ECT "Lordship 'Salvation'"-perverting the gospel of Christ

Danoh

New member
The zeal the Jews had were for circumcision and the observance of special says; they did not have zeal for obeying Jesus.

Paul never ever rebukes anyone for obeying Jesus too much. THINK about what you are saying!

No - YOU - think about it...

Romans 10 describes what you are preaching:

10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Yeah, I know, according to YOU that is talking about ceremonial works.

UNTIL you HONESTLY examine this fool claim of yours, it is a waste of time to attempt to reason with you through the Scripture.
 

God's Truth

New member
No - YOU - think about it...

Romans 10 describes what you are preaching:

10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Yeah, I know, according to YOU that is talking about ceremonial works.

UNTIL you HONESTLY examine this fool claim of yours, it is a waste of time to attempt to reason with you through the Scripture.

What was the righteousness of their own? IT WAS the ceremonial/purification works they had to do
themselves.

They did not want to stop doing those things!

They did not trust that Jesus' blood cleans us and makes us righteous.
 

Danoh

New member
What was the righteousness of their own? IT WAS the ceremonial/purification works they had to do
themselves.

They did not want to stop doing those things!

They did not trust that Jesus' blood cleans us and makes us righteous.

The answer is at the end of Romans 9.

And...

YOU ALSO do NOT trust that "Jesus' blood cleans us and makes us righteous."

You preach perfecting that in your flesh.

You preach perfecting that by YOUR works...

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
 

God's Truth

New member
The answer is at the end of Romans 9.

And...

YOU ALSO do NOT trust that "Jesus' blood cleans us and makes us righteous."

You preach perfecting that in your flesh.

You preach perfecting that by YOUR works...

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

That scripture you gave rebukes you, for it shows that CIRCUMCISION (the ceremonial work), is the works the Jews did not want to stop doing.

I obey everything Jesus says. Faith alone is dead.
 

Danoh

New member
That scripture you gave rebukes you, for it shows that CIRCUMCISION (the ceremonial work), is the works the Jews did not want to stop doing.

I obey everything Jesus says. Faith alone is dead.

No, you just prove how little you actually know about these things.

In Romans 4, Paul writes the following...

4:1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?

4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

What "works" is he talking about?

4:10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

You see that?

That was BEFORE circumcision.

4:11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:

4:12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

I'll spell out in plain English.

When Abraham believed God, that was BEFORE circumcision.

And it was BEFORE Abraham moved ONE muscle.

Romans 4:1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?

4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

4:10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

THAT is Paul's argument.

Galatians 3:5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

At Galatia the issue was works of the Law. But that was Galatia.

The real issue is works of any kind.

This goes further back to BEFORE circumcision and the Law.

The issue is ANY work.

3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

The works of the Law you say this is about were 430 years later!

Galatians 3:8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

3:17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

Lol...

For at this point, that is all I have left for you; laughter at your silly idea that YOU can DO ANYHTING to add to the Cross of Christ.

AT GALATIA, this issue of works was those works under the Law.

But the Principle is ANY works.

Romans 4:1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? 4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. 4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

4:10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

4:23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 4:24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 4:25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
 

God's Truth

New member
No, you just prove how little you actually know about these things.

In Romans 4, Paul writes the following...

4:1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?

4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

What "works" is he talking about?

4:10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

You see that?

That was BEFORE circumcision.

That's right, BEFORE circumcision---NOT BEFORE OBEDIENCE.


4:11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:

4:12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

I'll spell out in plain English.

When Abraham believed God, that was BEFORE circumcision.

And it was BEFORE Abraham moved ONE muscle.

You are badly mistaken, for Abraham OBEYED before circumcision.


James 2:20 You foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? 21 Was not our ancestor Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did

Hebrews 11:8 By faith Abraham, when called to go to a place he would later receive as his inheritance, obeyed and went, even though he did not know where he was going.

Romans 4:1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?

4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

4:10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

THAT is Paul's argument.

Galatians 3:5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

At Galatia the issue was works of the Law. But that was Galatia.

The real issue is works of any kind.

All those scriptures you posted prove the works are circumcision and NOT about not having to obey.

This goes further back to BEFORE circumcision and the Law.

The issue is ANY work.

3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

The works of the Law you say this is about were 430 years later!

Galatians 3:8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

3:17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

Lol...

For at this point, that is all I have left for you; laughter at your silly idea that YOU can DO ANYHTING to add to the Cross of Christ.

AT GALATIA, this issue of works was those works under the Law.

But the Principle is ANY works.

It is about the circumcision ceremonial/purification works.

Circumcision is the only works specified.

No way would Paul ever tell anyone that we are saved by not obeying only believing.
 

Cross Reference

New member
For the born again the issue of obedience becomes one of overcoming the flesh [vanity per Rom.8:20 KJV] as this from Oswald Chambers speaks of it being:

March 14 "My Utmost For His Highest"

Obedience

"His servants ye are to whom ye obey." Romans 6:16.

The first thing to do in examining the power that dominates me is to take hold of the unwelcome fact that I am responsible for being thus dominated because I have yielded. If I am a slave to myself, I am to blame for it because at a point away back I yielded myself to myself. Likewise, if I obey God I do so because I have yielded myself to Him.

Yield in childhood to selfishness, and you will find it the most enchaining tyranny on earth. There is no power in the human soul of itself to break the bondage of a disposition formed by yielding. Yield for one second to anything in the nature of lust (remember what lust is: ‘I must have it at once,’ whether it be the lust of the flesh or the lust of the mind), once yield and though you may hate yourself for having yielded, you are a bond-slave to that thing. There is no release in human power at all, but only in the Redemption. You must yield yourself in utter humiliation to the only One Who can break the dominating power, viz., the Lord Jesus Christ. “He hath anointed Me … to preach deliverance to the captives.”

We find this out in the most ridiculously small ways—‘Oh, I can give that habit up when I like.’ You cannot, you will find that the habit absolutely dominates you because you yielded to it willingly. It is easy to sing—“He will break every fetter,” and at the same time be living a life of obvious slavery to yourself. Yielding to Jesus will break every form of slavery in any human life.
 

God's Truth

New member
For the born again the issue of obedience

Being born again happens when one is saved after repenting of their sins. Jesus saves them and washes all their sins away, they are born again, given a new life without sins.

becomes one of overcoming the flesh [vanity per Rom.8:20 KJV] as this from Oswald Chambers speaks of it being:

That scripture is not about how we cannot obey. That scripture is about how all are getting old and are slowly decaying.

See Romans 8:23 Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies.

We await the redemption of our bodies...that is about the resurrection. That is when we are given new bodies that will not decay.

March 14 "My Utmost For His Highest"

Obedience

"His servants ye are to whom ye obey." Romans 6:16.

The first thing to do in examining the power that dominates me is to take hold of the unwelcome fact that I am responsible for being thus dominated because I have yielded. If I am a slave to myself, I am to blame for it because at a point away back I yielded myself to myself. Likewise, if I obey God I do so because I have yielded myself to Him.

Yield in childhood to selfishness, and you will find it the most enchaining tyranny on earth. There is no power in the human soul of itself to break the bondage of a disposition formed by yielding. Yield for one second to anything in the nature of lust (remember what lust is: ‘I must have it at once,’ whether it be the lust of the flesh or the lust of the mind), once yield and though you may hate yourself for having yielded, you are a bond-slave to that thing. There is no release in human power at all, but only in the Redemption.

We will never be redeemed unless we first do what the Way says.

There is NO scripture ANYWHERE in the Bible that says we cannot obey God before we are saved.

HOWEVER, we are told MANY TIMES that we will not be saved unless we obey.

How does one get that they cannot obey anything that God says? Did you ever do what you parents said? Did you ever follow the rules of your school? Did you ever do what your teacher said? Your boss? The Government?

Of course we can obey God, and if you do not, you will not get saved.

You must yield yourself in utter humiliation to the only One Who can break the dominating power, viz., the Lord Jesus Christ. “He hath anointed Me … to preach deliverance to the captives.”

Jesus helps those who obey and call on him. Jesus gives the Holy Spirit to help those who obey. Even calling on the Lord to help is a command, a teaching from God.

We find this out in the most ridiculously small ways—‘Oh, I can give that habit up when I like.’ You cannot, you will find that the habit absolutely dominates you because you yielded to it willingly. It is easy to sing—“He will break every fetter,” and at the same time be living a life of obvious slavery to yourself. Yielding to Jesus will break every form of slavery in any human life.

After we obey what we can, we are to call on Jesus to help us with what we have a hard time overcoming. That in no way means we cannot obey anything that Jesus says.

The gospel has been SENT to those who do right and fear God in the first place---before they are saved!

See Acts 13:26 "Fellow children of Abraham and you God-fearing Gentiles, it is to us that this message of salvation has been sent.
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
Jesus didn't tell everyone to sell all they had, but he did say something to EVERYONE, and that is you will never enter if you do not humble yourself.

"Jesus didn't tell everyone to sell all they had.."-scammer

=she admits she lied, and continues to lie, when she asserts that:


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says...I always obey Jesus....We must do everything that Jesus tells us to do....Everything Jesus says is for everyone.”-God’sUNTruth

Sell all you have, show yourself to a Levitical priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, as, you assert that we must do "everything that Jesus says."
____________________________________
"Everything Jesus says is for everyone...…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-scammer

You wicked fraud/scammer, or lush-no other option.
 

God's Truth

New member
She admits that she does not know the purpose of the dbr-on record, for all to see, clueless as to why the Saviour died, and was raised again.

You show you do not care if you tell untruths about others. Show where I admit to not knowing something about Jesus.

I explained the truth to you, but you refuse to acknowledge it.
 

Tambora

Get your armor ready!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
"Jesus didn't tell everyone to sell all they had.."-scammer

=she admits she lied, and continues to lie, when she asserts that:


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says...I always obey Jesus....We must do everything that Jesus tells us to do....Everything Jesus says is for everyone.”-God’sUNTruth

Sell all you have, show yourself to a Levitical priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, as, you assert that we must do "everything that Jesus says."
____________________________________
"Everything Jesus says is for everyone...…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-scammer

You wicked fraud/scammer, or lush-no other option.
Yeppers.

And she falsely claims that that "works of the law" are divided.
But the same person that says "faith without works is dead", is also the one that says:
James 2 KJV​
(10) For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.





 
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