How far are we down the road to totalitarianism

Yorzhik

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I do think the media is problematic. It is very hard these days to sort out what is real and what isn't- and the media tend to sensationalize everything.

Even given that, I find it hard to understand how someone as widely read as you can think this pandemic is fake.
Because the numbers of people dying is no more than a normal year? Because once someone lies to you it should take a long time for you to believe them again? Because the MSM has means, motive, and opportunity to lie to you and suppress any evidence to the contrary? Because what gets Bill Gates excited is lowing the population, which would be at odds with his vaccine programs so you should be wary of his intentions? Because government taking advantage of crisis to gain power seems to be a go-to strategy every single time there is a crisis... or even if they can claim there is a crisis when there isn't one and the MSM will help them? There are probably a few more reasons but this is what I can come up with off the top of my head.
 

chair

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Because the numbers of people dying is no more than a normal year? Because once someone lies to you it should take a long time for you to believe them again? Because the MSM has means, motive, and opportunity to lie to you and suppress any evidence to the contrary? Because what gets Bill Gates excited is lowing the population, which would be at odds with his vaccine programs so you should be wary of his intentions? Because government taking advantage of crisis to gain power seems to be a go-to strategy every single time there is a crisis... or even if they can claim there is a crisis when there isn't one and the MSM will help them? There are probably a few more reasons but this is what I can come up with off the top of my head.
hmm
Go to your local hospital and see for yourself. Check local papers for local news- papers that aren't affiliated with MSM. Ask friends who work in hospitals.

For example, my niece works as a hospital nurse in northern California. Her ward is being turned into a COVID ward.

You don't have to be completely dependent on any media.
 

Yorzhik

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hmm
Go to your local hospital and see for yourself. Check local papers for local news- papers that aren't affiliated with MSM. Ask friends who work in hospitals.

For example, my niece works as a hospital nurse in northern California. Her ward is being turned into a COVID ward.

You don't have to be completely dependent on any media.
Yeah, not only is my daughter a nurse, but I get information about the surrounding hospitals from the director of the nursing program that places nurses in hospitals from their program. No, there is not an increase in occupancy. They are creating more capacity for COVID patients because:
1) The state is paying for it and it would be a bad business move to refuse the money
2) They have to react to case increase even if every case increase in the past didn't mean overcapacity; because if they do get overloaded they have to show they didn't ignore the trend.

Even the refrigerator trucks used as morgues in NY way back when they were killing grandmas were an alternative to using the morgue capacity of surrounding areas... but of course the trucks were a great fear mongering device.

So, yeah, I get information on both sides of the issue. But your response didn't answer any of my questions: Because the numbers of people dying is no more than a normal year? Because once someone lies to you it should take a long time for you to believe them again? Because the MSM has means, motive, and opportunity to lie to you and suppress any evidence to the contrary? Because what gets Bill Gates excited is lowing the population, which would be at odds with his vaccine programs so you should be wary of his intentions? Because government taking advantage of crisis to gain power seems to be a go-to strategy every single time there is a crisis... or even if they can claim there is a crisis when there isn't one and the MSM will help them?

Doesn't this answer your question about how this pandemic is an over-reaction and people who, using the shorthand of saying "it's a hoaxdemic" or similar language are reasonable?
 

ffreeloader

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Because the numbers of people dying is no more than a normal year? Because once someone lies to you it should take a long time for you to believe them again? Because the MSM has means, motive, and opportunity to lie to you and suppress any evidence to the contrary? Because what gets Bill Gates excited is lowing the population, which would be at odds with his vaccine programs so you should be wary of his intentions? Because government taking advantage of crisis to gain power seems to be a go-to strategy every single time there is a crisis... or even if they can claim there is a crisis when there isn't one and the MSM will help them? There are probably a few more reasons but this is what I can come up with off the top of my head.
Very good post, Yorzhik. I would only add that instead of "once someone lies to you" be replaced with "when someone has been repeatedly lying to you are you going to readily believe them". But Chair will never answer those questions. They have common sense, reasonable answers that any honest person would give. Nobody, other than socialists believe liars, or at least pretend to, in real life. Socialists will believe, or at least pretend to, the biggest liars in the world because their agenda.
 

JudgeRightly

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hmm
Go to your local hospital and see for yourself. Check local papers for local news- papers that aren't affiliated with MSM. Ask friends who work in hospitals.

For example, my niece works as a hospital nurse in northern California. Her ward is being turned into a COVID ward.

You don't have to be completely dependent on any media.

Chair, are you aware of how full hospitals are currently? What their capacity is? What their ICU capacity is? Are they anywhere near full?

Do you think they are?

Because, currently, they're nowhere near capacity, and no one is calling for increased ICU capacity. Why?

Because no one wants to look like a fool when, yet again, such capacity isn't needed, just like it wasn't needed back in early 2020, when America mobilized a massive effort to prepare for a wave of sick people that never showed up. Entire field hospitals were set up, to not even be used.

So what are the numbers?


You should take your own advice, Chair.


Both of my parents are medical professionals (Dad is OB/GYN, Mom is an RN). Except for early last year, when they were working extremely hard due to the perceived threat, things have been fairly normal for them, and I haven't heard them say anything about any lack of space for people. (Granted, my town isn't a very big one, but still around 20k people.)

There's no influx of people who are sick because of Covid. No one is calling for increased ICU capacity because it won't be needed, and hospitals are not going to come anywhere near full, let alone overflowing, due to the "second wave."

Again, take your own advice. Stop believing everything the MSM tells you.
 

ffreeloader

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I do think the media is problematic. It is very hard these days to sort out what is real and what isn't- and the media tend to sensationalize everything.

Even given that, I find it hard to understand how someone as widely read as you can think this pandemic is fake.
So, you're going to admit the media has problems and you can't tell what's real and what isn't, yet you buy into all their stories, and claim anything that contradicts them is a conspiracy theory and misinformation. Ever heard of cognitive dissonance? You're exhibiting a whole bunch of it in your post. You say you don't trust the press but at the very same time trust them completely for you parrot everything they say and you say any one who contradicts their stories is a "conspiracy theorist".

Definition of cognitive dissonance



: psychological conflict resulting from incongruous beliefs and attitudes held simultaneously
 

chair

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So, COVID is a Hoax, and:

  1. All government bodies are twisting the facts in order to maintain the hoax. This includes health services, including local bodies and national ones such the CDC.
  2. The above is true for nearly all nations on Earth, including communist dictatorships, western democracies, Islamic regimes monarchies etc.
  3. This hoax is being pulled off by the Powers Behind the Scenes in order to control regular people.
  4. Alternate press outlets are the only ones who see what's going on. The rest have been bought off or duped.

Do I have this right?
 

JudgeRightly

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I have been hearing that from several here.

Sorry, but that won't cut it. Bearing false witness is a sin, Chair.

Name names. Quote posts.

Because I haven't seen ANYONE say that COVID is a hoax on TOL.

Covid isn't more dangerous than the flu,

COVID may be slightly more deadly, but it's not the pandemic that people on the left are making it out to be.

the hospitals are not full...scroll up...

Can you provide proof that the hospitals are, in fact, full? Because I just gave you a link that is updated constantly that SHOWS how full hospitals are. They're at about 71% capacity for all patients, 18% for in-patients, and 63% of ICU beds occupied (all patients)

That's not full hospitals, Chair, no matter how you cut it.
 

ffreeloader

Well-known member
So, COVID is a Hoax, and:

  1. All government bodies are twisting the facts in order to maintain the hoax. This includes health services, including local bodies and national ones such the CDC.
  2. The above is true for nearly all nations on Earth, including communist dictatorships, western democracies, Islamic regimes monarchies etc.
  3. This hoax is being pulled off by the Powers Behind the Scenes in order to control regular people.
  4. Alternate press outlets are the only ones who see what's going on. The rest have been bought off or duped.

Do I have this right?
Some time after you answer my post I'll answer yours.
 
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