THE APOSTLES DID NOT PREACH THE SAME GOSPEL

DougE

Well-known member
Ephesians 6:19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,

The mystery of the gospel was revealed first to Paul.

Romans 16:25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,

16:26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

Paul and the twelve Apostles preached Christ. Paul preached Christ according to the mystery and the scriptures of the prophets. The twelve did not preach Christ according to the mystery.

Paul claims the gospel as being "my gospel", which distinguishes it from all others. Paul states his gospel was according to the mystery. The mystery was kept secret until revealed to Paul, which means the twelve Apostles could not have known it.

Paul's gospel is now made manifest.

Ephesians 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,

Paul was an Apostle to the Gentiles.

3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

God clearly states that there are dispensations. We are in the dispensation of the grace of God. Gentiles can now be saved freely, along with Jews, without the law and covenants. Gentiles no longer are seperated from Israel. Gentiles no longer have to come to God through Israel.

3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

Jesus revealed the mystery to Paul.

3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

The church, the body of Christ was revealed first to Paul.

Colossians 1:25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;

1:26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:

The mystery was hid even from the twelve disciples, but was made manifest to us by Paul.

Luke 18:31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

18:32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:

18:33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.

18:34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

Paul's gospel includes the death, burial, and the resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4). The twelve Apostles had no understanding of any of this according to Luke 18:34, even when Jesus told them of his death and resurrection in Luke 18:33 and in fact, it was hid from them. The twelve Apostles could not have been preaching the same gospel as Paul.

Matthew 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

Mark 1:14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,

1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.


Jesus was preaching the gospel of the promised Davidic kingdom (Luke 1:32).

Luke 9:1 Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.

9:2 And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.

9:6 And they departed, and went through the towns, preaching the gospel, and healing every where.

The twelve Apostles were not preaching the same gospel as Paul, but rather the gospel of the kingdom, which Paul never preached.

It is imperative to believe the gospel that was given to us and be justified unto eternal life.

The gospel has been progressively revealed throughout scripture. Those that believed the gospel revealed in their dispensations, believed God, and were justified unto eternal life (Romans 4:3). If you only believe that the kingdom is at hand (Mark 1:15), as preached by the twelve, you are lost. If you only believe in the name of Jesus, as preached by the twelve, that he is the Christ, the Son of God (John 20:31), you are lost. If you only believe you should repent and be baptized (Acts 2:38), as preached by the twelve, you are lost. If you only believe the gospels of the twelve Apostles you are lost.

The gospel given us in this dispensation is only found in the epistles of Paul; examples being Romans 3:19-26 and 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.
 
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Idolater

Well-known member
The mystery of the gospel was revealed only to Paul.
Can you quote that word-for-word in the Scripture somewhere?
Paul claims the gospel as being "my gospel", which distinguishes it from all others. Paul states his gospel was according to the mystery.
It could just be that Paul's "my gospel" is what we now call Luke. Luke and Paul knew each other, and they together wrote more than half the New Testament.
God clearly states that there are dispensations. We are in the dispensation of the grace of God. Gentiles can now be saved freely, along with Jews
Up to this point what you call Catholicism is equal to this.
, without the law and covenants.
Without the New Covenant? That part's Dispensationalism.
Gentiles no longer are seperated from Israel. Gentiles no longer have to come to God through Israel.
Again this is what you call Catholicism. And since it's Catholicism, and Catholicism is before Dispenationalism, then Dispensationalists who teach it are guilty of plagiarism, because you don't give credit where it's due.
The church, the body of Christ was revealed only to Paul.
Can you quote this word-for-word from Scripture?
Paul's gospel includes the death, burial, and the resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4).
Also, Luke includes those things.
The gospel given us in this dispensation is only found in the epistles of Paul; examples being Romans 3:19-26 and 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.
Luke was written for Gentiles.
 

Truster

New member
You are not wearing the belt of truth. You will have no comfort and you will fail to comfort others. The term gospel has no Hebrew or Greek root and does not convey what was spoken or written of in the Old nor the New Testament. You simply repeat the word parrot fashion and like a parrot you don't have a clue what it is you're speaking of.

"...wanting to be teachers of the Law, even though they do not understand either what they are saying or the matters about which they make confident assertions".
 

bibleverse2

New member
THE APOSTLES DID NOT PREACH THE SAME GOSPEL

Note that they did, or they would be cursed (Galatians 1:9).

The mystery of the gospel was revealed only to Paul.

Note that it wasn't, for the "mystery" in Romans 16:25-26 and Colossians 1:26 is "made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets" (Romans 16:26).

For example, Isaiah 49:6 and Isaiah 42:6 foretold that Jesus Christ's Gospel of the New Covenant (Matthew 26:28; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4), made only with Israel (Jeremiah 31:31-34), would save both Jewish and Gentile Christians (Acts 26:22-23, Luke 24:46-47). The New Covenant includes Gentile Christians by grafting them into Israel (Romans 11:17,24, Ephesians 2:12,19, Galatians 3:29, John 10:16).

Isaiah 49:6b started to be fulfilled at Jesus Christ's first coming (Luke 2:32, Acts 26:23), and His sending forth of His apostles to the Gentiles (Acts 13:47, Mark 16:15, Matthew 28:19-20, Acts 26:17-18, Acts 22:21).

Also, the apostle Paul quotes four Old Testament verses in Romans 15:9-12 which foretold the salvation of Gentiles (2 Samuel 22:50/Psalms 18:49, Deuteronomy 32:43, Psalms 117:1, Isaiah 11:10).

And God chose the apostle Peter to be the first apostle to take Jesus Christ's Gospel of salvation to Gentiles (Acts 15:7, Acts 10:34-48), to make Gentile Christians partakers of the Jews' spiritual things (Romans 15:27, John 4:22b), just as the apostle Paul sometimes preached the Gospel to Jews (Acts 13:16-41).

This mystery (Ephesians 3:4) is also explained in Ephesians 3:6, which means that Gentile Christians become fellowheirs with Jewish (Israelite) Christians, and of the same body as Israel, and partakers of God's promise in Jesus Christ made to Israel.

The church, the body of Christ was revealed only to Paul.

Note that it wasn't (Matthew 16:18, Matthew 18:17, James 5:14; 1 Peter 5:13; 3 John 1:6).

Paul's gospel includes the death, burial, and the resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4). The twelve Apostles had no understanding of any of this according to Luke 18:34, even when Jesus told them of his death and resurrection in Luke 18:33 and in fact, it was hid from them.

Note that both Jews and Gentiles are saved by believing the same Gospel (Romans 1:16), and this Gospel of Jesus Christ includes His suffering and dying for our sins, and His physical resurrection (Matthew 20:18-19, Matthew 20:28, Matthew 26:28). And this Gospel, which is the same as the apostle Paul's in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, was explained to the apostle Peter and the other apostles directly by Jesus Christ before the time of Peter's preaching in Acts (Luke 24:44-49). So the apostle Peter's subsequent preaching during the time of Acts would have included this Gospel, just as his writings did (1 Peter 2:24; 1 Peter 3:18). Just because Acts does not record the apostle Peter preaching this at the time of Acts does not mean that he did not, for Acts is not an exhaustive record of every word which was preached by Peter or the other apostles during that period of time.
 

DougE

Well-known member
Can you quote that word-for-word in the Scripture somewhere?
It could just be that Paul's "my gospel" is what we now call Luke. Luke and Paul knew each other, and they together wrote more than half the New Testament.
Up to this point what you call Catholicism is equal to this.
Without the New Covenant? That part's Dispensationalism.
Again this is what you call Catholicism. And since it's Catholicism, and Catholicism is before Dispenationalism, then Dispensationalists who teach it are guilty of plagiarism, because you don't give credit where it's due.
Can you quote this word-for-word from Scripture?
Also, Luke includes those things.
Luke was written for Gentiles.

Hello

"Paul's gospel includes the death, burial, and the resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4).
Also, Luke includes those things."

Can you please show me the passages you are speaking of
 

Hawkins

New member
The meaning of gospel can be multi-fold. Paul is the one who theorized about what the New Covenant is. That's the actual gospel to be preached.

The 4 gospels are actually eye-witnesses accounts of testimonies about Jesus' deeds and speeches. They are called the gospel from a different perspective. Paul's is a theology of revelation, while the 4 is a human witnessing.

Paul is one of the few humans who can theorize the New Covenant because he's a true Pharisee just as he described who he himself is. Perhaps that's why he's called upon by Jesus Christ.
 

Right Divider

Body part
The meaning of gospel can be multi-fold. Paul is the one who theorized about what the New Covenant is. That's the actual gospel to be preached.
That's just plain silly. God describes the new covenant in many places in scripture and He's not the slightest bit unclear about it.

The 4 gospels are actually eye-witnesses accounts of testimonies about Jesus' deeds and speeches. They are called the gospel from a different perspective. Paul's is a theology of revelation, while the 4 is a human witnessing.
There are other important differences.

  • The "4 gospels" document the minister of the circumcision and His dealing with His people Israel.
  • Paul documents NEW revelation about something that was kept secret since the world began but was NOW (at the time it was given to Paul) revealed.
Paul is one of the few humans who can theorize the New Covenant because he's a true Pharisee just as he claimed who he himself is. Perhaps that's why he's called upon by Jesus Christ.
Paul "theorized" nothing.
 

DougE

Well-known member
The mystery of the gospel was revealed only to Paul.
Can you quote that word-for-word in the Scripture somewhere?

Ephesians 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
Paul only says me

Paul claims the gospel as being "my gospel", which distinguishes it from all others. Paul states his gospel was according to the mystery.
It could just be that Paul's "my gospel" is what we now call Luke. Luke and Paul knew each other, and they together wrote more than half the New Testament.

That would mean he received it from Luke which is refuted by Galatians 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

God clearly states that there are dispensations. We are in the dispensation of the grace of God. Gentiles can now be saved freely, along with Jews
Up to this point what you call Catholicism is equal to this.

Can you elaborate on the above

, without the law and covenants.
Without the New Covenant? That part's Dispensationalism.

The new covenant will be made with the house of Israel and Judah (Jeremiah 31:31).


Gentiles no longer are separated from Israel. Gentiles no longer have to come to God through Israel.

Again this is what you call Catholicism. And since it's Catholicism, and Catholicism is before Dispenationalism, then Dispensationalists who teach it are guilty of plagiarism, because you don't give credit where it's due.

Again, please elaborate on the above
I will say that this is upheld in Ephesians 2:14 and Ephesians 2:12

The church, the body of Christ was revealed only to Paul.
Can you quote this word-for-word from Scripture?

The body of Christ was not mentioned in scripture until the epistles of Paul. The church was.


Paul's gospel includes the death, burial, and the resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4).

Also, Luke includes those things.

Please cite passages for the above


The gospel given us in this dispensation is only found in the epistles of Paul; examples being Romans 3:19-26 and 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.
Luke was written for Gentiles.
 

DougE

Well-known member
Can you quote that word-for-word in the Scripture somewhere?
It could just be that Paul's "my gospel" is what we now call Luke. Luke and Paul knew each other, and they together wrote more than half the New Testament.
Up to this point what you call Catholicism is equal to this.
Without the New Covenant? That part's Dispensationalism.
Again this is what you call Catholicism. And since it's Catholicism, and Catholicism is before Dispenationalism, then Dispensationalists who teach it are guilty of plagiarism, because you don't give credit where it's due.
Can you quote this word-for-word from Scripture?
Also, Luke includes those things.
Luke was written for Gentiles.

Hello

The mystery of the gospel was revealed only to Paul.
Can you quote that word-for-word in the Scripture somewhere?

Ephesians 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
Paul only says me


Paul claims the gospel as being "my gospel", which distinguishes it from all others. Paul states his gospel was according to the mystery.
It could just be that Paul's "my gospel" is what we now call Luke. Luke and Paul knew each other, and they together wrote more than half the New Testament.

That would mean he received it from Luke which is refuted by Galatians 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

God clearly states that there are dispensations. We are in the dispensation of the grace of God. Gentiles can now be saved freely, along with Jews
Up to this point what you call Catholicism is equal to this.

Can you elaborate on the above

, without the law and covenants.
Without the New Covenant? That part's Dispensationalism.

The new covenant will be made with the house of Israel and Judah (Jeremiah 31:31).

Gentiles no longer are separated from Israel. Gentiles no longer have to come to God through Israel.

Again this is what you call Catholicism. And since it's Catholicism, and Catholicism is before Dispenationalism, then Dispensationalists who teach it are guilty of plagiarism, because you don't give credit where it's due.

Again, please elaborate on the above
I will say that this is upheld in Ephesians 2:14 and Ephesians 2:12


The church, the body of Christ was revealed only to Paul.
Can you quote this word-for-word from Scripture?

The body of Christ was not mentioned in scripture until the epistles of Paul. The church was.


Paul's gospel includes the death, burial, and the resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4).

Also, Luke includes those things.

Please cite passages for the above

The gospel given us in this dispensation is only found in the epistles of Paul; examples being Romans 3:19-26 and 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.
Luke was written for Gentiles.
 

Hawkins

New member
That's just plain silly. God describes the new covenant in many places in scripture and He's not the slightest bit unclear about it.


There are other important differences.

  • The "4 gospels" document the minister of the circumcision and His dealing with His people Israel.
  • Paul documents NEW revelation about something that was kept secret since the world began but was NOW (at the time it was given to Paul) revealed.

Paul "theorized" nothing.

No, basically the theology of Christianity can be said to be theorized by Paul, as Paul's letters are the fundamental part of the theology.

The 4 gospels are accounts of testimonies of Jesus' deeds and speeches. Because it's all about how Jesus is eye-witnessed, it's not the place here to theorize anything. They are just plainly recordings of what is said and witnessed. John's gospel is a bit different and thus involves more theology contents.

The same can be said to Acts. Acts is more of the recordings of the apostles' deeds.

The theology itself starts with Paul's epistles. Romans contains a lot of in-depth theology contents about what the New Covenant is as a covenant. So are other epistles of Paul.

To put it another way, no apostles other than Paul can come up with what have been said in books such as Romans or Hebrews (if you accept that it's from Paul).

If you failed to speculate this, it's you who are plainly silly.
 

DougE

Well-known member
Note that they did, or they would be cursed (Galatians 1:9).

They were not cursed, they were not perverting Paul's gospel of Christ.

Note that it wasn't, for the "mystery" in Romans 16:25-26 and Colossians 1:26 is "made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets" (Romans 16:26).

Romans 16:25-26 is saying they would be stablished according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ according to (A) the revelation of the mystery AND by (B) the scriptures of the prophets


For example, Isaiah 49:6 and Isaiah 42:6 foretold that Jesus Christ's Gospel of the New Covenant (Matthew 26:28; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4), made only with Israel (Jeremiah 31:31-34), would save both Jewish and Gentile Christians (Acts 26:22-23, Luke 24:46-47).

This is all true but is not mystery it is prophecy


The New Covenant includes Gentile Christians by grafting them into Israel (Romans 11:17,24, Ephesians 2:12,19, Galatians 3:29, John 10:16).

The new covenant is for Israel. The gentiles will be blessed and taught by Israel.


Isaiah 49:6b started to be fulfilled at Jesus Christ's first coming (Luke 2:32, Acts 26:23), and His sending forth of His apostles to the Gentiles (Acts 13:47, Mark 16:15, Matthew 28:19-20, Acts 26:17-18, Acts 22:21).

Also, the apostle Paul quotes four Old Testament verses in Romans 15:9-12 which foretold the salvation of Gentiles (2 Samuel 22:50/Psalms 18:49, Deuteronomy 32:43, Psalms 117:1, Isaiah 11:10).

And God chose the apostle Peter to be the first apostle to take Jesus Christ's Gospel of salvation to Gentiles (Acts 15:7, Acts 10:34-48), to make Gentile Christians partakers of the Jews' spiritual things (Romans 15:27, John 4:22b), just as the apostle Paul sometimes preached the Gospel to Jews (Acts 13:16-41).

This mystery (Ephesians 3:4) is also explained in Ephesians 3:6, which means that Gentile Christians become fellowheirs with Jewish (Israelite) Christians, and of the same body as Israel, and partakers of God's promise in Jesus Christ made to Israel.



Note that it wasn't (Matthew 16:18, Matthew 18:17, James 5:14; 1 Peter 5:13; 3 John 1:6).



Note that both Jews and Gentiles are saved by believing the same Gospel (Romans 1:16), and this Gospel of Jesus Christ includes His suffering and dying for our sins, and His physical resurrection (Matthew 20:18-19, Matthew 20:28, Matthew 26:28). And this Gospel, which is the same as the apostle Paul's in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, was explained to the apostle Peter and the other apostles directly by Jesus Christ before the time of Peter's preaching in Acts (Luke 24:44-49). So the apostle Peter's subsequent preaching during the time of Acts would have included this Gospel, just as his writings did (1 Peter 2:24; 1 Peter 3:18). Just because Acts does not record the apostle Peter preaching this at the time of Acts does not mean that he did not, for Acts is not an exhaustive record of every word which was preached by Peter or the other apostles during that period of time.
 

DougE

Well-known member
Isaiah 49:6b started to be fulfilled at Jesus Christ's first coming (Luke 2:32, Acts 26:23), and His sending forth of His apostles to the Gentiles (Acts 13:47, Mark 16:15, Matthew 28:19-20, Acts 26:17-18, Acts 22:21).

This is all prophecy not mystery

Also, the apostle Paul quotes four Old Testament verses in Romans 15:9-12 which foretold the salvation of Gentiles (2 Samuel 22:50/Psalms 18:49, Deuteronomy 32:43, Psalms 117:1, Isaiah 11:10).

Again prophecy

And God chose the apostle Peter to be the first apostle to take Jesus Christ's Gospel of salvation to Gentiles (Acts 15:7, Acts 10:34-48), to make Gentile Christians partakers of the Jews' spiritual things (Romans 15:27, John 4:22b), just as the apostle Paul sometimes preached the Gospel to Jews (Acts 13:16-41).

This mystery (Ephesians 3:4) is also explained in Ephesians 3:6, which means that Gentile Christians become fellowheirs with Jewish (Israelite) Christians, and of the same body as Israel, and partakers of God's promise in Jesus Christ made to Israel.

Right and this was only revealed to Paul

I said "The church, the body of Christ was revealed only to Paul."

Note that it wasn't (Matthew 16:18, Matthew 18:17, James 5:14; 1 Peter 5:13; 3 John 1:6).

The church was in existence before Paul, but not the body of Christ

Note that both Jews and Gentiles are saved by believing the same Gospel (Romans 1:16), and this Gospel of Jesus Christ includes His suffering and dying for our sins, and His physical resurrection (Matthew 20:18-19, Matthew 20:28, Matthew 26:28). And this Gospel, which is the same as the apostle Paul's in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, was explained to the apostle Peter and the other apostles directly by Jesus Christ before the time of Peter's preaching in Acts (Luke 24:44-49).

In Luke 24:45 Jesus opens their understanding of the scriptures. The scriptures of 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 were not written yet nor was this gospel revealed to anyone yet, including Paul.

So the apostle Peter's subsequent preaching during the time of Acts would have included this Gospel, just as his writings did (1 Peter 2:24; 1 Peter 3:18).

1 Peter 2:24 and 3:18 are speaking of the new testament

Just because Acts does not record the apostle Peter preaching this at the time of Acts does not mean that he did not, for Acts is not an exhaustive record of every word which was preached by Peter or the other apostles during that period of time.[/QUOTE]

Hello

Part B response inserted above
 

Right Divider

Body part
No, basically the theology of Christianity can be said to be theorized by Paul, as Paul's letters are the fundamental part of the theology.
That's utter nonsense as Paul did not "theorize" anything.

The 4 gospels are accounts of testimonies of Jesus' deeds and speeches. Because it's all about how Jesus is eye-witnessed, it's not the place here to theorize anything. They are just plainly recordings of what is said and witnessed. John's gospel is a bit different and thus involves more theology contents.
Your idea of "theology contents" is way off.

The 4 "gospels" are a recording what the MINISTER OF THE CIRCUMCISION was doing with, through and among His people. Paul makes clear that during His early ministry, Jesus was A MINISTER OF THE CIRCUMCISION confirming the promises made to the fathers... the fathers are Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Israel)

The same can be said to Acts. Acts is more of the recordings of the apostles' deeds.
The book of the Acts of the apostles documents Israel's FALL and God revealing something different to and through the apostle Paul.

Take note of Luke's switching (in Acts 16) from accompanying the TWELVE and instead accompanying Paul and his group.

http://theologyonline.com/entry.php?3557-Luke-started-accompanying-Paul-beginning-in-Acts-16

The theology itself starts with Paul's epistles. Romans contains a lot of in-depth theology contents about what the New Covenant is as a covenant. So are other epistles of Paul.
The new covenant is between God and Israel, just like Jeremiah writes and Hebrews confirms.

To put it another way, no apostles other than Paul can come up with what have been said in books such as Romans or Hebrews (if you accept that it's from Paul).
I do not accept that Paul wrote Hebrews: http://theologyonline.com/entry.php?3512-Paul-did-not-write-Hebrews-we-do-not-know-who-did

If you failed to speculate this, it's you who are plainly silly.
I don't speculate; it's silly to speculate
 

DougE

Well-known member
Note that they did, or they would be cursed (Galatians 1:9).



Note that it wasn't, for the "mystery" in Romans 16:25-26 and Colossians 1:26 is "made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets" (Romans 16:26).

For example, Isaiah 49:6 and Isaiah 42:6 foretold that Jesus Christ's Gospel of the New Covenant (Matthew 26:28; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4), made only with Israel (Jeremiah 31:31-34), would save both Jewish and Gentile Christians (Acts 26:22-23, Luke 24:46-47). The New Covenant includes Gentile Christians by grafting them into Israel (Romans 11:17,24, Ephesians 2:12,19, Galatians 3:29, John 10:16).

Isaiah 49:6b started to be fulfilled at Jesus Christ's first coming (Luke 2:32, Acts 26:23), and His sending forth of His apostles to the Gentiles (Acts 13:47, Mark 16:15, Matthew 28:19-20, Acts 26:17-18, Acts 22:21).

Also, the apostle Paul quotes four Old Testament verses in Romans 15:9-12 which foretold the salvation of Gentiles (2 Samuel 22:50/Psalms 18:49, Deuteronomy 32:43, Psalms 117:1, Isaiah 11:10).

And God chose the apostle Peter to be the first apostle to take Jesus Christ's Gospel of salvation to Gentiles (Acts 15:7, Acts 10:34-48), to make Gentile Christians partakers of the Jews' spiritual things (Romans 15:27, John 4:22b), just as the apostle Paul sometimes preached the Gospel to Jews (Acts 13:16-41).

This mystery (Ephesians 3:4) is also explained in Ephesians 3:6, which means that Gentile Christians become fellowheirs with Jewish (Israelite) Christians, and of the same body as Israel, and partakers of God's promise in Jesus Christ made to Israel.



Note that it wasn't (Matthew 16:18, Matthew 18:17, James 5:14; 1 Peter 5:13; 3 John 1:6).



Note that both Jews and Gentiles are saved by believing the same Gospel (Romans 1:16), and this Gospel of Jesus Christ includes His suffering and dying for our sins, and His physical resurrection (Matthew 20:18-19, Matthew 20:28, Matthew 26:28). And this Gospel, which is the same as the apostle Paul's in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, was explained to the apostle Peter and the other apostles directly by Jesus Christ before the time of Peter's preaching in Acts (Luke 24:44-49). So the apostle Peter's subsequent preaching during the time of Acts would have included this Gospel, just as his writings did (1 Peter 2:24; 1 Peter 3:18). Just because Acts does not record the apostle Peter preaching this at the time of Acts does not mean that he did not, for Acts is not an exhaustive record of every word which was preached by Peter or the other apostles during that period of time.

PART B OF RESPONSE

Isaiah 49:6b started to be fulfilled at Jesus Christ's first coming (Luke 2:32, Acts 26:23), and His sending forth of His apostles to the Gentiles (Acts 13:47, Mark 16:15, Matthew 28:19-20, Acts 26:17-18, Acts 22:21).

This is all prophecy not mystery

Also, the apostle Paul quotes four Old Testament verses in Romans 15:9-12 which foretold the salvation of Gentiles (2 Samuel 22:50/Psalms 18:49, Deuteronomy 32:43, Psalms 117:1, Isaiah 11:10).

Again prophecy

And God chose the apostle Peter to be the first apostle to take Jesus Christ's Gospel of salvation to Gentiles (Acts 15:7, Acts 10:34-48), to make Gentile Christians partakers of the Jews' spiritual things (Romans 15:27, John 4:22b), just as the apostle Paul sometimes preached the Gospel to Jews (Acts 13:16-41).

This mystery (Ephesians 3:4) is also explained in Ephesians 3:6, which means that Gentile Christians become fellowheirs with Jewish (Israelite) Christians, and of the same body as Israel, and partakers of God's promise in Jesus Christ made to Israel.

Right and this was only revealed to Paul

I said "The church, the body of Christ was revealed only to Paul."

Note that it wasn't (Matthew 16:18, Matthew 18:17, James 5:14; 1 Peter 5:13; 3 John 1:6).

The church was in existence before Paul, but not the body of Christ

Note that both Jews and Gentiles are saved by believing the same Gospel (Romans 1:16), and this Gospel of Jesus Christ includes His suffering and dying for our sins, and His physical resurrection (Matthew 20:18-19, Matthew 20:28, Matthew 26:28). And this Gospel, which is the same as the apostle Paul's in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, was explained to the apostle Peter and the other apostles directly by Jesus Christ before the time of Peter's preaching in Acts (Luke 24:44-49).

In Luke 24:45 Jesus opens their understanding of the scriptures. The scriptures of 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 were not written yet nor was this gospel revealed to anyone yet, including Paul.

So the apostle Peter's subsequent preaching during the time of Acts would have included this Gospel, just as his writings did (1 Peter 2:24; 1 Peter 3:18).

1 Peter 2:24 and 3:18 are speaking of the new testament

Just because Acts does not record the apostle Peter preaching this at the time of Acts does not mean that he did not, for Acts is not an exhaustive record of every word which was preached by Peter or the other apostles during that period of time.[/QUOTE]
 

Hawkins

New member
That's utter nonsense as Paul did not "theorize" anything.


Your idea of "theology contents" is way off.

The 4 "gospels" are a recording what the MINISTER OF THE CIRCUMCISION was doing with, through and among His people. Paul makes clear that during His early ministry, Jesus was A MINISTER OF THE CIRCUMCISION confirming the promises made to the fathers... the fathers are Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Israel)


The book of the Acts of the apostles documents Israel's FALL and God revealing something different to and through the apostle Paul.

Take note of Luke's switching (in Acts 16) from accompanying the TWELVE and instead accompanying Paul and his group.

http://theologyonline.com/entry.php?3557-Luke-started-accompanying-Paul-beginning-in-Acts-16


The new covenant is between God and Israel, just like Jeremiah writes and Hebrews confirms.


I do not accept that Paul wrote Hebrews: http://theologyonline.com/entry.php?3512-Paul-did-not-write-Hebrews-we-do-not-know-who-did


I don't speculate; it's silly to speculate

You need to study more with other Christians, before you fart your nonsense. "Save by faith only" as a topic is theologically from Paul and Paul only.

It's Paul who theorized it under the revelation of Jesus Christ though.

You can choose to continue to live in denial and argue against the obvious though.

If you are lazy, you can start by reading the following,

https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionary/pauline-theology/


In order to understand the development of Paul's theological system, it is necessary to begin with his beliefs as a Pharisee....

Start with the above sentence then keep reading on why he has a theological system tied to who he is as a Pharisee!
 

Zeke

Well-known member
Ephesians 6:19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,

The mystery of the gospel was revealed only to Paul.

Romans 16:25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,

16:26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

Paul and the twelve Apostles preached Christ. Paul preached Christ according to the mystery and the scriptures of the prophets. The twelve did not preach Christ according to the mystery.

Paul claims the gospel as being "my gospel", which distinguishes it from all others. Paul states his gospel was according to the mystery. The mystery was kept secret until revealed to Paul, which means the twelve Apostles could not have known it.

Paul's gospel is now made manifest.

Ephesians 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,

Paul was an Apostle to the Gentiles.

3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

God clearly states that there are dispensations. We are in the dispensation of the grace of God. Gentiles can now be saved freely, along with Jews, without the law and covenants. Gentiles no longer are seperated from Israel. Gentiles no longer have to come to God through Israel.

3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

Jesus revealed the mystery to Paul.

3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

The church, the body of Christ was revealed only to Paul.

Colossians 1:25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;

1:26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:

The mystery was hid even from the twelve disciples, but was made manifest to us by Paul.

Luke 18:31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

18:32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:

18:33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.

18:34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

Paul's gospel includes the death, burial, and the resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4). The twelve Apostles had no understanding of any of this according to Luke 18:34, even when Jesus told them of his death and resurrection in Luke 18:33 and in fact, it was hid from them. The twelve Apostles could not have been preaching the same gospel as Paul.

Matthew 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

Mark 1:14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,

1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.


Jesus was preaching the gospel of the promised Davidic kingdom (Luke 1:32).

Luke 9:1 Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.

9:2 And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.

9:6 And they departed, and went through the towns, preaching the gospel, and healing every where.

The twelve Apostles were not preaching the same gospel as Paul, but rather the gospel of the kingdom, which Paul never preached.

It is imperative to believe the gospel that was given to us and be justified unto eternal life.

The gospel has been progressively revealed throughout scripture. Those that believed the gospel revealed in their dispensations, believed God, and were justified unto eternal life (Romans 4:3). If you only believe that the kingdom is at hand (Mark 1:15), as preached by the twelve, you are lost. If you only believe in the name of Jesus, as preached by the twelve, that he is the Christ, the Son of God (John 20:31), you are lost. If you only believe you should repent and be baptized (Acts 2:38), as preached by the twelve, you are lost. If you only believe the gospels of the twelve Apostles you are lost.

The gospel given us in this dispensation is only found in the epistles of Paul; examples being Romans 3:19-26 and 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.





The events "portrayed" (Galatians 4: 22For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. 23But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise. 24Which things are an allegory:.) in scriptures are dealing with the conscience and have no historic or specific race, gender, or class respected over another, the spirit blows where it wills according to the voice referred to as the Father of us all.

If one has left the first elements of belief behind the flesh version of Christ Romans 1:23, is no longer needed once the mystery of Christ in you is fully weighed against traditional doctrines that retain a mixture of flesh and religious spirit that require observation, 2 Corinthians 5:16Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more. 17Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new..

Luke 17:20And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: 21Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Only one division in scripture that makes it dead or alive, 2 Corinthians 3:
3Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

4And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward: 5Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God; 6Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

Psalms 40:6Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; mine ears hast thou opened: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.

7Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me,

8I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart. Galatians 4:1Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of all


If I AM be not raised in you (conscience), your still dead in your sins and looking for another to come in time, Hebrews 9:8The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing: 9Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;


1 Corinthians 3:16Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? Hebrews 9:24For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: Revelation 11:8, Acts 17:24.

All OT scripture is figurative,
(1{Maschil of Asaph.} Give ear, O my people, to my law: incline your ears to the words of my mouth.

2I will open my mouth in a parable: I will utter dark sayings of old:

3Which we have heard and known, and our fathers have told us.)

concerning the conscience of Christ hidden in man John 1:9That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. and that body temple is built without hands starting in the womb of darkness/flesh Matthew 11:11Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

Only one true gospel and one true divide since the foundation, spirit and flesh mentality, Christ slain from the foundation of world Revelation 13:8, not two thousand years ago as a carnal human sacrifice for a Father who judges no man John 5:22, Psalms 40:6.
 

turbosixx

New member
The gospel given us in this dispensation is only found in the epistles of Paul; examples being Romans 3:19-26 and 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.

Hi. If it's ok with you I would like to challenge your thinking on this. There are several things in your post I could address but to keep it simple I'd like to start with this.

Since Paul visited Corinth, how were they converted by Paul? What did he preach to them and what did they do in response to his preaching?
 

DougE

Well-known member
Hi. If it's ok with you I would like to challenge your thinking on this. There are several things in your post I could address but to keep it simple I'd like to start with this.

Since Paul visited Corinth, how were they converted by Paul? What did he preach to them and what did they do in response to his preaching?

Hello
Could you be more specific and give me chapter and verse you wish me to consider
 
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