thank you for affirming my salvation.

The Truth still stands:

No one can do anything to get themselves Saved!

God has done all the choosing of those who would inherit Eternal Life before the foundation of the World!

~~~~~

 

[Bright Raven]

The Truth still stands:

No one can do anything to get themselves Saved!

God has done all the choosing of those who would inherit Eternal Life before the foundation of the World!

~~~~~

Of course not. You must believe, And if you think that believing is a work, you are wrong. Even you must believe.

John 3:16 King James Version (KJV)

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

 

[Nanja]

Of course not. You must believe, And if you think that believing is a work, you are wrong. Even you must believe.

John 3:16 King James Version (KJV)

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Belief / Faith that pleases God is a Fruit of the Holy Spirit given in New Birth Gal. 5:22 KJV.

If one has not been Born Again, Born of the Spirit, nothing he does can please God Rom. 8:7-8!

~~~~~

 

[Bright Raven]

Belief / Faith that pleases God is a Fruit of the Holy Spirit given in New Birth Gal. 5:22 KJV.

If one has not been Born Again, Born of the Spirit, nothing he does can please God Rom. 8:7-8!

~~~~~

Didn't say faith, I said belief.

 

[Nanja]

All for whom Christ lived and died are reckoned by Divine Testimony to be Righteous based solely upon the Covenant Suretyship of Jesus Christ Isa 42:6

6 I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

During His Living upon the Earth, all that He did was not for Himself, but in stead and Name of His People Matt 1:21, those given to Him by the Father Jn 17:2

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Now He obeyed Gods Law Perfectly in their stead, as well as suffered condemnation in their stead, for their many transgressions against His Holiness and Law.

He for them obeyed the Law and fulfilled all Righteousness Isa 42:21

21 The Lord is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable. By His Perfect Obedience unto it for His People !

So because of His Federal Headship Law Obedience, the Righteousness of the Law [all that it demands of man] has been fulfilled in them Rom 8:4, and this explains why Rom 5:19b is True

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

That because or by the Surety Obedience of One, Jesus Christ in His Federal Headship Capacity [as was adam in the beginning of time] many are made righteous, which is apart from any Gospel Obedience of theirs like faith and repentance, and it was while they were even being enemies and disobedience Rom 5:10 !

So True! Those whom Christ Jesus was a Surety for Eph. 1:4 are truly Blessed,
because they were put in Right Standing with God Rom. 5:10, in His Favor,
even while they were enemies, in unbelief.

Because of Christ's perfect obedience to God's Law on their behalf, they are made Righteous:
Through Him is how they keep God's Commandments perfectly John 14:15 !

~~~~~

 

[beloved57]

So True! Those whom Christ Jesus was a Surety for Eph. 1:4 are truly Blessed,
because they were put in Right Standing with God Rom. 5:10, in His Favor,
even while they were enemies, in unbelief.

Because of Christ's perfect obedience to God's Law on their behalf, they are made Righteous:
Through Him is how they keep God's Commandments perfectly John 14:15 !

~~~~~

Most definitely !

 

[beloved57]

He was made a curse for us !

He was made a curse for us !

Gal 3:13,14

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

The Us is everyone Christ died for, His Church Eph 5:25. Now being made a curse for them, He has for them drank damnation dry, so doing by providing a full satisfaction for all their sins, transgressions against the Holy Law of God, and with that all damnation and or condemnation has been removed from them, so much so, that its impossible that any one sinner that He died for, was made a curse for, can ever be of the damned, like these here who believe not Mk 16:16

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

2 Thess 2:12

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Even in unbelief those Christ died for, was made a curse for cannot be damned, because His death reconciled them to God while they are in unbelief and enemies Rom 5:10 !

Also none for whom He died, for whom He was made a curse can possibly be of that world which shall be condemned 1 Cor 11:32

32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

And since everyone Christ died for cannot be damned, cursed into the lake of fire Matt 25:41

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Then the reasonable conclusion is, all who are finally damned, cannot possibly be anyone for whom Christ died, and thats why they did not believe, Jn 10:26

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

They cannot believe because they are cursed and damned into perpetual unbelief, because Christ was never made a curse for them !

 

[beloved57]

Things that accompany the death of Christ !

Things that accompany the death of Christ !

One of the reasons we know for a certainty that Christ's death was not for all mankind without exception, though it was for all men without distinction, as in different ethnic groups, is because of what His death alone accomplished and what accompanies it. Rom 8:32-34

32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

The all for whom Christ was delivered up for, with Him being delivered up for them, comes all things.

Two of the all things freely given them is seen in Vs 33 #1 No charge can be laid against them as Gods Elect, thats consistent with non imputation 2 Cor 5:19, and secondly, what is freely given them is Gods Justification of them ! This is based solely on God not sparing His own Son, but delivered Him up for all of them, all the Elect of God !

 

[beloved57]

Sin not being imputed !

Sin not being imputed !

A Glorious benefit and accomplishment of the atoning death of Christ, that religionist cant receive is this, those Christ died for sin cannot and will not be imputed to them, or charged to them, for they all are the blessed man here Rom 4:8

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

Sin is not imputed or charged to any sinner Christ died for, for His Blood alone cleanses them from all sin 1 Jn 1:7

7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

The word purge here is from the word cleanseth in 1 Jn 1:7, they are talking about the very same thing as the result of Christ's death !

Now lets understand something, all of Gods Elect, those Christ died for, before and after conversion have sin in them eperimentally, and at times it reigns in them, in their flesh and members Rom 7, such sins as these listed but not limited to them Mark 7:20-23

20 And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man.

21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,

22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:

23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.


But the good news for them Christ died for is this, even though these sins may harass them, even overcome them, bring them into captivity, give us great pleasure in the flesh, deprive them of sweet fellowship and communion with God, nevertheless God does not charge them to their account, and God sees them still as perfectly righteous, holy and unblameable in His sight, thats the hope of the Gospel Col 1:21-23

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

And True God given Faith rests in and believes this Blessed Truth !
For the Just shall live by Faith !

 

[Nanja]

A Glorious benefit and accomplishment of the atoning death of Christ, that religionist cant receive is this, those Christ died for sin cannot and will not be imputed to them, or charged to them, for they all are the blessed man here Rom 4:8

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

Sin is not imputed or charged to any sinner Christ died for, for His Blood alone cleanses them from all sin 1 Jn 1:7

7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

The word purge here is from the word cleanseth in 1 Jn 1:7, they are talking about the very same thing as the result of Christ's death !

Now lets understand something, all of Gods Elect, those Christ died for, before and after conversion have sin in them eperimentally, and at times it reigns in them, in their flesh and members Rom 7, such sins as these listed but not limited to them Mark 7:20-23

So True!

20 And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man.

21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,

22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:

23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.


But the good news for them Christ died for is this, even though these sins may harass them, even overcome them, bring them into captivity, give us great pleasure in the flesh, deprive them of sweet fellowship and communion with God, nevertheless God does not charge them to their account, and God sees them still as perfectly righteous, holy and unblameable in His sight, thats the hope of the Gospel Col 1:21-23
21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

And True God given Faith rests in and believes this Blessed Truth !
For the Just shall live by Faith !

Amen, and all succinctly stated!


The only portion / world of humanity which had no sin imputed to it were God's Elect Children whom He
had chosen in Union with Christ their Surety from Everlasting to have Redemption through His Blood Eph. 1:7.

2 Cor. 5:21
For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Rom. 8:33
Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.


So if we are one of the Sheep Christ laid down His Life for John 10:11,15, we never had any sin / iniquity charged to us,
but was laid on Him instead Is. 53:6. And we are deemed Just / Righteous in God's Sight solely by His Blood alone.


1 John 5:4
For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

And True God given Faith, is the same Faith that was reckoned to Abraham for Righteousnes Gal. 3:6,
which is evidence of Divine Quickening, being Born of God. And their Justification by Faith comes through
receiving the Blessing of Abraham:

Gal. 3:14
That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ;
that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith Gal 4:6!

~~~~~

 

[beloved57]

Amen, and all succinctly stated!


The only portion / world of humanity which had no sin imputed to it were God's Elect Children whom He
had chosen in Union with Christ their Surety from Everlasting to have Redemption through His Blood Eph. 1:7.

2 Cor. 5:21
For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Rom. 8:33
Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.


So if we are one of the Sheep Christ laid down His Life for John 10:11,15, we never had any sin / iniquity charged to us,
but was laid on Him instead Is. 53:6. And we are deemed Just / Righteous in God's Sight solely by His Blood alone.


1 John 5:4
For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

And True God given Faith, is the same Faith that was reckoned to Abraham for Righteousnes Gal. 3:6,
which is evidence of Divine Quickening, being Born of God. And their Justification by Faith comes through
receiving the Blessing of Abraham:

Gal. 3:14
That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ;
that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith Gal 4:6!

~~~~~

Amen!

 

[beloved57]

Sin not being imputed !2

Sin not being imputed !2

All for whom Christ died, every single sinner He died for, their sins were imputed/charged to Him, thats how He died for their sins 1 Cor 15:3

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Now these scriptures could not be True if their sins had not been imputed to Christ.

Now everyone whose sins that were imputed to Christ for Him to die for, automatically become those Blessed Ones whom God will not impute sin unto Rom 4:8

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

In fact its a World of People 2 Cor 5:19

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Not one individual of this world can ever have sin charged or imputed to them, not by God !

What this means, no sinner Christ died for can have sin imputed to him or her by the Law, for sin is the Transgression of the Law 1 Jn 3:4

Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

This scripture cannot apply to any sinner Christ died for, because sin to them cannot be imputed Rom 5:13

For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

You see that ? Thats a Divine Principle that cannot be denied or frustrated, all sinners Christ died for are dead to the law, it cannot charge them with sin or transgression before the Justice of God Rom 7:4

Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ[His death for you]; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

See, they become dead to the Law, before Faith/Believing, which is what marries them to Christ experimentally, because they have already been made dead to the Law by His death, and so sin cannot be imputed where there is no Law, and every sinner that has no sin imputed to them for violation of Gods Law, is Righteous before God Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Because His Obedience entailed having their sins imputed to Him for Him to die for them !

 

[beloved57]

It redeemed us from all Iniquity !


Those for whom Christ died can never be of them which Christ will some day say this to Matt 7:23

²³ And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

They can never be "ye that work iniquity" Because by His death, one of its grand accomplishments in the purpose of God, redeemed them from all iniquity Titus 2:14

¹⁴ Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The word that is the conjunction hina and it means:

denoting the purpose or the result, which means Gods designed result and purpose in Christ giving Himself for those He died for was to redeem them from ALL INIQUITY ! That result was accomplished through the death of Christ. Neither can them Christ died for be of them which it is written of them this Ps 5:5

⁵ The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity. Those Christ died for cannot be workers of Iniquity because Christ redeemed them from all iniquity, neither can it be laid to their charge !

Rom 4:7-8

⁷ Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
⁸ Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

 

[beloved57]

It redeemed us from all Iniquity !2

Titus 2:14
Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify to himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.This also means that those Christ died for shall be redeemed from unbelief/disobedience or else the designed purpose for Christ's Death failed ! His death is to redeem from all iniquity. The word redeem lutroó means:

I release on receipt of ransom; mid: I redeem, release by paying ransom, liberate, deliver.

The death of Christ is purposed by God and does deliver those Christ died for from bondage, and captivity to sin, which unbelief/disobedience is. By nature men are in a lost state captive, imprisoned in unbelief/disobedience Rom 11:32

³² For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. All men in the Justice of God who sinned in Adam, God concluded them in unbelief !

Now the word concluded is key to understanding what redemption does. Its the word sugkleió and means :

I enclose, shut in, make subject to.

to shut together, i.e. enclose

to shup up on all sides, shut up completely; τινα εἰς τινα or τί, so to deliver one up to the power of a person or thing that he is completely shut in, as it were, without means of escape

We by nature are by the Justice of God locked in a prison of unbelief /disobeidnece. Some Translations catch the meaning of the word concluded by translating the verse as follows:

For God has imprisoned everyone in disobedience so he could have mercy on everyone.NLT

For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all.ESV

For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all.NASB

For God has imprisoned all in disobedience, so that He may have mercy on all. HCSB

God has placed all people into the prison of their own disobedience so that he could be merciful to all people.

So the only way out of the prison house of unbelief/disobeidence is by means of redemption through Christ. Thats why Jesus said to unbelieving jews Jn 8:36

If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Jesus was speaking of the power of His redemptive death, by it He would liberate men and women from unbelief/disobedience, which by nature all are confined to.

So if one Christ died for winds up in hell for their sins in unbelief Jn 8:24, that means His death failed the purpose of God, and yet how many false teachers would tell us that many for whom Christ died shall wind up in hell for their sins that He died for in the prison of unbelief. Such false teachers are against Christ, and serve their own lust and pride !

 

[Nanja]

It redeemed us from all Iniquity !2

Titus 2:14
Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify to himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.This also means that those Christ died for shall be redeemed from unbelief/disobedience or else the designed purpose for Christ's Death failed ! His death is to redeem from all iniquity. The word redeem lutroó means:

I release on receipt of ransom; mid: I redeem, release by paying ransom, liberate, deliver.

The death of Christ is purposed by God and does deliver those Christ died for from bondage, and captivity to sin, which unbelief/disobedience is. By nature men are in a lost state captive, imprisoned in unbelief/disobedience Rom 11:32

³² For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. All men in the Justice of God who sinned in Adam, God concluded them in unbelief !

Now the word concluded is key to understanding what redemption does. Its the word sugkleió and means :

I enclose, shut in, make subject to.

to shut together, i.e. enclose

to shup up on all sides, shut up completely; τινα εἰς τινα or τί, so to deliver one up to the power of a person or thing that he is completely shut in, as it were, without means of escape

We by nature are by the Justice of God locked in a prison of unbelief /disobeidnece. Some Translations catch the meaning of the word concluded by translating the verse as follows:

For God has imprisoned everyone in disobedience so he could have mercy on everyone.NLT

For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all.ESV

For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all.NASB

For God has imprisoned all in disobedience, so that He may have mercy on all. HCSB

God has placed all people into the prison of their own disobedience so that he could be merciful to all people.

So the only way out of the prison house of unbelief/disobeidence is by means of redemption through Christ. Thats why Jesus said to unbelieving jews Jn 8:36

If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Jesus was speaking of the power of His redemptive death, by it He would liberate men and women from unbelief/disobedience, which by nature all are confined to.

So if one Christ died for winds up in hell for their sins in unbelief Jn 8:24, that means His death failed the purpose of God, and yet how many false teachers would tell us that many for whom Christ died shall wind up in hell for their sins that He died for in the prison of unbelief. Such false teachers are against Christ, and serve their own lust and pride !

Perfectly stated!

Yes, that's antichrist!

Antichrist is the devil working through many men and women who are in opposition to the Word of Truth.

Just as Paul stated:

1 Cor. 16:9
For a great door and effectual is opened unto me, and there are many adversaries.

And also John:

1 John 2:18
Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

~~~~~

 

[beloved57]

Perfectly stated!

Yes, that's antichrist!

Antichrist is the devil working through many men and women who are in opposition to the Word of Truth.

Just as Paul stated:

1 Cor. 16:9
For a great door and effectual is opened unto me, and there are many adversaries.

And also John:

1 John 2:18
Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

~~~~~

The Christ we serve delivered us from unbelief ! Thats what redemption is all about !

 

[Nanja]

The Christ we serve delivered us from unbelief ! Thats what redemption is all about !

Amen! All whom Christ Purposed to redeem by His Covenant Death shall Believe the Truth 2 Thes. 2:13; Titus 2:14; Rom. 9:23.​

~~~~~