How Are Atheists, Agnostics etc "Hating God"?

Arthur Brain

Arthur Brain

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This may have been broached before but after an exchange with AMR in TH's thread I decided to open it out into a separate thread so as not to derail that one and invite further opinion here.

AMR's original comment:

"My exposure here has not modified my views of non-believers. They hate God with every breath they take. Sadly, they just do not know it to be the fact of the matter."

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...L-Experience&p=5241881&viewfull=1#post5241881

My reply:

"Not to derail the thread too much but this is such an oxymoronic statement (not just espoused by you to be fair) that it needs to be addressed. If you hate something or someone then that involves passion, just as it does with its counterpart love. There are no illusions on the matter and you can't "not know" you're hating along with the reasons that prompt such a reaction, just the same as when you fall in love with or love someone. To say that atheists "hate God with every breath they take and don't know it to be fact" is simply nonsense. I'm presuming you're applying this to agnostics etc as well? The lack of belief in a deity isn't synonymous with hate. Atheists don't believer in a deity or the likelihood of one existing to hate."

So, how is it possible to hate something or someone you don't believe or aren't convinced happens to even exist?
 
Rusha

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Arthur Brain said:
This may have been broached before but after an exchange with AMR in TH's thread I decided to open it out into a separate thread so as not to derail that one and invite further opinion here.

AMR's original comment:

"My exposure here has not modified my views of non-believers. They hate God with every breath they take. Sadly, they just do not know it to be the fact of the matter."

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...L-Experience&p=5241881&viewfull=1#post5241881

My reply:

"Not to derail the thread too much but this is such an oxymoronic statement (not just espoused by you to be fair) that it needs to be addressed. If you hate something or someone then that involves passion, just as it does with its counterpart love. There are no illusions on the matter and you can't "not know" you're hating along with the reasons that prompt such a reaction, just the same as when you fall in love with or love someone. To say that atheists "hate God with every breath they take and don't know it to be fact" is simply nonsense. I'm presuming you're applying this to agnostics etc as well? The lack of belief in a deity isn't synonymous with hate. Atheists don't believer in a deity or the likelihood of one existing to hate."

So, how is it possible to hate something or someone you don't believe or aren't convinced happens to even exist?
Click to expand...

It's not ... it's about an unwillingness to accept that someone else just does not/cannot view things that same as you. I see it as a defense mechanism. It takes faith to believe in something that cannot be proven. While I don't have an issue with others having such faith and belief, it only relates to them. Not me. I am the ONLY person qualified to know what I think and believe.

Also, it is an immediate end of further discussion by virtue of insult.
 
Arthur Brain

Arthur Brain

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Rusha said:
It's not ... it's about an unwillingness to accept that someone else just does not/cannot view things that same as you. I see it as a defense mechanism. It takes faith to believe in something that cannot be proven. While I don't have an issue with others having such faith and belief, it only relates to them. Not me. I am the ONLY person qualified to know what I think and believe.

Also, it is an immediate end of further discussion by virtue of insult.
Click to expand...

I think the "defense mechanism" aspect is interesting as logically such a position can't be maintained. In order to hate/love, be angry/moved, you have to be emotionally invested to have such a passionate response to another person or circumstance to begin with.
 
S

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Arthur Brain said:
I think the "defense mechanism" aspect is interesting as logically such a position can't be maintained. In order to hate/love, be angry/moved, you have to be emotionally invested to have such a passionate response to another person or circumstance to begin with.
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I said
Your not looking at it from the spiritual perspective. There is no straddling the fence.

[Mat 12:30
30 "He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.
[Luk 11:23
23 "He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters.
 
Ask Mr. Religion

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The non-believer suppresses knowledge of God written upon their hearts (Rom. 1:18). The non-believer's heart is deceitful (Jer. 17:9). Taking both facts together, a non-believer can think he is being honest in saying he does not believe in God, but it is self-deception. And such self-deception requires continual effort to maintain—that's the suppression in unrighteousness. That is what is so terribly remarkable about the deceitful heart: it leads one to "honestly" believe in a lie (Romans 1:25).

There is no distinction between the agnostic or the atheist. Both are in possession of the knowledge of God. Both deny Him. The pretentious pretending of the self-proclaimed agnostic does not decrease his sin (I would believe if I only knew) below the sin of the atheist (I know God does not exist).

Our Lord plainly told non-believers, “If God were your Father, ye would love me”, but they did not love God above or the incarnated God standing before there very eyes. Rather, said Our Lord, “Ye are of your father the devil”. The unbeliever’s enmity against God and love of another master is plain.

Since non-believers love the world and those who are of the world, it is therefore infallibly true that they hate the opposite of the world. God and the world are opposites; he who loves the one hates the other.

See vol. 3 of à Brakel:
http://www.abrakel.com/p/christians-reasonable-service.html

AMR
 
T

Truster

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When "A" precedes a word it means "without".

Atheist, which is only used once in scripture by Paul, means without Theos or without God/Elohim.

Agnostic means without knowledge. Generally accepted as without saving knowledge of the Almighty.

In both cases the fact a person is "without" is that it pleases the Eternal to leave them in that cursed state.
 
J

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Truster said:
When "A" precedes a word it means "without".

Atheist, which is only used once in scripture by Paul, means without Theos or without God/Elohim.

Agnostic means without knowledge. Generally accepted as without saving knowledge of the Almighty.

In both cases the fact a person is "without" is that it pleases the Eternal to leave them in that cursed state.
Click to expand...

Ah, a truly loving deity. Your deity is happy that certain of his creation is cursed. Some father.
 
Rusha

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Truster said:
When "A" precedes a word it means "without".

Atheist, which is only used once in scripture by Paul, means without Theos or without God/Elohim.

Agnostic means without knowledge. Generally accepted as without saving knowledge of the Almighty.

In both cases the fact a person is "without" is that it pleases the Eternal to leave them in that cursed state.
Click to expand...

Jonahdog said:
Ah, a truly loving deity. Your deity is happy that certain of his creation is cursed. Some father.
Click to expand...

As an Agnostic, I *personally* found Truster's reply non-offensive as compared to the overused claim of "You know He exists and just hate him". His comment, IMO, is speaking about his understanding of God's mindset while the claim that NON-believers *hate* God seems to more of a personal projection. What it does it shut down all communications because there it insinuates that a non-believer is lying about their beliefs.
 
quip

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Ask Mr. Religion said:
The non-believer suppresses knowledge of God written upon their hearts (Rom. 1:18). The non-believer's heart is deceitful (Jer. 17:9). Taking both facts together, a non-believer can think he is being honest in saying he does not believe in God, but it is self-deception.
AMR
Click to expand...

God writes knowledge upon our hearts, yet the heart is deceitful?! :idunno: Are you speaking from the heart here?

"Taking both facts together"....isn't much of an answer, else:

"Taking both facts together, a non-believer can think he is being honest in saying he does not believe in God, but it is self-deception."
 
Right Divider

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quip said:
God writes knowledge upon our hearts, yet the heart is deceitful?! :idunno: Are you speaking from the heart here?

"Taking both facts together"....isn't much of an answer, else:

"Taking both facts together, a non-believer can think he is being honest in saying he does not believe in God, but it is self-deception."
Click to expand...
Your hatred of God and His Word are already well known, no need to beat a dead horse.
 
quip

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Ask Mr. Religion said:
Since non-believers love the world and those who are of the world, it is therefore infallibly true that they hate the opposite of the world. God and the world are opposites; he who loves the one hates the other.

AMR
Click to expand...

By maintaining such strict bivalent logic, you must hate mankind, the world i.e. all of God's "opposing" creation. Is this not - infallibly - the case?
 
Ktoyou

Ktoyou

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Ask Mr. Religion said:
The non-believer suppresses knowledge of God written upon their hearts (Rom. 1:18). The non-believer's heart is deceitful (Jer. 17:9). Taking both facts together, a non-believer can think he is being honest in saying he does not believe in God, but it is self-deception. And such self-deception requires continual effort to maintain—that's the suppression in unrighteousness. That is what is so terribly remarkable about the deceitful heart: it leads one to "honestly" believe in a lie (Romans 1:25).

There is no distinction between the agnostic or the atheist. Both are in possession of the knowledge of God. Both deny Him. The pretentious pretending of the self-proclaimed agnostic does not decrease his sin (I would believe if I only knew) below the sin of the atheist (I know God does not exist).

Our Lord plainly told non-believers, “If God were your Father, ye would love me”, but they did not love God above or the incarnated God standing before there very eyes. Rather, said Our Lord, “Ye are of your father the devil”. The unbeliever’s enmity against God and love of another master is plain.

Since non-believers love the world and those who are of the world, it is therefore infallibly true that they hate the opposite of the world. God and the world are opposites; he who loves the one hates the other.

See vol. 3 of à Brakel:
http://www.abrakel.com/p/christians-reasonable-service.html

AMR
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It mainly depends on how one is raised, and in this case, most all in the USA and western Europe know what God is and has had some teachings on religion.

On a philosophical level, not believing in God is nonsense, since it is an affirmative position, not knowing, what is not provable without faith cannot know.

What one can do and is more likely the case, is believe death is final for all mortal beings. This has not relation to God in any direct sense.
 
Ktoyou

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quip said:
By maintaining such strict bivalent logic, you must hate mankind, the world i.e. all of God's "opposing" creation. Is this not - infallibly - the case?
Click to expand...

this does not really follow. All you can assert with any meaning is you do not believe in an afterlife.
 
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