I'm not going to put that stuff in my mind. Read what theosophy is in the Kingdom of the Cults By Walter Martin. I know the truth and the truth has set me free.
Is the Bible the only sacred texts and why or why not.
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I'm not going to put that stuff in my mind. Read what theosophy is in the Kingdom of the Cults By Walter Martin. I know the truth and the truth has set me free.
Lon
Well-known member
:up:
Proverbs 14:1
_________________
Ephesians 4:13-15
Matthew 4:4
Proverbs 1:7
Proverbs 9:10
Psalm 111:10
Hebrews 8:11
Dead men don't have the indwelling of the Spirit of God
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
One Spirit Omnipresent.........
One Spirit Omnipresent.........
This is the kind of mentality that rather imprisons the mind, rather than frees it. A student of truth, lover of wisdom, has no fear and complete freedom to research, study and learn all he can and continues to test his knowledge. This is of course modified and conditioned by his own inspiration, contemplation and insight...but he continues to grow and evolve with his heart and soul towards the infinite.
I learn Theosophy from the sources and first expositors of such, from the actual literature and genuine teachers, not critics with a theological bias and apologetic agenda. (I learn also from varied, liberal or reformed versions of any school, as well as their critics of course).
Walter Martin, are you serious?
I respect universal and divine wisdom, and open to ever learn, grow, evolve....be an original and free thinker. I can choose to identify or affiliate with any religious school or tradition, and still be a theosophist (at heart) because I agree with essence, motive and spirit of the fundamental propositions and philosophical ideals of its charter and principles. I may not agree with every particular, neither have an interest in some aspects of particular classes, but I agree with the sentiments of the university as a whole. Remember, the spirit of God is the spirit of wisdom which pervades creation, it is universal, hence its laws are revealed in the Book of Nature. - these patterns reflect also in the soul of man and God.
Steering back on topic-
Concerning Theosophy's view of sacred writings Blavatsky writes:
"And it is also the ally of every honest religion – to wit, a religion willing to be judged by the same tests as it applies to the others. Those books, which contain the most self-evident truth, are to it inspired (not revealed). But all books it regards, on account of the human element contained in them, as inferior to the Book of Nature; to read which and comprehend it correctly, the innate powers of the soul must be highly developed."
One Spirit Omnipresent.........
This is the kind of mentality that rather imprisons the mind, rather than frees it. A student of truth, lover of wisdom, has no fear and complete freedom to research, study and learn all he can and continues to test his knowledge. This is of course modified and conditioned by his own inspiration, contemplation and insight...but he continues to grow and evolve with his heart and soul towards the infinite.
I learn Theosophy from the sources and first expositors of such, from the actual literature and genuine teachers, not critics with a theological bias and apologetic agenda. (I learn also from varied, liberal or reformed versions of any school, as well as their critics of course).
Walter Martin, are you serious?
I respect universal and divine wisdom, and open to ever learn, grow, evolve....be an original and free thinker. I can choose to identify or affiliate with any religious school or tradition, and still be a theosophist (at heart) because I agree with essence, motive and spirit of the fundamental propositions and philosophical ideals of its charter and principles. I may not agree with every particular, neither have an interest in some aspects of particular classes, but I agree with the sentiments of the university as a whole. Remember, the spirit of God is the spirit of wisdom which pervades creation, it is universal, hence its laws are revealed in the Book of Nature. - these patterns reflect also in the soul of man and God.
Steering back on topic-
Concerning Theosophy's view of sacred writings Blavatsky writes:
"And it is also the ally of every honest religion – to wit, a religion willing to be judged by the same tests as it applies to the others. Those books, which contain the most self-evident truth, are to it inspired (not revealed). But all books it regards, on account of the human element contained in them, as inferior to the Book of Nature; to read which and comprehend it correctly, the innate powers of the soul must be highly developed."
If I want to learn about theosophy I will pick the right source, "Kingdom of the Cults" By Walter Martin. If you want to fill your mind with garbage, have at it. As for me, I'll stick with edification from the Word of God.
Zeke
Well-known member
Foundationally you are, like I already mentioned, the building and dogmas can be diverse in beliefs but they all rest on the same footing cemented by rome. Done explained my roots and the reasons your Bible also has pagan roots that taught Christ in you through allegory parable etc......since time began, rome perverted it into history.
So we are not going to find any common ground so I won't waste your or my time any longer.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Mr. Martin not a credible source for Theosophy. I go straight to the source of theosophy, which universally is Wisdom herself, then to those schools and qualified teachers of it. I would be a fool or an idiot to go only to a critic and antagonist of any particular school to learn what it actually teaches, than to the actual teachers and texts themselves. Such an approach is dumbfounding to say the least.....which naturally goes along with a fundamentalist mentality that assumes his preferred sacred book is the "inerrant word of God" and God has inspired no other. But this particular discussion is besides my former points and principles upon which the subject here pertains...which none here have refuted, which readers can judge for themselves.
What it comes down to is your own personal belief that the bible alone is inspired or sanctioned by God, and that beyond that is other versions of "it is because I say so" or "because god says so" (so assumed) is all you have.
A more universal and ancient wisdom school approach sees the wisdom that is at the root of and pervades all traditions truly inspired or enlightened from the source of all truth, call it 'God', 'Deity', 'Spirit', etc.
You're welcome to your belief, just as any are welcome to question, challenge or debate its thesis. With your mentality in grid-lock and already set in stone, it is not capable of learning, discussion or debate. Suit yourself.
Zeke
Well-known member
Who is this king of Glory-Kuhn.
A strong statement is made in the History of the Christian Religion to the Year 200, by Charles B. Waite, to the effect that a comprehensive review of the first one hundred and seventy years of Christianity discloses the ignorance and superstition of even the most enlightened and best educated of the Fathers; with rare exceptions they were men who utterly despised learning, especially that of the pagans attempting to study the laws of the material universe.
Construing in the narrowest sense the maxim that the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God, they construed the Jewish scriptures and sayings of Christ in the most fanciful and whimsical ways. Their credulity was unbounded and "they had a sublime disregard for truth. . . . Their unscrupulousness when seeking for arguments to enforce their positions is notorious, as well as the prevalence among them of what are known as pious frauds."
Waite says of Eusebius, the Christian historian, that not only the most unblushing falsehoods but literary forgeries of the vilest character darken the pages of his apologetic and historical writings.
In speaking of such and other irregularities, Miss Isabel B. Holbrook, a capable student of esoteric religions, writes in one of her brochures: "Among the most notorious of these forgeries were gross liberties and interpolations concerning Christ into the writings of the historian Josephus, of Porphyry and other heathen and Church writers."
Waite further declares that Eusebius has contributed more to Christian history than any other and "no one is guilty of more mistakes." 136 "Eusebius has a peculiar faculty for diverging from the truth. He was ready to supply by fabrication what was wanting in historical data."
Niebuhr terms Eusebius "a very dishonest writer." The thirty-second chapter of the Twelfth Book of Anselm, Evangelical Preparation, bears for its title this scandalous proposition: "How it may be lawful and fitting to use falsehood as a medicine and for the benefit of those who want to be deceived."
(From Gibbon, Vindication, 76.) Chrysostom is quoted (Comm. on I Cor., IX, 19; Diegesis, p. 309) as saying: "Great is the force of deceit, provided it is not excited by a treacherous intention." Even Cardinal Newman appears to endorse subterfuge for the glory of the faith.
In the Apology for His Life (Appendix, 345) he writes: "The Greek Fathers thought that when there was a justa causa an untruth need not be a lie." What could be more explicit than this entry in the Catholic Encyclopedia (XII, 768)?" "There was need for a revision, which is not yet complete, ranging over all that has been handed down from the Middle Ages, under the style and title of the Fathers, Councils, Roman and other official archives. In all these departments forgery and interpolation as well as ignorance had wrought mischief on a great scale.
A strong statement is made in the History of the Christian Religion to the Year 200, by Charles B. Waite, to the effect that a comprehensive review of the first one hundred and seventy years of Christianity discloses the ignorance and superstition of even the most enlightened and best educated of the Fathers; with rare exceptions they were men who utterly despised learning, especially that of the pagans attempting to study the laws of the material universe.
Construing in the narrowest sense the maxim that the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God, they construed the Jewish scriptures and sayings of Christ in the most fanciful and whimsical ways. Their credulity was unbounded and "they had a sublime disregard for truth. . . . Their unscrupulousness when seeking for arguments to enforce their positions is notorious, as well as the prevalence among them of what are known as pious frauds."
Waite says of Eusebius, the Christian historian, that not only the most unblushing falsehoods but literary forgeries of the vilest character darken the pages of his apologetic and historical writings.
In speaking of such and other irregularities, Miss Isabel B. Holbrook, a capable student of esoteric religions, writes in one of her brochures: "Among the most notorious of these forgeries were gross liberties and interpolations concerning Christ into the writings of the historian Josephus, of Porphyry and other heathen and Church writers."
Waite further declares that Eusebius has contributed more to Christian history than any other and "no one is guilty of more mistakes." 136 "Eusebius has a peculiar faculty for diverging from the truth. He was ready to supply by fabrication what was wanting in historical data."
Niebuhr terms Eusebius "a very dishonest writer." The thirty-second chapter of the Twelfth Book of Anselm, Evangelical Preparation, bears for its title this scandalous proposition: "How it may be lawful and fitting to use falsehood as a medicine and for the benefit of those who want to be deceived."
(From Gibbon, Vindication, 76.) Chrysostom is quoted (Comm. on I Cor., IX, 19; Diegesis, p. 309) as saying: "Great is the force of deceit, provided it is not excited by a treacherous intention." Even Cardinal Newman appears to endorse subterfuge for the glory of the faith.
In the Apology for His Life (Appendix, 345) he writes: "The Greek Fathers thought that when there was a justa causa an untruth need not be a lie." What could be more explicit than this entry in the Catholic Encyclopedia (XII, 768)?" "There was need for a revision, which is not yet complete, ranging over all that has been handed down from the Middle Ages, under the style and title of the Fathers, Councils, Roman and other official archives. In all these departments forgery and interpolation as well as ignorance had wrought mischief on a great scale.
OK by me.
I'll just pray for you friend.
Zeke
Well-known member
Demonize it at the base level exposure to ingrain fear, a mental script so they won't be able read about it without that programming running interference. That blockage is only remove by divine revelation.
Zeke
Well-known member
Though Walter Martin spoke against the Catholic Church he was reluctant to say much about it in KOTC.
December 28, 2016 at 1:26 pm RE: “Maybe Walter said little about the Catholic Church in Kingdom of the Cults because he discovered at some point in his life that the Catholic Church is actually the Church that was founded by Christ.” So much for anti Catholic protestant churches being separated from the original source they are all built on, along with councils that decided for her siblings the when, what, and where.
Zeke
Well-known member
Some more why not.
Kuhn-Christianity has taught its adherents, so to say, to play around the fringes of the cultural problem instead of bearing with all their psychic force directly upon its heart. It has hypnotized their devotional mentality under the spell of a promise of vicariousness which is itself subtly conducive to the weakening of the native nobility of man’s true selfhood. It has made of its millions--what Nietzsche so thoroughly detested--groveling beggars, reveling in the turpitude of sin-confession and praying for God to have mercy on their unworthiness. It has made them wretches pleading piteously to be saved. How it has ever been assumed that a God of good sense would enjoy seeing his creatures, whom he has himself divinely endowed with a portion of his own Mind, writhing in worm-of-the-dust sycophancy at his feet, is beyond rational understanding. It is naturally to be presumed that he would take far greater delight in seeing them standing up in the might of their incipient divinity and making a fight of it. The morbid cast of mentation generated in millions of Christians over sixteen centuries by the doctrinal falsification of the esoteric meaning of "sin" is perhaps the most lamentable spectacle presented to the world in all time. That a religion could so far lose touch with sober sanity as to expect that it could exalt and edify man’s spirit by grinding it down into the dust is evidence at once of its complete divagation from basic sound truth.
Kuhn-Christianity has taught its adherents, so to say, to play around the fringes of the cultural problem instead of bearing with all their psychic force directly upon its heart. It has hypnotized their devotional mentality under the spell of a promise of vicariousness which is itself subtly conducive to the weakening of the native nobility of man’s true selfhood. It has made of its millions--what Nietzsche so thoroughly detested--groveling beggars, reveling in the turpitude of sin-confession and praying for God to have mercy on their unworthiness. It has made them wretches pleading piteously to be saved. How it has ever been assumed that a God of good sense would enjoy seeing his creatures, whom he has himself divinely endowed with a portion of his own Mind, writhing in worm-of-the-dust sycophancy at his feet, is beyond rational understanding. It is naturally to be presumed that he would take far greater delight in seeing them standing up in the might of their incipient divinity and making a fight of it. The morbid cast of mentation generated in millions of Christians over sixteen centuries by the doctrinal falsification of the esoteric meaning of "sin" is perhaps the most lamentable spectacle presented to the world in all time. That a religion could so far lose touch with sober sanity as to expect that it could exalt and edify man’s spirit by grinding it down into the dust is evidence at once of its complete divagation from basic sound truth.
Zeke
Well-known member
Kuhn-The power of tradition, and more especially religious tradition indoctrinated in the childhood of many generations, is so overwhelming that the effort of this work to clarify the status of the great doctrine of divine Messiahship in ancient scripture will almost certainly be received with the cry of blasphemy from the shocked partisans of orthodoxy. All the obloquy that has been concentrated in the word "Anti-Christ" will be flung upon the undertaking. For this reason it is desirable to state at the outset that, on the contrary, the task is motivated by the highest possible reverence for the Christ ideal as the core of all religious culture. So far from being an attempt to devastate the benignant efficacy of the role of the Christ in religious practique, it is expressly the aim of the study to establish that efficacy upon its true psychological bases. This purpose entails the revelation of the true in place of the false grounds of the claim of the Christ ideal upon our reverence. Instead of being a vicious attack upon the sanctified name and function of Christhood, it is directly an effort to redeem that name and function from centuries of impious desecration that should have been seen all along as the real grounds for horrified indignation.
popsthebuilder
New member
It wasn't that long when I read it.....oops
Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Condensed truths....
Condensed truths....
I guess an advantage of using a desk or laptop may give one more control or versatility with posting features. I use a kindle tablet when away from my desktop at home (as in this last week), and am spared or deprived of the genius of a smartphone
Condensing things down to their base essentials, 'God' is one, while others assume, assign, ascribe to the one absolute reality various names, forms, gender, personality, etc. (The mind making god according to its own imaginations).
One SUN exists giving life to all, from which every ray of colour and frequency exudes, yet all rays are but different vibrations of one light substance. Just as from one infinite ocean, all streams derive and extend. All comes from The One, and returns to The One since That One is The ALL (that is).
Our dive into theosophy has brought out the typical knee jerk reactions of ignorance, fear, superstitious presumptions, and other offsprings native to exclusive truth claims and apologetics created to defend those exclusive claims. Our keyword here is 'claim'. And yet the mystics of many traditions all experience the same primal ground of being, the same essence decorated in sundry terms.
All the while these metaphors hold and speak of the universal reality at heart, from which the cosmos as its body reverberates. From this infinite heart, the life-blood of the worlds are sustained and likewise the religions of those worlds, which exist because God affords and allows them, as extensions of himself in different languages and forms, yet the essence is one.
Condensed truths....
I guess an advantage of using a desk or laptop may give one more control or versatility with posting features. I use a kindle tablet when away from my desktop at home (as in this last week), and am spared or deprived of the genius of a smartphone
Condensing things down to their base essentials, 'God' is one, while others assume, assign, ascribe to the one absolute reality various names, forms, gender, personality, etc. (The mind making god according to its own imaginations).
One SUN exists giving life to all, from which every ray of colour and frequency exudes, yet all rays are but different vibrations of one light substance. Just as from one infinite ocean, all streams derive and extend. All comes from The One, and returns to The One since That One is The ALL (that is).
Our dive into theosophy has brought out the typical knee jerk reactions of ignorance, fear, superstitious presumptions, and other offsprings native to exclusive truth claims and apologetics created to defend those exclusive claims. Our keyword here is 'claim'. And yet the mystics of many traditions all experience the same primal ground of being, the same essence decorated in sundry terms.
All the while these metaphors hold and speak of the universal reality at heart, from which the cosmos as its body reverberates. From this infinite heart, the life-blood of the worlds are sustained and likewise the religions of those worlds, which exist because God affords and allows them, as extensions of himself in different languages and forms, yet the essence is one.
Zeke
Well-known member
I guess an advantage of using a desk or laptop may give one more control or versatility with posting features. I use a kindle tablet when away from my desktop at home (as in this last week), and am spared or deprived of the genius of a smartphone
Condensing things down to their base essentials, 'God' is one, while others assume, assign, ascribe to the one absolute reality various names, forms, gender, personality, etc. (The mind making god according to its own imaginations).
One SUN exists giving life to all, from which every ray of colour and frequency exudes, yet all rays are but different vibrations of one light substance. Just as from one infinite ocean, all streams derive and extend. All comes from The One, and returns to The One since That One is The ALL (that is).
Our dive into theosophy has brought out the typical knee jerk reactions of ignorance, fear, superstitious presumptions, and other offsprings native to exclusive truth claims and apologetics created to defend those exclusive claims. Our keyword here is 'claim'. And yet the mystics of many traditions all experience the same primal ground of being, the same essence decorated in sundry terms.
All the while these metaphors hold and speak of the universal reality at heart, from which the cosmos as its body reverberates. From this infinite heart, the life-blood of the worlds are sustained and likewise the religions of those worlds, which exist because God affords and allows them, as extensions of himself in different languages and forms, yet the essence is one.
The standard inerrant chant of some sects is harder to get away with, with all the info at our fingertips the once laborious task of gathering the dissenting opinions against the pure compilation of scriptures is no longer privy of the few who had the time and resources available to research these issues, now it's not so easy to defend anymore or gloss over the skullduggery involved.
The mystery of duplicity in some traditional doctrines proclaiming they know it's Christ in man but can't go the rest of the way acknowledging the kingdom and temple is also in man, that Biblical symbology is all about Gal 4:24, shows the power of tradition to prevent that final step to be able to leave the first principles of Christ (dead letter) behind them Hebrews 6:1-5, 2Cor 5:16, a commonality they share with those in Christ story Matt 23:13 teaching in traditions of men, and more concerned about worldly temple rituals made with hands rather than the one not made hands in their mothers womb of flesh where the seed of God also incubates in, Acts 17:24.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Challenging exclusive claims...............
Challenging exclusive claims...............
Indeed, even NOW we are the sons of God, and we are his temple. - all else is analogy, allegory, type, shadow, symbol, description (all language is parabolic). Its all about 'Christ' being formed in us, the mortal putting on immortality, the ascension of the soul in the Spirit, which Paul so illustrates in his gospel, but these are deeper teachings of gnosis, and revealed only to those who are 'spiritual' since they are spiritually discerned. In this sense these mysteries are only revealed to gnostics (those receiving the knowledge by the Spirit).
On the issue of the canon of scripture and if God somehow only ordained 66 books,
We see the writer of John says -
And there are also many other things that Jesus did, which if they were written one by one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. Amen.
If such a volume of books were written, we dont know, but we do know many other gospels were contending for readership and sanction among various groups of believers before only 4 were chosen upon universal grounds of acceptance or orthodoxy. As far as learning what Jesus really taught we cannot know or trust that all that he truly taught is recorded in the 4 canonized gospels, while some parts or portions of his teachings may also be contained in non-canonical gospels and various other apocryphal or even modern day channeled material. Therefore while some records may be more authentic or complete than others, its all within the venue of a patch-work quilt or a gilded library of sorts. It comes down to one's own beliefs and claims based on various criteria of 'evidence' or 'value', and each choose for himself what is of 'Christ', or what bears witness within by the spirit of 'Christ', etc.
The OT itself nowhere claims that an end or climax to revelation has been effected, but has left space open for a furthering of progressive revelation and prophecy. The NT itself as well does not indicate anywhere as a whole, that its revelation is the sum, total or finality of revelation EVER. The truth of infinity is open-ended all ways, within time and without time. Therefore there can never be a final 'zenith' of truth, but only crests and waves of revelation within the total of reality, as universal and cosmic forces reveal it, and the eyes of the soul are open to see it.
In Rev. 22 it is written -
For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
This passage often quoted by bible literalists as applying to the whole bible is mistaken, for it is a 'curse' ONLY applying to that particular revelation (book) itself, not some extended figurative collection of books.
Challenging exclusive claims...............
Indeed, even NOW we are the sons of God, and we are his temple. - all else is analogy, allegory, type, shadow, symbol, description (all language is parabolic). Its all about 'Christ' being formed in us, the mortal putting on immortality, the ascension of the soul in the Spirit, which Paul so illustrates in his gospel, but these are deeper teachings of gnosis, and revealed only to those who are 'spiritual' since they are spiritually discerned. In this sense these mysteries are only revealed to gnostics (those receiving the knowledge by the Spirit).
On the issue of the canon of scripture and if God somehow only ordained 66 books,
We see the writer of John says -
And there are also many other things that Jesus did, which if they were written one by one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. Amen.
If such a volume of books were written, we dont know, but we do know many other gospels were contending for readership and sanction among various groups of believers before only 4 were chosen upon universal grounds of acceptance or orthodoxy. As far as learning what Jesus really taught we cannot know or trust that all that he truly taught is recorded in the 4 canonized gospels, while some parts or portions of his teachings may also be contained in non-canonical gospels and various other apocryphal or even modern day channeled material. Therefore while some records may be more authentic or complete than others, its all within the venue of a patch-work quilt or a gilded library of sorts. It comes down to one's own beliefs and claims based on various criteria of 'evidence' or 'value', and each choose for himself what is of 'Christ', or what bears witness within by the spirit of 'Christ', etc.
The OT itself nowhere claims that an end or climax to revelation has been effected, but has left space open for a furthering of progressive revelation and prophecy. The NT itself as well does not indicate anywhere as a whole, that its revelation is the sum, total or finality of revelation EVER. The truth of infinity is open-ended all ways, within time and without time. Therefore there can never be a final 'zenith' of truth, but only crests and waves of revelation within the total of reality, as universal and cosmic forces reveal it, and the eyes of the soul are open to see it.
In Rev. 22 it is written -
For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
This passage often quoted by bible literalists as applying to the whole bible is mistaken, for it is a 'curse' ONLY applying to that particular revelation (book) itself, not some extended figurative collection of books.
marhig
Well-known member
Hi freelight
I believe that any revelation from God shouldn't be altered, it should be given as pure as it was given to us, pure water not contaminated by the ways of man and that's what John means and although he was talking about the revelation he received, I believe that all the Bible is the inspired word of God, written as it has been received through revelation but it's been changed my man over time yet as John said, we should not add nor take away. Yet, that's what man has done to the living word of God, chopped it into denominations. Instead of waiting for God to open their understanding they have tried to work it out in the flesh and that's what's happened, many different ways instead of one true way which is the true way of Christ, a new and living way that we live by.
I too know about mortality putting on immortality, which is Christ through the Spirit in the heart changing our hearts to become a new man and become more like Christ Jesus in our lives, producing the fruit of the spirit as we live by the will of God, thus this mortality is swallowed up by life. Our mortal bodies are full of the life of Christ in and out as we are born anew in the Spirit, as his blood cleanses our hearts of sin as we pour out our lives, resisting unto blood striving against sin, as we walk in newness of life in the new and living way of Christ. Our blood is dead blood, and our flesh is dead flesh, but the life of Christ changes us, the life is in the blood, and that blood is Christ Jesus's poured out life, and that life is in those born of God who walk in the Spirit and not after the flesh and this world. People see all these things happening when we die, but it happens in the here and now when we are dead to self and risen with Christ.
I remember seeing that natural blood keeps all the members of the body alive, by bringing the oxygen around the body and feeding and cleansing the body and removing the bad.
And I saw that this is like Christ Jesus, he cleanses us through the Holy Spirit, feeding and cleansing us and removing the wrong within our hearts, and helping us daily to overcome if we remain in God's goodness. His life is in the blood (nothing to do with the natural blood, or the crucifixion) but his blood within us, his life within. The blood we drink along with the flesh we eat as we take his life in being fed of the Holy Spirit, when he broke the the bread and passed the cup, he wasn't meaning and about his natural death, but rather the new covenant being one we partake in, in our lives and as a partake in the new covenant, we remember him. Breaking the the bread is sharing the word of God we receive daily in our hearts through Christ, and sharing the gospel, and drinking the blood is being willing to partake in Christ's sufferings to do the will of God and bring Gods love and the life of Christ to others.
I hear things of God like this, as do others in our meeting. But we are not gnostics. Were just ordinary people living by God's will. And unless we are willing to lay down our lives and live by the will of God, we won't understand him. He only gives understanding to those who truly love him, not in word only but also in deed living daily by his will, and only those who obey him are blessed with his Holy Spirit, and the way is through Christ Jesus, he lived it out perfectly, and he is the living way to follow to come to the father of life.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Spirit is life, Spirit is Universal........
Spirit is life, Spirit is Universal........
Hi marhig,
Any book can be more or less inspired, yet the truth that the INFINITE cannot be limited to one book, much less one personality, school, cult, tradition, form or fancy....still holds - my former commentary addresses the subject and many of its nuances, unchallenged by most here, who simply share their BELIEF as its own testimony of 'truth', an opinion, assumption or some preferred attestation agreeing with their own 'faith' that it is so. As I've shared however, what one deems as 'truth' maybe more or less subject to their own biases, even if there is some genuine 'religious experience' that accompanies their claim of exclusivity of a particular book or tradition. I'll say that a universal reality is at the heart of all human experience, and that subject we call 'God' can be more or less manipulated, altered or modified to fit our own preferred image or format. But perhaps I digress......
No matter how much faith you place in written words or books, its still the Spirit ALONE that gives life, or more rather IS life, so that all that any writing needs to be to be of value is accurate enough to CONVEY some meaningful information, concepts or principles, that these are then relayed to the mind which then allows for Spirit to teach, enlighten or instruct. Only as the soul opens to the Spirit is there any positive effect in translating spiritual truths, ideas and fruit, for the soul to profit thereby.
Indeed,....as you know I've challenged the 'blood atonement' concept by its own illogic on principle alone, let alone other inconsistencies with a penal concept of payback, where more valid concepts of 'atonement' via simple repentance and returning to God with a penitent heart and contrite spirit are sufficient unto themselves to effect 'reunion' with Deity. (no need for senseless bloodshed or suffering of another, when the law of karma itself effects its own opportunity to right wrongs and make amends for ones behavior. No one else has to suffer for you, as you are responsible for your own sins and salvation, ultimately. Sure all is granted thru grace, thats because God is love, of course, but this never negates the principle of self-responsibility).
Love does not exact or require punishment upon any soul, but does provide all that is essential for absolution, forgivenesss, compelete restoration. The emblems of 'blood' and 'water' are figurative of course as is much in religious writing, which a basic course in metaphysics would do anyone good, to impress the mind to see the estoric meanings behind exoteric forms.
The One Universal Reality not limited to space or time, is radiant in his omnipresence thru-out all space and time and this INCLUDES all races, cultures, schools, traditions, religious books, etc. The infinite includes all and outshines all, in its own radiance, and there is nowhere God is not, even if you assume a shadow is some absence of light, it is really not, but a contrast of form or seeming appearance or illusion.
All that matters at the end of the day of any value is IF your preferred or chosen religious writings provides a real service to you and humanity, for the meaning and value it conveys, and what spiritual fruit and good that can actually PRODUCE.
Spirit is life, Spirit is Universal........
Hi freelight
I believe that any revelation from God shouldn't be altered, it should be given as pure as it was given to us, pure water not contaminated by the ways of man and that's what John means and although he was talking about the revelation he received, I believe that all the Bible is the inspired word of God, written as it has been received through revelation but it's been changed my man over time yet as John said, we should not add nor take away. Yet, that's what man has done to the living word of God, chopped it into denominations. Instead of waiting for God to open their understanding they have tried to work it out in the flesh and that's what's happened, many different ways instead of one true way which is the true way of Christ, a new and living way that we live by.
Hi marhig,
Any book can be more or less inspired, yet the truth that the INFINITE cannot be limited to one book, much less one personality, school, cult, tradition, form or fancy....still holds
- my former commentary addresses the subject and many of its nuances, unchallenged by most here, who simply share their BELIEF as its own testimony of 'truth', an opinion, assumption or some preferred attestation agreeing with their own 'faith' that it is so. As I've shared however, what one deems as 'truth' maybe more or less subject to their own biases, even if there is some genuine 'religious experience' that accompanies their claim of exclusivity of a particular book or tradition. I'll say that a universal reality is at the heart of all human experience, and that subject we call 'God' can be more or less manipulated, altered or modified to fit our own preferred image or format. But perhaps I digress......No matter how much faith you place in written words or books, its still the Spirit ALONE that gives life, or more rather IS life, so that all that any writing needs to be to be of value is accurate enough to CONVEY some meaningful information, concepts or principles, that these are then relayed to the mind which then allows for Spirit to teach, enlighten or instruct. Only as the soul opens to the Spirit is there any positive effect in translating spiritual truths, ideas and fruit, for the soul to profit thereby.
Indeed,....as you know I've challenged the 'blood atonement' concept by its own illogic on principle alone, let alone other inconsistencies with a penal concept of payback, where more valid concepts of 'atonement' via simple repentance and returning to God with a penitent heart and contrite spirit are sufficient unto themselves to effect 'reunion' with Deity. (no need for senseless bloodshed or suffering of another, when the law of karma itself effects its own opportunity to right wrongs and make amends for ones behavior. No one else has to suffer for you, as you are responsible for your own sins and salvation, ultimately. Sure all is granted thru grace, thats because God is love, of course, but this never negates the principle of self-responsibility).
Love does not exact or require punishment upon any soul, but does provide all that is essential for absolution, forgivenesss, compelete restoration. The emblems of 'blood' and 'water' are figurative of course as is much in religious writing, which a basic course in metaphysics would do anyone good, to impress the mind to see the estoric meanings behind exoteric forms.
The One Universal Reality not limited to space or time, is radiant in his omnipresence thru-out all space and time and this INCLUDES all races, cultures, schools, traditions, religious books, etc. The infinite includes all and outshines all, in its own radiance, and there is nowhere God is not, even if you assume a shadow is some absence of light, it is really not, but a contrast of form or seeming appearance or illusion.
All that matters at the end of the day of any value is IF your preferred or chosen religious writings provides a real service to you and humanity, for the meaning and value it conveys, and what spiritual fruit and good that can actually PRODUCE.
Zeke
Well-known member
That psychosis was one of many fear based threats to keep the sheep inline, nothing like fear and guilt to control the masses which is the preventive virus that keeps their minds closed to anything other than Bible good everything else bad, the funny part I've been accused of being new age when all I did was use scripture they can't handle, Psalms 78 pretty much supports Galatians 4:24, yet to acknowledge that would mean they have been duped all their life's into reading by the dead letters surface meanings that Paul refutes as milk drinker's stuck on the first elements of the scriptures teachings, worshipping what they should have realized was actually a paradoxical story about them, yet prefer to let someone else own that birthright and stay in bondage Gal 4:1 to the first elements Hebrews 6:1-5 of the teachings that was watered down for the natural mind to learn base spiritual truth through fable and allegory that were portrayals Gal 3:1-5 not literal, but you try and take that bone away and they will bark and bite, even kill for Rome's god and country.