Satan, Inc (TOL's heretic's list)

[freelight]

points of view......

points of view......

to prove that you are able to think for yourself
you have to actually take a position on something

But 'positions' are just points of view, an angle or perspective, an opinion or belief, an assumption. There is a pure living awareness that is prior to and from which all points of view arise,....I enjoy abiding in that. 'That' is beyond all points of view. It is pure 'Light' or pure 'Being', free of interpretation, free of the minds impositions - otherwise, my 'perspectives' and 'positions' reflecting views that are more tenable to my intellect are amply shared here, but they are only 'relative' to the subjects engaged. - they are just a play in the mind, thoughts 'relating' to other thoughts.



pj

 

[BetweenTheRivers]

I would like to volunteer to be a candidate for list number one.

The 'Jesus is not God' people (Non-trinitarians)

 

[Ktoyou]

Thats a rhetorical question, hes actually teaching against that kind of behavior, not saying he is teaching lies. Read it in context.

This actually pertains to James, who many find confusing. The real deal here is all those saved, still are not free from sin, rather they are in Grace, thus will be washed by the blood of Christ, made clean and do God’s good will. This is where James comes in, saying, in effect, we know them by their fruits, the saved do what is good and avoid evil.

 

[YahuShuan]

Shabbat Shalom.

 

[chrysostom]

But 'positions' are just points of view, an angle or perspective, an opinion or belief, an assumption. There is a pure living awareness that is prior to and from which all points of view arise,....I enjoy abiding in that. 'That' is beyond all points of view. It is pure 'Light' or pure 'Being', free of interpretation, free of the minds impositions - otherwise, my 'perspectives' and 'positions' reflecting views that are more tenable to my intellect are amply shared here, but they are only 'relative' to the subjects engaged. - they are just a play in the mind, thoughts 'relating' to other thoughts.



pj

like a sponge that holds water

has nothing once squeezed

 

[Padre Vorbis]

Eris approves of this thread.

 

[Choleric]

I would like to volunteer to be a candidate for list number one.

The 'Jesus is not God' people (Non-trinitarians)

Have to be around for a good while and have a few more posts than "2". However, you could get the ball rolling by stating your particular heresy plainly for us all to read.

:thumb:

 

[oatmeal]

Judge not, lest u be judged, for by what measure you mete, so shall it be meted unto you"

looks like maybe you should start giving people a little of the old

benefit of the doubt

4 your own sake if nothing else

That is one great post!

 

[freelight]

reality alone is real

reality alone is real

like a sponge that holds water

has nothing once squeezed

Not sure the 'analogy' here fits

I have opinions, points of view, preferential beliefs in certain values, meanings, religious principles, concepts, philosophical ideals, etc....but I recognize them as being just that. I would hope to recognize 'opinions' or 'points of view' as being only temporal and relative to the subjects being considered. All points of view are subject to change.

A 'heretic' is one courageous enough to 'think' and 'choose' for himself, instead of letting others be a religious 'authority' for them. Each must discover 'truth' or 'reality' for themselves, since that reality is ever at hand.

I shared an illuminating passage from J. Krishnamurti, on 'truth' being a path-less land....here - this view does away with all 'paths', 'ways', 'denominations', 'organizations'...to consider the truth that is already always within one's own being. A good question to ask, is "Am I truly unconditionally and absolutely free?" (this would mean free of all beliefs, dogmas, opinions, assumptions that actually hinder one's realization of what 'truth' is).



pj

 

[BetweenTheRivers]

Have to be around for a good while and have a few more posts than "2". However, you could get the ball rolling by stating your particular heresy plainly for us all to read.

:thumb:

Yahshua is the son of God.

While that may not be the popular teaching, it is what we are told in the Holy Bible.

If Yahshua was God Himself, then the Crucifixion and resurrection gets reduced to a cheap parlor trick.

 

[Angel4Truth]

Yahshua is the son of God.

While that may not be the popular teaching, it is what we are told in the Holy Bible.

If Yahshua was God Himself, then the Crucifixion and resurrection gets reduced to a cheap parlor trick.

How so? Being made flesh and being tempted in every point like we yet remaining without sin, is no trick, im not thinking being whipped into oblivion and then crucified and experiencing the sin of the world placed on you and feeling separated from the Father while it was done was no picnic, and then experiencing death?

It would only be a trick if He were never made flesh like we, nor tempted like we.

Hebrews 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

I guess you think the fear in His flesh tempted such as we, asking to let this cup pass from Him while He sweated blood, was also just a trick too.

Christ laid His own life down and took it up again Himself, Can a man take up His own life from death?

 

[chrysostom]

Not sure the 'analogy' here fits

I have opinions, points of view, preferential beliefs in certain values, meanings, religious principles, concepts, philosophical ideals, etc....but I recognize them as being just that. I would hope to recognize 'opinions' or 'points of view' as being only temporal and relative to the subjects being considered. All points of view are subject to change.

how do you recognize opinion?
if
you do not recognize what is not

 

[freelight]

Opinions.....

Opinions.....

how do you recognize opinion?
if
you do not recognize what is not

An 'opinion' is just that, an opinion among many other opinions. How one recognizes that which is not an 'opinion' is by abondoning all opinions.

~*~*~

Q: What is left when all opinions, concepts, assumptions about 'reality' are dropped?

A: Reality itself.








pj

 

[csuguy]

An 'opinion' is just that, an opinion among many other opinions. How one recognizes that which is not an 'opinion' is by abondoning all opinions.

~*~*~

Q: What is left when all opinions, concepts, assumptions about 'reality' are dropped?

A: Reality itself.

pj

Is that your opinion?

 

[freelight]

beyond words......

beyond words......

Is that your opinion?

Its an observation that an 'opinion' about 'reality' is not 'reality' itself.
But this inquiry perhaps transcends the scope of this thread.




pj

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Christ laid His own life down and took it up again Himself, Can a man take up His own life from death?

No. A dead man cannot raise himself from the dead.(but then you deny his death, by your saying He went somewhere to preach to dead people)

The Bible says His Father raised Jesus from the dead and by the everlasting covenant too.

You can not discern that it was the Father in Jesus who said "destroy this temple and I will raise it up in three days"

Heb 13:20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

LA

 

[Angel4Truth]

No. A dead man cannot raise himself from the dead.(but then you deny his death, by your saying He went somewhere to preach to dead people)

1 Peter 3:18-20 I'm guess you think that the souls there means living people wrongly. Tell me how someone who perished in the floods soul was alive in prison after Christ was put to death like it says.

As to the rest of your post, Christ said He chose to lay down His own life and take it up again.

John 10:18 "No one has taken it away from Me, but I lay it down on My own initiative. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This commandment I received from My Father."

Now I've already debated annihilation with you in another thread, so lets not take this one off topic.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

1 Peter 3:18-20 I'm guess you think that the souls there means living people wrongly. Tell me how someone who perished in the floods soul was alive in prison after Christ was put to death like it says.

The verses state that the spirit of Christ witnessed to those who lived in the time of Noah when the ark was being made.

It is another case of it not being Jesus who spoke to them , it was God by the Spirit.

Noah was a preacher of righteousness.

2Pe 2:5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;

As to the rest of your post, Christ said He chose to lay down His own life and take it up again.

John 10:18 "No one has taken it away from Me, but I lay it down on My own initiative. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This commandment I received from My Father."

According to this verse God gave Him command, but it is not command it is direction.

The verse means He was to lay down His life and He would receive it back again. It does not mean that He would raise Himself from the dead.

Now I've already debated annihilation with you in another thread, so lets not take this one off topic.

Okay then, you are a heretic.

Chloric is a heretic, and you are all going to Disney Land where you belong.

LA

 

[BetweenTheRivers]

How so? Being made flesh and being tempted in every point like we yet remaining without sin, is no trick, im not thinking being whipped into oblivion and then crucified and experiencing the sin of the world placed on you and feeling separated from the Father while it was done was no picnic, and then experiencing death?

It would only be a trick if He were never made flesh like we, nor tempted like we.

Hebrews 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

I guess you think the fear in His flesh tempted such as we, asking to let this cup pass from Him while He sweated blood, was also just a trick too.

Christ laid His own life down and took it up again Himself, Can a man take up His own life from death?

Please, if I have not made a specific statement, don't write things such as "I guess you think." Rather than guess at anything I think, please ask me what I think or rely on what I have actually stated.

I have not questioned the suffering Yahshua faced, that was all real, there is no question in my mind about the suffering he endured for all of us. However, if Yahshua was God incarnate, YHWH in a human body, then he would know he cannot die. Any form of execution would then simply be for show because no human can kill God.

The old covenant was based on a strict adherence of the Mosaic laws. The new covenant is based on faith, we must have the same faith in Yahshua that he had in his Father. He put his complete trust in YHWH to restore him once he had turned over his life and said, it is finished.

 

[Angel4Truth]

Please, if I have not made a specific statement, don't write things such as "I guess you think." Rather than guess at anything I think, please ask me what I think or rely on what I have actually stated.

I have not questioned the suffering Yahshua faced, that was all real, there is no question in my mind about the suffering he endured for all of us. However, if Yahshua was God incarnate, YHWH in a human body, then he would know he cannot die. Any form of execution would then simply be for show because no human can kill God.

The old covenant was based on a strict adherence of the Mosaic laws. The new covenant is based on faith, we must have the same faith in Yahshua that he had in his Father. He put his complete trust in YHWH to restore him once he had turned over his life and said, it is finished.

He didn't die spiritually, only physically. Its what He came to do. By what authority or scripture do you use to determine that God could not die physically?