ECT If you want out of the deceptions of MAD read the rebuttal of Bullinger by Ironside.

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Danoh

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dano is a master studier

There is the study of a thing.

And then there is the study of...the study of a thing.

Or as MAD's Jordan has every so often described it, in one or another of his many brilliantly sound studies now on YouTube - "fine tuning backwards."
 
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Interplanner

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The Daystar channel continues to promote the land of Israel as such, the film was called I AM ISRAEL. As the movie showed two weeks ago, it is just neo-Judaism, Hassidism. I don't know of anything pointing to Christ anywhere in it.
 

steko

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The Daystar channel continues to promote the land of Israel as such, the film was called I AM ISRAEL. As the movie showed two weeks ago, it is just neo-Judaism, Hassidism. I don't know of anything pointing to Christ anywhere in it.

That comes later.
 

Interplanner

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That comes later.




But why would we 'go back through Hassidism'? I'm not talking about the 2nd coming Christ, because the NT does not detail him like it does the 1st coming, and then shows the 1st coming Christ to be the fulfillment of all things promised to the fathers, and many other superlatives and titles.
 

Interplanner

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re I AM ISRAEL film.
There's nothing wrong with supporting the state of Israel; we'd rather have that than a caliphate. But there is nothing Christian about it. No more than trying to get rid of NorK. Or Iran. So why would it show up on a Christian station?

This is what is surprising about the movie DOVID MEYER a few weeks ago on Daystar. There's nothing wrong with good advice about adversity in life. But a whole film on a Christian station that says nothing about Christ, not even by way of analogy. The film was an appeal to secular Jews to be Hassidic. And no doubt because of the 'miracles' involved others will want to be Hassidim. Is that somewhere in the NT? In Hebrews?
 

tetelestai

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There is the study of a thing.

And then there is the study of...the study of a thing.

Or as MAD's Jordan has every so often described it, in one or another of his many brilliantly sound studies now on YouTube - "fine tuning backwards."

Oh the irony!
 

Right Divider

Body part
I appreciate that and James Hilston said the same. A good question for another MADist of another color: If one only had the Apostle Paul's letters, would he/she have enough of the gospel? Would he/she be able to 'follow Paul' as he followed Christ?
A false question based on a false premise ("the gospel").

The gospel that saves today is found in Paul's epistles, so let's all believe it.
 

musterion

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He just lied and accused me, and MAD, of preaching two Christs. He's had it explained already, so he's either an imbecile, a drunk or it's deliberate. I vote deliberate.
 

Lon

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I appreciate that and James Hilston said the same. A good question for another MADist of another color: If one only had the Apostle Paul's letters, would he/she have enough of the gospel? Would he/she be able to 'follow Paul' as he followed Christ? That would be the most extreme MAD I could think of and I'm thinking even at that, few and far between if there is such an animal. Most of the MAD I've talked to on here have read and still cherish the Gospels, for instance (it is a random inconclusive sampling of TOL MAD). In Him -Lon
A false question based on a false premise ("the gospel").

The gospel that saves today is found in Paul's epistles, so let's all believe it.
I think I understand MAD, that this would be the 'only' question, rather than a false one, no?

Specifically, I felt I needed to phrase it toward Danoh, in order that others might understand the context. Even now, a few nonMAD may not know the purpose of your post or its meaning. What you are saying, in a nutshell, is that there is no other gospel than that found in Paul's writings.

I guess I'm saying 'in this section with MAD concern' I acquiesce, but for all others, it is something that needed to be asked, I think, the way I asked it.


Rather, I think if you asked "Is there anyplace but Paul that contains the gospel for gentiles?" perhaps. In Him -Lon
 

Right Divider

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I think I understand MAD, that this would be the 'only' question, rather than a false one, no?
No.

Specifically, I felt I needed to phrase it toward Danoh, in order that others might understand the context. Even now, a few nonMAD may not know the purpose of your post or its meaning. What you are saying, in a nutshell, is that there is no other gospel than that found in Paul's writings.
No, that is not at all what I'm saying.

I'm saying that the gospel of the kingdom preached by Christ and His twelve is NOT the gospel of the grace of God. Therefore to say "is there enough of the gospel in Paul's epistles" is simply a bogus question based on a false premise that there is "only one gospel" in the scripture.

I guess I'm saying 'in this section with MAD concern' I acquiesce, but for all others, it is something that needed to be asked, I think, the way I asked it.

Rather, I think if you asked "Is there anyplace but Paul that contains the gospel for gentiles?" perhaps. In Him -Lon
Paul's epistles contain revelation from the Risen Lord Jesus Christ, including the gospel of the grace of God which is how anyone gets saved today.
 

Lon

Well-known member
No.


No, that is not at all what I'm saying.
Which is why, I think, there are some problems and heated discussion.

From what I understand of MAD 1) There were two gospels. 2) Now, only one and contained in Paul's writings. 3) The Gospel of the kingdom is still represented in the nonPauline Epistles and writings, thus a need for others to understand 4) MAD doesn't reject those scriptures, just doesn't use them for direct applications.

I'm saying that the gospel of the kingdom preached by Christ and His twelve is NOT the gospel of the grace of God. Therefore to say "is there enough of the gospel in Paul's epistles" is simply a bogus question based on a false premise that there is "only one gospel" in the scripture.
Right, on that 1-4 above 5) opposed to an idea that the gospel whereby we must be saved, can be found anywhere but in Paul's writings.
While I disagree, understanding your position is important. I would 'think' you get the Acts 2 Dispensational position and likely the Covenant position, but I'm not certain any particular person understands MAD. It isn't too difficult, but it does require, I believe two "before" and "after's."


Paul's epistles contain revelation from the Risen Lord Jesus Christ, including the gospel of the grace of God which is how anyone gets saved today.
Which is what I was asking Danoh, specifically because he is a MAD of a different color. If I am reading him correctly, he disagrees with the extreme of MAD and, I think, sees some gospel elsewhere. For me, Israel (nonMAD, nonDispensational), all of Israel is a picture and template of what God was moving toward: Salvation with all grafted in. As such, while the gospel of the kingdom is partial, it to me, is definitely part of the overall gospel (good news). So, while I see things that do not apply to gentiles (us), directly, I see types and template structure either to learn from, or to figure out further, how to apply. For instance, Hebrews has many truths I learn from. Application is not direct with much of it, yet, I believe Hebrews 12, that God will discipline any and all of His own children, else we all, are illegitimate. Hebrews 6:4? Not about loss of salvation, it is about two God-given dynamics of sacrifice and the need to refuse to go back to animal sacrifices because Christ had already come and the old was obsolete -all examples to explain, not much of it needing a response other than going back to discussing and explaining the MAD position. My intention isn't to side-track but talk about difference so that anyone reading understands the further contexts. It seems to me, grasping those would alleviate some of these threads as well as some of the peripherals in these threads.
 
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