ECT "Lordship 'Salvation'"-perverting the gospel of Christ

Jacob

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Even this one:
Matt 16:20 (AKJV/PCE)
(16:20) Then charged he his disciples that they should tell no man that he was Jesus the Christ.

This command was to be obeyed, and I believe it was obeyed. Telling people that Jesus is the Christ is not disobeying this command. I tell people that Jesus is the Christ. It is not disobedience to do so.

These statements address your approach. No command of Jesus is to be neglected as you seek to obey Him.
 

serpentdove

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It completely depends on HOW you follow Him.

If you try to follow Him as the minister of the circumcision (as most here do), then you'd be wrong...

Why don't you let God deal with the Jew? Mal 4:5 :rolleyes: How 'bout you obey that Christ you claim to follow (Eph 4:14). :freak:

"Depends on what the meaning of is is." :banana: ~ Bill Clinton
 

Derf

Well-known member
Yes, she has said that only those that obey every command of Jesus will be saved.


I'm not the only one that has noticed her illogical inconsistency.


So says BOTH and therefore contradicts herself.
Let's ask her.
@"God's Truth", do you believe that every command Jesus gave is to be followed by everybody in the wooden literal sense "Right Divider" is talking about here?



We don't. She thinks that she is righteous and therefore deserved to be saved. We know that nobody deserve to be save and that it is ONLY but the GRACE of God that we get saved. Grace is the exactly opposite of "getting what we deserve".
Does she think she is saved apart from the righteousness of Christ? Let's ask her.
@ "God's Truth": do you believe your works are sufficient to save you from sin and death?

GT has tons of trouble with context, as do most of the people that post here.

Regarding that passage:

Luke 19:9-10 (AKJV/PCE)
(19:9) And Jesus said unto him, This day is salvation come to this house, forsomuch as he also is a son of Abraham. (19:10) For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

Perhaps Jesus is talking about Himself, or that Zacchaeus had come to faith.
LOL! You've got to admit the humor here: that you complain about GT and "most of the people that post here" not being able to discern proper context, and then offer a couple of suggested interpretations for something that's pretty clear IMO. Since Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of Abraham (Matt 15:24), and here He says this one of Abraham has been saved today, and that He has come to save that which was lost.
 

Derf

Well-known member
Even this one:
Matt 16:20 (AKJV/PCE)
(16:20) Then charged he his disciples that they should tell no man that he was Jesus the Christ.

I hope they obeyed Jesus. But then He told them to make disciples of people baptizing them. It's pretty hard to make disciples of someone without telling them who He really is.
Can we all admit that the first command ("Tell no man...") was rescinded, after it had served its purpose?

@ Jacob, do you agree?
@ "God's Truth" do you agree?
@ "Right Divider" do you agree?
 

Right Divider

Body part
LOL! You've got to admit the humor here: that you complain about GT and "most of the people that post here" not being able to discern proper context, and then offer a couple of suggested interpretations for something that's pretty clear IMO. Since Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of Abraham (Matt 15:24), and here He says this one of Abraham has been saved today, and that He has come to save that which was lost.
You're another weirdo that is illogical and goofy.

There is NOTHING out of CONTEXT about my reply on this scripture. You opinion is NOT a fact.

Jesus is, at times, spoken of as the salvation for the people of Israel.

Luke 1:67-75 (KJV)
(1:67) And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying, (1:68) Blessed [be] the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people, (1:69) And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David; (1:70) As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began: (1:71) That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us; (1:72) To perform the mercy [promised] to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant; (1:73) The oath which he sware to our father Abraham, (1:74) That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear, (1:75) In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.
 

Cross Reference

New member
I hope they obeyed Jesus. But then He told them to make disciples of people baptizing them. It's pretty hard to make disciples of someone without telling them who He really is.
Can we all admit that the first command ("Tell no man...") was rescinded, after it had served its purpose?

@ Jacob, do you agree?
@ "God's Truth" do you agree?
@ "Right Divider" do you agree?

Do you suppose Jesus said to them, "Tell no man", because they were, as yet, unprepared to explain their experience with Him that would require His Life indwelling them for the revealing of it? See also, Matt 9:9 KJV.
 

God's Truth

New member
Why do you attack someone who is in agreement with you--at least on this one issue?

Because he/she keeps calling me a heretic in just about every single post he/she posts to me. I let him/her know that there are people who think she is a heretic too. Why does she want to keep verbally degrading me? Christians are supposed to treat others as they would like to be treated; maybe it is how she wants to be treated? I am trying to appeal to her compassionate side.
 

God's Truth

New member
I don't know of anyone that says that this was a requirement for salvation.

The point was that this was a COMMAND of Jesus and GT says that WE must OBEY every command of Jesus.


Irrelevant to the point about "obeying every command of Jesus".

P.S. Also note that salvation is relative to the CONTEXT of the scripture that uses that word. Salvation does NOT mean eternal life every single time it is found in scripture.

Salvation IS about eternal life. As for obeying everything Jesus tells us to do, it is required.

You just have to have sense that is common to know what to obey.
 

God's Truth

New member
Salvation is not an act of works

Who wouldn't want to obey every single beautiful word of the Lord Jesus Christ?

There is safety and peace in His Word.

If you do what he says, then you will have life.

Is there anyone you need to forgive today?

Do you need to humble yourself as a little child, so that you can enter the kingdom?

Is there a sin you have trouble giving up?

All can be done by doing exactly what the Word of God says.
 

God's Truth

New member
Yes, if Zachary would only read through the book of the Law, it would condemn him two hundred times... just for the things he has done today.

There is a NEW law.

It is the law governed by love.

All your actions in this life should only be governed by love.

That is living through the Spirit.
 

God's Truth

New member
GT is accused, if I understand correctly, of saying that we must obey every command of Jesus in order to be saved. Is that not what is going on here? If all she is doing is saying that we must obey every command of Jesus, with no particular goal in mind, why do you care what she says--what authority does she have over you?

I believe what you are saying is that since GT says we must obey every command of Jesus, then she should be consistent and obey the command to sell all she possesses.

I think GT would agree that that particular command is not for everyone, at least not in that strict form. An argument could be made that the sell-all-you-possess command is a specific rendering of a more general command to remove all idols from your life ("Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength").

If so, then she is right to tell people to do such (Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength), don't you think? Why would anyone in this part of the forum argue with that command of Jesus?

I don't think so. If the commands of Jesus were to be obeyed by those that followed him in that day, and if those commands differed to different people in that day, then "every command" is caveated in context, so they (each and every command) can't gain more weight today, than they had back then, can they, at least not without ignoring the context, which I'm hopeful you wouldn't want to do?
So what do you think is meant by the use of "salvation" in the Zaccheus narrative?

It is so good to meet you.
 

God's Truth

New member
Let's ask her.
@"God's Truth", do you believe that every command Jesus gave is to be followed by everybody in the wooden literal sense "Right Divider" is talking about here?
No. I do not believe that every command Jesus gave is to be followed by everybody in the wooden literal sense he “Right Divider” Is talking about.
Right Divider thinks that NOTHING Jesus says while he walked the earth is for us today.
He does not see the truth, wisdom, and love in what Jesus says, and how it applies to EVERYONE, now and forever.
Right Divider claims I am not obeying because I have not sold everything; and since I have not, I do not obey. He does not take into account that Jesus no longer has a traveling earthly ministry, and that I am not a rich man, and I do not put my riches above the Lord.
I have also been told to cut off my hand and pluck out my eye to obey Jesus; but those people that tell me to do that, they do not understand that Jesus says that to show the importance of obeying; we do NOT need to pluck out our eye and cut off our hand if we obey.

Does she think she is saved apart from the righteousness of Christ? Let's ask her.
@ "God's Truth": do you believe your works are sufficient to save you from sin and death?
Amen to you Derf. Amen to you, for I would not ever be saved apart from the righteousness of Christ. There would be no reconciliation and salvation if not for the righteousness of Christ.
LOL! You've got to admit the humor here: that you complain about GT and "most of the people that post here" not being able to discern proper context, and then offer a couple of suggested interpretations for something that's pretty clear IMO. Since Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of Abraham (Matt 15:24), and here He says this one of Abraham has been saved today, and that He has come to save that which was lost.
They do not understand. Jesus came first for the people that already belonged to God by faith. The Jews were already known to be those that obey, for they would have been cut off from their people if they did not, for one could not go to the temple to worship God without following many purification/ceremonial works; yet, the old law was NOT based on faith. The New Law of Christ would be based on faith. All the Jews that did not have faith in God by the time Jesus started his earthly ministry, they would be cut off and hardened, so that they could not hear what Jesus was saying and so be saved. Jesus came first for those that already belong to God by faith; they were God’s, and God gave them to Jesus; they now had to go through Jesus to remain God’s.
Jesus said when he is crucified ALL could come to him to be saved. Jesus has been crucified, so that means his teachings are for everyone now.
His salvation is for everyone.
Those who verbally attack and oppose me say Jesus’ words when he walked the earth are only for the lost sheep of Israel, i.e. blood related to Abraham. They do not take in the whole counsel of the Lord. They by error believe that Paul was sent later to the rest of the world to preach another gospel; a gospel which is about obeying anything would cause one to be in a condemned gospel, a gospel of works.
I have a powerful testimony, and I would not be saved if I had not obeyed Jesus. I just want to share the power of His Love for those that do what the Word says. However, they will not have any of it.
 

God's Truth

New member
I hope they obeyed Jesus. But then He told them to make disciples of people baptizing them. It's pretty hard to make disciples of someone without telling them who He really is.
Can we all admit that the first command ("Tell no man...") was rescinded, after it had served its purpose?

@ Jacob, do you agree?
@ "God's Truth" do you agree?
@ "Right Divider" do you agree?

I agree.
 

Tambora

Get your armor ready!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
ONCE AGAIN, who said OTHERWISE?


I guess that no many HOW many times you're shown the scripture, you reject God's Word!

That is EXACTLY what the scripture does NOT SAY.
Rom 5:17-19 (AKJV/PCE)
(5:17) For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.) (5:18) Therefore as by the offence of one [judgment came] upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one [the free gift came] upon all men unto justification of life. (5:19) For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.


Once AGAIN you lie and pervert the scripture.
Yeppers.

By the obedience of one.
Not two, not your obedience plus Christ's obedience.
It was by Christ's obedience alone.

But the workers like to skip over that.
 

serpentdove

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"The world does not hate the baby Jesus. The world does not hate the Jesus who fed the multitudes. The world does not hate the Jesus who healed the sick. The world hates the Jesus who testifies of it that it's works are evil." ~ Adrian Rogers Ge 37:3, Heb 4:15
 
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