Shalom. The 613 Commandments of the Torah should be observed by Jews, Israel.

[Jacob]

You are describing how the ancient Jewish calendar new moons were calculated. As I have explained to you in post #58 the modern Jewish calendar you use was created by Hillel II in 359 AD and uses a mathematical calculation rather than visually sighted new moon calculations. Here is a quote from a site that explains your modern Jewish calendar:

"In the fourth century, Hillel II established a fixed calendar based on mathematical and astronomical calculations. This calendar, still in use, standardised the length of months and the addition of months over the course of a 19 year cycle, so that the lunar calendar realigns with the solar years."

http://www.jewfaq.org/calendar.htm

No. The first month of the year is Aviv.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

No. The first month of the year is Aviv.

Yes and no. It's more complicated than that.

Aviv is Hebrew for Spring and is the the 1st month of the Religious and agricultural year. The Babylonian name which the Jews later adopted and still use sometimes is Nissan.

However month 7 called Ethanim in Hebrew which means beginning (and Tishri the adopted Babylonian name) is the beginning of the civil new year when Rosh Hashanah is celebrated. Originally this was month one but God changed the calendar months so that Aviv became month one, when he told Moses:

Exodus 12:2
"This month is to be for you the first month, the first month of your year."

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

No. The first month of the year is Aviv.

Yes and no. It's more complicated than that.

Aviv is Hebrew for Spring and is the the 1st month of the Religious and agricultural year. The Babylonian name which the Jews later adopted and still use sometimes is Nissan.

However month 7 called Ethanim in Hebrew which means beginning (and Tishri the adopted Babylonian name) is the beginning of the civil new year when Rosh Hashanah is celebrated. Originally this was month one but God changed the calendar months so that Aviv became month one, when he told Moses:

Exodus 12:2
"This month is to be for you the first month, the first month of your year."

You probably won't believe this but it is what happened.

 

[Caino]

Its the will of God that we do his will always. That's an eternal commandment. God is a Father not a local magistrate. Reducing that will to a collection of humanly extrapolated "commandments" reduces God to a mere formula.

 

[Jacob]

Yes and no. It's more complicated than that.

Aviv is Hebrew for Spring and is the the 1st month of the Religious and agricultural year. The Babylonian name which the Jews later adopted and still use sometimes is Nissan.

However month 7 called Ethanim in Hebrew which means beginning (and Tishri the adopted Babylonian name) is the beginning of the civil new year when Rosh Hashanah is celebrated. Originally this was month one but God changed the calendar months so that Aviv became month one, when he told Moses:

Exodus 12:2
"This month is to be for you the first month, the first month of your year."

I do not know that you are correct. Did you know that Ethanim has nothing to do with Rosh Hashanah?

Shalom.

Jacob

 

[Jacob]

Yes and no. It's more complicated than that.

Aviv is Hebrew for Spring and is the the 1st month of the Religious and agricultural year. The Babylonian name which the Jews later adopted and still use sometimes is Nissan.

However month 7 called Ethanim in Hebrew which means beginning (and Tishri the adopted Babylonian name) is the beginning of the civil new year when Rosh Hashanah is celebrated. Originally this was month one but God changed the calendar months so that Aviv became month one, when he told Moses:

Exodus 12:2
"This month is to be for you the first month, the first month of your year."

You probably won't believe this but it is what happened.

Already answered.

 

[Jacob]

Its the will of God that we do his will always. That's an eternal commandment. God is a Father not a local magistrate. Reducing that will to a collection of humanly extrapolated "commandments" reduces God to a mere formula.

God did give us commandments to follow and observe.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

I do not know that you are correct. Did you know that Ethanim has nothing to do with Rosh Hashanah?

Shalom.

Jacob

I am correct you can go check it on the internet.

Ethanim is just the name of month 7 (AKA Tishri) while Rosh Hashanah means 'The Head of the Year' and is day 1 of Month 7; New Years Day.

 

[Jacob]

I am correct you can go check it on the internet.

Ethanim is just the name of month 7 (AKA Tishri) while Rosh Hashanah means 'The Head of the Year' and is day 1 of Month 7; New Years Day.

No. Ethanim is the seventh month. The Torah says that the first day of the seventh month is Yom Teruah. The name Ethanim came before Babylon I believe.

 

[Caino]

God did give us commandments to follow and observe.

Those commandments that you are referring to were a byproduct of primitive evolutionary religion, not directly from God. All religious cultures around the world have similar commandments which grew out of their evolutionary religion. The priestly authors of scripture wrote about the natural evolution of those commandments as if God sent them down from heaven.

Today progressive civilization does not favor stoning people to death for various minor infractions.

 

[Jacob]

Those commandments that you are referring to were a byproduct of primitive evolutionary religion, not directly from God. All religious cultures around the world have similar commandments which grew out of their evolutionary religion. The priestly authors of scripture wrote about the natural evolution of those commandments as if God sent them down from heaven.

Today progressive civilization does not favor stoning people to death for various minor infractions.

I believe that you are talking about ideas that are barriers to belief. They are simply untrue.

 

[Caino]

I believe that you are talking about ideas that are barriers to belief. They are simply untrue.

Before Moses, there was some other scripture and rituals.

One can have faith and do Gods will quite apart from religion. In fact, scripture worship became a block to belief in the Son of God when he was on the earth as well as every other prophet that came before him who were mistreated by "religious people."

 

[Jacob]

Before Moses, there was some other scripture and rituals.

One can have faith and do Gods will quite apart from religion. In fact, scripture worship became a block to belief in the Son of God when he was on the earth as well as every other prophet that came before him who were mistreated by "religious people."

I hope you do not reject the Torah for reason that some people are viewed as worshipping Scripture.

 

[Caino]

I hope you do not reject the Torah for reason that some people are viewed as worshipping Scripture.

I reject the Torah because it is predominantly a usurpation of Mesipotamian lore and the deliberate exaggeration of the history of the Jewish people. After the loss of their nationalist pride and once again in bondage in Babylon, the priestly redactors attempted the complete recasting of Israelite history by converting secular history into a miraculous fiction! Being unable to trace their bloodlines back to the Adam of Mesipotamian legand, they decided to drown the whole world in its own wickedness to fill the gap. The Old Testament was an attempt to buttress the faith of the then scattered and dejected Israelite. It worked to hold them together but had a disastrous effect on their latter history as an arrogant "chosen people."

 

[Jacob]

I reject the Torah because it is predominantly a usurpation of Mesipotamian lore and he deliberate exaggeration of the history if the Jewish people. After the loss of their nationalist pride and once again in bondage in Babylon, the priestly redactors attempted the complete recasting of Israelite history by converting secular history into a miraculous fiction! Being unable to trace their bloodlines back to the Adam of Mesipotamian legand, they decided to drown the whole world in its own wickedness to fill the gap. The Old Testament was an attempt to buttress the faith of the then scattered and dejected Israelite. It worked to hold them together but had a disastrous effect on their latter history as an arrogant "chosen people."

To the contrary I know that you are simply incorrect.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

No. Ethanim is the seventh month. The Torah says that the first day of the seventh month is Yom Teruah. The name Ethanim came before Babylon I believe.

I said: "Ethanim is just the name of month 7"

Your response: "No. Ethanim is the seventh month."

God actually originally only listed the months 1 to 12 without names. The Hebrew name Ethanim was not given to it till later when we read;

1 Kings 8:2
All the Israelites came together to King Solomon at the time of the festival in the month of Ethanim, the seventh month.


I said: "Rosh Hashanah means 'The Head of the Year' and is day 1 of Month 7; New Years Day."

Your response: "The Torah says that the first day of the seventh month is Yom Teruah."

I agree because Rosh Hashanah has many names including Yom Teruah (Day of Trumpets).


You said: "The name Ethanim came before Babylon I believe."

I agree and the Babylonian name is Tishri.

 

[Caino]

To the contrary I know that you are simply incorrect.

Of coarse Jacob, that's what they want you to say with complete sincerity! In Islam the shamans want their adherents to say the same thing, as well as all predominantly man made religions wherein the priestly elite convince the unsuspecting that the things they write came down from God.

No other culture on earth seems to remember a great grandpa Noah except the people who invented the story!

 

[Jacob]

I said: "Ethanim is just the name of month 7"

Your response: "No. Ethanim is the seventh month."

God actually originally only listed the months 1 to 12 without names. The Hebrew name Ethanim was not given to it till later when we read;

1 Kings 8:2
All the Israelites came together to King Solomon at the time of the festival in the month of Ethanim, the seventh month.


I said: "Rosh Hashanah means 'The Head of the Year' and is day 1 of Month 7; New Years Day."

Your response: "The Torah says that the first day of the seventh month is Yom Teruah."

I agree because Rosh Hashanah has many names including Yom Teruah (Day of Trumpets).


You said: "The name Ethanim came before Babylon I believe."

I agree and the Babylonian name is Tishri.

Rosh Hashanah came later. It is not found in the Torah. Only months one, two, seven, and eight have names.

 

[Jacob]

Of coarse Jacob, that's what they want you to say with complete sincerity! In Islam the shamans want their adherents to say the same thing, as well as all predominantly man made religions wherein the priestly elite convince the unsuspecting that the things they write came down from God.

No other culture on earth seems to remember a great grandpa Noah except the people who invented the story!

I do not want to argue with or against you. I believe that you are wrong. I would love to help.

Shalom.

Jacob

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Rosh Hashanah came later. It is not found in the Torah. Only months one, two, seven, and eight have names.

Yes, shalom.