Once saved NOT necessarily always saved.

iouae

iouae

Well-known member
heir said:
James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
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So when James called them "brethren" they are not Christians?
So you divide up the NT into bits which apply to you and bits which apply to OT Jews only? Please clarify this.

James goes on to describe a fallen-away brother
19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;

20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

This is no OT Jew, but a backslidden brother since he erred from the truth. Notice the backslidden brother was on the slippery slide to DEATH meaning the second death.
 
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heir

heir

TOL Subscriber
iouae said:
But what if 1 Cor 6:9 describes your Christian lifestyle. And I do know "Christians" who live exactly as described in 1 Cor 6:9. Are you saying they are saved too?
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You miss the point completely.

It is the unrighteous that shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Those who are saved are no longer identified as unrighteous, but:

1 Corinthians 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

We have the righteousness of God upon us. And that is the requirement for heaven: 100% righteousness of God. Do you have it?
 
iouae

iouae

Well-known member
heir said:
You miss the point completely.

It is the unrighteous that shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Those who are saved are no longer identified as unrighteous, but:

1 Corinthians 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

We have the righteousness of God upon us. And that is the requirement for heaven: 100% righteousness of God. Do you have it?
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I acknowledge that 100% of righteousness that I have comes from Him and is imputed.

The question I see you skating around and refusing to address is the question of whether a TRUE believer can continue to live an unrighteous lifestyle such as 1 Cor 6 describes. This is a wilful lifestyle. Shall we continue in sin in the hope that grace will abound?

A simple "yes" or "no" answer would be nice.
 
iouae

iouae

Well-known member
heir said:
His people is Israel

Luke 1:68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,
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Heb 10 is written to those who have received the knowledge of THE TRUTH?

Is "the truth" being referred to here "the Gospel" or is it some other truth? Is Heb 10 being written to Christian believers? Or do you believe the OT Jews have "THE TRUTH"?

Could this not be written to converted Jews? Surely that would mean they are still "his people"?


26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
 
iouae

iouae

Well-known member
heir said:
Hebrews 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

Not us.
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God does judge His people too.


2 Timothy 4:8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.
 
turbosixx

turbosixx

New member
heir said:
Why did you attempt to deceive by leaving out the beginning of the verse which just so happens to be key in understanding?

1 Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
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Not my intention to deceive. It's clear those sins are unrighteous and the end of the verse repeated "will not inherit". Just trying to keep it short and focus on him telling those who were sanctifed, "be not deceived".


heir said:
Those who have believed have the righteousness of God upon us. We are no longer "unrighteous"
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I agree they are righteous in Christ so why would he tell them "be not deceived" and then tell them sinners will not inherit if it couldn't happen to them?

heir said:
You also left out the conclusion to the syllogism in verse 11 of 1 Corinthians 6 (those with an agenda always do)

1 Corinthians 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
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Yes, he says they were sanctified and justified but then he goes on to tell them to v.18 “flee immorality”. These people were separating the physical from the spiritual. Since sexual immorality was done in the body and not the spirit they thought it was ok.

Can they continue in sexual immorality and still be saved?

That is where v.9 comes in, "be not deceived".
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Those Christ died for are saved, reconciled to God, even while they are unbelievers and enemies Rom 5:10, that shows their eternal security !
 
iouae

iouae

Well-known member
heir said:
James was writing to the 12 tribes scattered abroad. That's not us!
I already tried to show you, but you ignored it.http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4535359&postcount=128
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So everything in red (Christ's words) is directed towards the 12 tribes, as is James, Hebrews and I presume I have missed some other books since I am still new to this idea.

Assume I consider this new truth the best thing since sliced bread.

When you read a parable such as the sower went forth to sow, you say it is written to Israelites. What value do any of Christ's words have for me? Please explain the value of that parable for me.
 
heir

heir

TOL Subscriber
iouae said:
Heb 10 is written to those who have received the knowledge of THE TRUTH?

Is "the truth" being referred to here "the Gospel" or is it some other truth? Is Heb 10 being written to Christian believers? Or do you believe the OT Jews have "THE TRUTH"?

Could this not be written to converted Jews? Surely that would mean they are still "his people"?


26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
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The point, as you seem to miss it every time something is posted, is that Hebrews is NOT written to us yet constantly you put it up against us.
 
serpentdove

serpentdove

BANNED
Banned
iouae said:
[Heb 10:29]
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Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? [Heb. 10:29].

"This is probably the most solemn statement in the Word of God.
“Wherewith he was sanctified” refers to Christ, the Son of God. They crucified “to themselves the Son of God afresh” (Heb. 6:6). To act as if the death of Christ is inadequate to settle the sin question, and to go on as if He had not died, is to treat the blood of Christ as something you despise. Knowledge creates responsibility. If, after you have heard the gospel, you turn your back on Jesus Christ—my friend, someone ought to tell you that you are going to hell! This is not what I say; it is what God says." McGee, J. V. (1991). Thru the Bible commentary: The Epistles (Hebrews 8-13) (electronic ed., Vol. 52, p. 61). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.
 
heir

heir

TOL Subscriber
turbosixx said:
Not my intention to deceive. It's clear those sins are unrighteous and the end of the verse repeated "will not inherit". Just trying to keep it short and focus on him telling those who were sanctifed, "be not deceived".
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Why did you leave out part of the verse? You did it so you could ignore the context.

It is the unrighteous who shall not inherit the kingdom of God. So then how does one become righteous?


I agree they are righteous in Christ so why would he tell them "be not deceived" and then tell them sinners will not inherit if it couldn't happen to them?



Yes, he says they were sanctified and justified but then he goes on to tell them to v.18 “flee immorality”. These people were separating the physical from the spiritual. Since sexual immorality was done in the body and not the spirit they thought it was ok.

Can they continue in sexual immorality and still be saved?
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There were some at Corinth who were not saved and still identified as "unrighteous" and there were "some" who were the "ye" that are "washed, sanctified and justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God (1 Corinthians 6:11 KJV). This would be those who had believed the gospel that Paul declared by which also they (the "ye are saved" (and we by extension) 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV.
 
iouae

iouae

Well-known member
beloved57 said:
heir



James wrote to the Church, the Body of Christ. Its not you because you dont believe the Gospel !
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I thought Heir was on your team, team OSAS.

She is about to elaborate on this amazing truth that all scripture is written to/for us, but some of it is not for/to us. Don't discourage her.
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
heir said:
Salvation is not based upon anything that we do or don't do. Not doing what is listed in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 KJV will not save anyone, now will it?!
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Then why dont you believe everyone Christ died for is saved by that Death alone ? Does something else need to be done by the person ?
 
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