Sabbath

[Jacob]

I said
Yes, if you are in Christ. The law of Christ(new testament)delivers us from the old testament law.

[Rom 2:12-14
[12] For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law
[13] (for not the hearers of the law [are] just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
[14] for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,

Does this mean that once you are observing the new testament law you are not transgressing the old covenant law?

 

[Rosenritter]

I said
no. The law is still in affect for the whole world. Christians are the only ones who have been delivered from the law.

Can you show where the Gentiles entered into a covenant to observe the law of Moses?

 

[Squeaky]

Does this mean that once you are observing the new testament law you are not transgressing the old covenant law?

I said
Sort of. Once you are obeying the new testament law of Christ, your not transgressing the old testament law.

 

[Squeaky]

Can you show where the Gentiles entered into a covenant to observe the law of Moses?

I said
No they never did.

[Act 15:24-27
[24] Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, "[You must] be circumcised and keep the law"--to whom we gave no [such] commandment--
[25] it seemed good to us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,
[26] men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
[27] We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who will also report the same things by word of mouth.

 

[Jacob]

I said
Sort of. Once you are obeying the new testament law of Christ, your not transgressing the old testament law.

Is that because it no longer applies or because obedience to the new covenant law involves obedience to the old covenant law the Law of Moses? Or, does the new testament transcend or surpass the Law of Moses (are you observing it even when you are not)?

 

[Squeaky]

Is that because it no longer applies or because obedience to the new covenant law involves obedience to the old covenant law the Law of Moses? Or, does the new testament transcend or surpass the Law of Moses (are you observing it even when you are not)?

I said
The Jews were useing the law on each other. When they should have been useing it on themselves.

[Rom 2:14-24
[14] for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,
[15] who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves [their] thoughts accusing or else excusing [them])
[16] in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.
[17] Indeed you are called a Jew, and rest on the law, and make your boast in God,
[18] and know [His] will, and approve the things that are excellent, being instructed out of the law,
[19] and are confident that you yourself are a guide to the blind, a light to those who are in darkness,
[20] an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, having the form of knowledge and truth in the law.
[21] You, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that a man should not steal, do you steal?
[22] You who say, "Do not commit adultery," do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?
[23] You who make your boast in the law, do you dishonor God through breaking the law?
[24] For "the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you," as it is written.

 

[Jacob]

I said
The Jews were useing the law on each other. When they should have been useing it on themselves.

[Rom 2:14-24
[14] for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,
[15] who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves [their] thoughts accusing or else excusing [them])
[16] in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.
[17] Indeed you are called a Jew, and rest on the law, and make your boast in God,
[18] and know [His] will, and approve the things that are excellent, being instructed out of the law,
[19] and are confident that you yourself are a guide to the blind, a light to those who are in darkness,
[20] an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, having the form of knowledge and truth in the law.
[21] You, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that a man should not steal, do you steal?
[22] You who say, "Do not commit adultery," do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?
[23] You who make your boast in the law, do you dishonor God through breaking the law?
[24] For "the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you," as it is written.

When I reflect upon the Law, I realize that I am not observing all that I have, and that of what I have that was not all that I could, though it is money or possessions that currently prevent me.

 

[clefty]

Interesting. Messiah means anointed.

yes and in greek christos....neither of which are proper names so its not Mr Jesus Christ...or Yahushua HaMashiach...

Unless the new covenant came with or after His death.

it became into force at the death of the TESTATOR...SEALED no changes to it possible...even in secular law a last will and testament may not be changed by the fighting families...

We know that the Law is good. So why would we ever speak against it? We shouldn't. But we should be able to speak of it, such as the Law made nothing perfect.

sure...I delight in the Law as a pirate would his treasure map...but even MORE the One it brings me to

I am thinking about how there is the death and resurrection of Jesus. His burial in between. After His resurrection His appearing to many and then His ascension to the right hand of the Father.

yes after His death and His burial the Sabbath...the tomb found empty the next day first day...early...He was risen indeed...the previous day on the Sabbath...

Perhaps.

sad even jews are more exited about the seventh day sabbath than YOU WHO HAS LORD OF THE SABBATH

Very good.

so yes the first full day in the New Covenant Age was a Sabbath...

I do not know why I would not identify as a Jew.

that had been long established...but now you are NOT IN HIM...as IN HIM there is no jew...

 

[Squeaky]

yes and in greek christos....neither of which are proper names so its not Mr Jesus Christ...or Yahushua HaMashiach...

it became into force at the death of the TESTATOR...SEALED no changes to it possible...even in secular law a last will and testament may not be changed by the fighting families...

sure...I delight in the Law as a pirate would his treasure map...but even MORE the One it brings me to

yes after His death and His burial the Sabbath...the tomb found empty the next day first day...early...He was risen indeed...the previous day on the Sabbath...

sad even jews are more exited about the seventh day sabbath than YOU WHO HAS LORD OF THE SABBATH

so yes the first full day in the New Covenant Age was a Sabbath...

that had been long established...but now you are NOT IN HIM...as IN HIM there is no jew...

I said
But after Christ came we are no longer under the old testament.

[Gal 3:24-25
[24] Therefore the law was our tutor [to bring us] to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[25] But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

 

[clefty]

I said
But after Christ came we are no longer under the old testament.

[Gal 3:24-25
[24] Therefore the law was our tutor [to bring us] to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[25] But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

Yes because when Squeaky graduated from his tutor...he realized his tutor wasnt around anymore so he did whatever he wanted...whenever...with the tutor he learned 2+2=4 but without the tutor it became 2+2= dog returning to its illiterate vomit...

 

[Rosenritter]

When I reflect upon the Law, I realize that I am not observing all that I have, and that of what I have that was not all that I could, though it is money or possessions that currently prevent me.

Do you tithe one tenth of all your agricultural increase that you receive from your land in Canaan?

 

[Jacob]

yes and in greek christos....neither of which are proper names so its not Mr Jesus Christ...or Yahushua HaMashiach...

Yeshua HaMashiach means Jesus the Christ, where Messiah and Christ mean anointed. HaMashiach is the Messiah.

it became into force at the death of the TESTATOR...SEALED no changes to it possible...even in secular law a last will and testament may not be changed by the fighting families...

I am not sure what to say here.

sure...I delight in the Law as a pirate would his treasure map...but even MORE the One it brings me to

Oh. That is good.

yes after His death and His burial the Sabbath...the tomb found empty the next day first day...early...He was risen indeed...the previous day on the Sabbath...

Such is what is said.

sad even jews are more exited about the seventh day sabbath than YOU WHO HAS LORD OF THE SABBATH

We have much reason to be convinced about the Sabbath.

so yes the first full day in the New Covenant Age was a Sabbath...

How would that be three days and not two?

that had been long established...but now you are NOT IN HIM...as IN HIM there is no jew...

I don't know where you are going with this.

 

[Jacob]

Do you tithe one tenth of all your agricultural increase that you receive from your land in Canaan?

Great! A commandment! I do not have any agricultural increase personally. I do not live in the land of Canaan. I do believe that if the Law is not abolished that we should observe this commandment.

 

[Rosenritter]

Great! A commandment! I do not have any agricultural increase personally. I do not live in the land of Canaan. I do believe that if the Law is not abolished that we should observe this commandment.

I was just checking. Even if the law was not abolished, that law (of tithing from the land) only applied within the land that was promised to Jacob's descendants.

 

[clefty]

I said
Sort of. Once you are obeying the new testament law of Christ, your not transgressing the old testament law.

BINGO!!!

There ya go me boy Squeaky....

I knew you understood...

so when you gonna obey the New Testament He taught and demonstrated before He was killed thus SEALING IT? not changing or abolishing it...

 

[clefty]

I said
No they never did.

[Act 15:24-27
[24] Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, "[You must] be circumcised and keep the law"--to whom we gave no [such] commandment--
[25] it seemed good to us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,
[26] men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
[27] We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who will also report the same things by word of mouth.

Oh my...

All this

Leviticus 19:34

The stranger who resides with you shall be to you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt; I am the LORD your God.

Exodus 12:49
Verse Concepts
"The same law shall apply to the native as to the stranger who sojourns among you."

Leviticus 24:22
Verse Concepts
'There shall be one standard for you; it shall be for the stranger as well as the native, for I am the LORD your God.'"

Numbers 9:14
Verse Concepts
'If an alien sojourns among you and observes the Passover to the LORD, according to the statute of the Passover and according to its ordinance, so he shall do; you shall have one statute, both for the alien and for the native of the land.'"

Numbers 15:14
Verse Concepts
'If an alien sojourns with you, or one who may be among you throughout your generations, and he wishes to make an offering by fire, as a soothing aroma to the LORD, just as you do so he shall do.

Numbers 15:15
Verse Concepts
'As for the assembly, there shall be one statute for you and for the alien who sojourns with you, a perpetual statute throughout your generations; as you are, so shall the alien be before the LORD.

Numbers 15:16
Verse Concepts
'There is to be one law and one ordinance for you and for the alien who sojourns with you.'"

Numbers 15:29
Verse Concepts
'You shall have one law for him who does anything unintentionally, for him who is native among the sons of Israel and for the alien who sojourns among them.

Deuteronomy 1:16
Verse Concepts
"Then I charged your judges at that time, saying, 'Hear the cases between your fellow countrymen, and judge righteously between a man and his fellow countryman, or the alien who is with him.

Deuteronomy 24:14
Verse Concepts
"You shall not oppress a hired servant who is poor and needy, whether he is one of your countrymen or one of your aliens who is in your land in your towns.

Leviticus 18:26
Verse Concepts
'But as for you, you are to keep My statutes and My judgments and shall not do any of these abominations, neither the native, nor the alien who sojourns among you

Exodus 12:19
Verse Concepts
'Seven days there shall be no leaven found in your houses; for whoever eats what is leavened, that person shall be cut off from the congregation of Israel, whether he is an alien or a native of the land.

Exodus 20:10
Verse Concepts
but the seventh day is a sabbath of the LORD your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter, your male or your female servant or your cattle or your sojourner who stays with you.

Deuteronomy 5:14
Verse Concepts
but the seventh day is a sabbath of the LORD your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter or your male servant or your female servant or your ox or your donkey or any of your cattle or your sojourner who stays with you, so that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you.

Leviticus 16:29
Verse Concepts
"This shall be a permanent statute for you: in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall humble your souls and not do any work, whether the native, or the alien who sojourns among you;

Leviticus 17:8
Verse Concepts
"Then you shall say to them, 'Any man from the house of Israel, or from the aliens who sojourn among them, who offers a burnt offering or sacrifice,

Leviticus 17:10
Verse Concepts
'And any man from the house of Israel, or from the aliens who sojourn among them, who eats any blood, I will set My face against that person who eats blood and will cut him off from among his people.

Leviticus 22:18
"Speak to Aaron and to his sons and to all the sons of Israel and say to them, 'Any man of the house of Israel or of the aliens in Israel who presents his offering, whether it is any of their votive or any of their freewill offerings, which they present to the LORD for a burnt offering--

Leviticus 17:13
Verse Concepts
"So when any man from the sons of Israel, or from the aliens who sojourn among them, in hunting catches a beast or a bird which may be eaten, he shall pour out its blood and cover it with earth.

Leviticus 24:16
Verse Concepts
'Moreover, the one who blasphemes the name of the LORD shall surely be put to death; all the congregation shall certainly stone him. The alien as well as the native, when he blasphemes the Name, shall be put to death.

Numbers 15:26
'So all the congregation of the sons of Israel will be forgiven, with the alien who sojourns among them, for it happened to all the people through error.

Numbers 35:15
Verse Concepts
'These six cities shall be for refuge for the sons of Israel, and for the alien and for the sojourner among them; that anyone who kills a person unintentionally may flee there.

Joshua 20:9
Verse Concepts
These were the appointed cities for all the sons of Israel and for the stranger who sojourns among them, that whoever kills any person unintentionally may flee there, and not die by the hand of the avenger of blood until he stands before the congregation.

Numbers 19:10
Verse Concepts
'The one who gathers the ashes of the heifer shall wash his clothes and be unclean until evening; and it shall be a perpetual statute to the sons of Israel and to the alien who sojourns among them.

Says otherwise...

Especially

Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

The irony

This was NEVER TAUGHT IN THE OT:

"[You must] be circumcised...” is why they said --to whom we gave no [such] commandment--

 

[Squeaky]

Yes because when Squeaky graduated from his tutor...he realized his tutor wasnt around anymore so he did whatever he wanted...whenever...with the tutor he learned 2+2=4 but without the tutor it became 2+2= dog returning to its illiterate vomit...

I said
lolol A tutor is always temporary, until the teacher shows up. The Teacher was now here. Jesus.

[Mat 8:19
[19] Then a certain scribe came and said to Him, "Teacher, I will follow You wherever You go."
[Mat 9:11
[11] And when the Pharisees saw [it], they said to His disciples, "Why does your Teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?"
[Mat 10:24
[24] "A disciple is not above [his] teacher, nor a servant above his master.

 

[Squeaky]

BINGO!!!

There ya go me boy Squeaky....

I knew you understood...

so when you gonna obey the New Testament He taught and demonstrated before He was killed thus SEALING IT? not changing or abolishing it...

I said
Jesus sealed the new testament.

 

[clefty]

I said
lolol A tutor is always temporary, until the teacher shows up. The Teacher was now here. Jesus.

[Mat 8:19
[19] Then a certain scribe came and said to Him, "Teacher, I will follow You wherever You go."
[Mat 9:11
[11] And when the Pharisees saw [it], they said to His disciples, "Why does your Teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?"
[Mat 10:24
[24] "A disciple is not above [his] teacher, nor a servant above his master.

How many math teachers when they show up teach contrary to the laws of math? Or that the math laws are no more “cuz I am here now!!!”

You make Yahushua the one in the book of Daniel who would think to change both times and Law...”THINK NOT”

 

[clefty]

I said
Jesus sealed the new testament.

Duh...double duh

So when you going to live the way He did sealing it? And establish it like Paul said you are to?