How does that do anyone any good if you are not going to elaborate and say why?
It should be evident to you with all your knowledge that Jesus was indeed born of a woman.
http://www.biblicalunitarian.com/videos/john-1-18
Jesus is God.
- Thread starter jzeidler
- Start date
It should be evident to you with all your knowledge that Jesus was indeed born of a woman.
http://www.biblicalunitarian.com/videos/john-1-18
Not listening to the video but reading the commentary on the page: it really does not matter whether the reading for the only begotten in John 1:18 is "Son" or whether the only begotten is "God", (Theos). That is because the man Yeshua does not claim to be the Logos-Memra-Word and the rest of the Gospel of John reveals this to be true. Those passages have already been quoted and gone over many times in this and many other threads. There is a chain of clear emphatic statements which, if a person be honest and accept what Yeshua says, then none of this would even be necessary because the arguments would be over. If you would like that I go find them and post them again here, I will, just for you, seriously.
Not listening to the video but reading the commentary on the page: it really does not matter whether the reading for the only begotten in John 1:18 is "Son" or whether the only begotten is "God", (Theos). That is because the man Yeshua does not claim to be the Logos-Memra-Word and the rest of the Gospel of John reveals this to be true. Those passages have already been quoted and gone over many times in this and many other threads. There is a chain of clear emphatic statements which, if a person be honest and accept what Yeshua says, then none of this would even be necessary because the arguments would be over. If you would like that I go find them and post them again here, I will, just for you, seriously.
So you still insist that Jesus was not born of a physical woman?
LA
First allow me to answer with some of the passages I mentioned in the previous post.
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The Father judges no one but has committed all judgment to the Son:
John 5:22
22. For the Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment unto the Son:
The man Yeshua also states that he judges no one:
John 8:15
15. You judge after the flesh: I judge no one.
There is only one who judges, the Seeker and Judge:
John 8:50
50. And I seek not mine own glory: one there is, the Seeker and Judge. [Rev 2:23]
The Memra-Logos-Word which the man Yeshua speaks is not his own:
John 14:24
24. He that loves me not, keeps not my sayings: and the Logos-Word which you hear is not of me, but [it is] of the Father who sent me.
The Memra-Logos-Word is the Seeker and the Judge:
John 12:47-48
47. And if anyone hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but that the world might be delivered.
48. He that rejects me, and receives not my words, has one that judges him: the Logos-Word that I have spoken, that one shall judge him in the last day.
Revelation 19:11-16 KJV
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Logos-Word of God.
14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
The Son of man and Son of Elohim is the Memra-Logos-Word who descended from the heavens in the spiritual somatiko-bodily form of a dove and abode-remained upon the man Yeshua throughout his ministry including Golgotha.
But as for your question concerning the birth of Yeshua; why have you not first offered up an answer to my question which came first in this subject matter pertaining to Matthew 11:11? If you say that Yeshua is born of a woman, as you apparently do, then he clearly tells you that Yohanan is greater than he is because of the clear emphatic statement written in Matthew 11:11. How do you account for that in your doctrine? Do you just ignore what Yeshua says like most or do you have an acceptable answer? My initial answer, (without explanation), has already been given:
Matthew 11:11 KJV
11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
The only way that Yeshua can be greater than Yohanan, according to this statement from the Master himself, is if Yeshua is not born of a woman: and we know that Yeshua states that he has a greater Testimony than Yohanan, and therefore he is greater, (and not born of a woman).
That does not mean Jesus was not born of a woman.
Only that the least in the Kingdom of Heaven is greater than John the Baptist.
LA
Your response only tells me that either, yes, you just ignore the statement and go on with what you want to believe, (by changing the meaning of what is said to suit your mindset), or, you do not understand what you are reading.
Both Yeshua and Yohanan were alive at the same time this statement was made. Yeshua says what he says and you deny it. Do you also claim that Yeshua is God? If you do then why do you not believe what he says? (and the same question goes for Trinitarians). Regardless of what is said in the second half of the statement the first portion cannot be denied for what it says if you truly count yourself as a disciple of the teachings of Yeshua, otherwise you are just making up your own doctrines and theories.
This is a fact: Among those born of women, in the same time of both Yeshua and Yohanan, (because Yohanan was still alive at the time of this statement), there had not risen one greater than Yohanan the Immerser. If you say that Yeshua is or was born of a woman then by default you say that Yohanan is or was greater than Yeshua. Trying to find a way around the statement is not going to work because it is a clear emphatic statement and, by doing so, you only show that you do not truly believe all that Yeshua says. As for the least in the kingdom the Son of Man was made a little lower than Elohim-Angels-Messengers, (because he is the Logos-Word in the Messengers). How can anyone not see that his name is called the Son of MAN? :chuckle:
You speak as a religious nut.
Jesus was only saying that one in the Kingdom of God is greater than one born of woman.
Luk 2:5 To be taxed with Mary his espoused wife, being great with child.
Luk 2:6 And so it was, that, while they were there, the days were accomplished that she should be delivered.
Luk 2:7 And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn.
LA
beameup
New member
Really, it takes the Holy Spirit to "reveal" to you who Jesus really is. If you don't have the Spirit, then you cannot know or understand; you cannot be a partaker of the divine nature until you "see the light" of who Jesus really is and who YOU really are before Almighty God.
- 2 Peter 1:4
Awe . . . you're just upset because your flaming paradigm has no answer. In my opinion a "religious nut" is one who ignores what the Master says and inserts his or her own ideas over his own Testimony. Why do you think there are so many types of nuts around here? And why do I stick out like a sore thumb just because I actually believe what Yeshua says? Shouldn't that be the norm in a place such as this? "Wow!!! Another crazy religious nut who actually believes the Testimony of the Messiah! Are you crazy man??? What's wrong with you!!??!! I told you: the Son of MAN is born of a WOMAN!!!" :crackup: :rotfl::lucky:
Yeah, okay, nice talkin' to ya . . .
Spirit is Testimony: the Testimony of Yeshua is the New Covenant Spirit. If you have not the Testimony of Yeshua then you have not Spirit Holy. Why then do so many here not have and hold the Testimony of Yeshua in uprightness? If you do not have it you do not have the Word of Elohim in you. "The words that I speak to you, they are SPIRIT, and they are LIFE."
Yes we know you are the only one who knows the truth and everyone else is stupid.
Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Joh 3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
God's Truth
New member
After I was saved, I just automatically believed in the trinity, it was a widely accepted doctrine.
However, I have a powerful testimony, Jesus Christ himself saved me and since then Jesus lives in my heart.
Since there is only one Spirit, and the Father and Jesus live inside us when we are saved, that means they are all the same one.
Jesus doesn't pretend to live inside the saved; Jesus himself lives in us.
I said neither of those things: you are projecting your own ideas onto me just as you do scripture.
Some of this has already been gone over if you had not noticed. Perhaps you should scroll back, in fact, it negates your own position because it clearly says, as was already quoted when I quoted Matthew 11:11, "THAT WHICH IS BORN OF THE FLESH IS FLESH AND THAT WHICH IS BORN OF THE SPIRIT IS SPIRIT." Are you now going to deny the impact and consequences of this statement after you yourself have quoted it? Is the Messiah born of the flesh or is the Messiah born of the Spirit? Which one is it because Yeshua clearly makes a distinction? Also, in the passage I posted which you just quoted, Yeshua also says that the flesh profits nothing, (John 6:63). In addition Yohanan clearly tells you in the scripture that he is the one who verily immerses with WATER. Your pit is only getting deeper.
Cross Reference
New member
1. I read "s/h" as a misspelling, having never seen the abbreviation of "should have been" written like that. What I did was in innocence.
2. I used "Jesus was" because in my understanding, Jesus was not yet, "Jesus is" that He became in the afterwards of His resurrection. In other words, I am explaining His earthbound life, with it limitations and not His glorified life.
Why I did that was to point up His earthbound relationship with His Father as being the perfect relationship ordained of God intended every born again Christian. Jesus "was" the ultimate expression of human love. The born again Christian is commanded to be conformed to His image.
Cross Reference
New member
Understand this: You impress no one with your incessant use of your flesh using the Hebrew to explain itself.
Cross Reference
New member
But based upon a non-understanding, partly my fault.
Cross Reference
New member
Then who was His mother? I am assuming you know what be born or to give birth means and what is required.
2. Where does this passage fit into your scheme of things as opposed to what He is "actually" explaining to "Yohnny".: "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.", i.e., Jesus sayng: I AM the Alpha and Omega . .?
Isaiah 9:6 (KJV)