Hello everyone

[serpentdove]

"Even I can't make it through what SerpentDove is quoting! Ya know a good scripture in the NT says that it is the love of God that draws us to Him. Where's your love, bro?...Remember the "adulterous woman" in the NT? Jesus did not lecture her. He knew she was an adulterer. She knew she was an adulterer. But guess what? He did not condemn her. He knew her heart."

What did he know about her heart? That it was wicked? (Jer 17:9). She was a sinner in need of a savior and Jesus ministered to her soul. "If you only knew the gift God has for you and who you are speaking to, you would ask me, and I would give you living water (Jn 4:10)."

If only she knew. :noway: People need to know. It is not ok to respond to God in sin and rebellion (Ec 7:9; Mt 5:22; Ro 12:19).

"...Unless you are a 5 point Calvinist, then that explains everything. No offense, but even if you are a 5 pointer, SerpentDove, you do not know who has and who has not been chosen..."

I am not a Calvinist.

See:

Does God Elect Everyone? http://www.vananne.com/armorofthelord/AOG Does God Elect Everyone.htm

 

[lucy]

What did he know about her heart? That it was wicked? (Jer 17:9). She was a sinner in need of a savior and Jesus ministered to her soul. "If you only knew the gift God has for you and who you are speaking to, you would ask me, and I would give you living water (Jn 4:10)."

If only she knew. :noway: People need to know. It is not ok to respond to God in sin and rebellion (Ec 7:9; Mt 5:22; Ro 12:19).

He knew that she was aware that her life was a mess. She was in a state of rebellion against God, as shown by her lifestyle - she was going from man to man to man. That she was "looking for love in all the wrong places" so to speak. That she did not know how to get out of the mess she was in. Regardless of that, what I am talking about is the way Jesus handled the situation. He did not jump in there with the Pharisees and quote every OT scripture to prove to her she was a sinner. Instead, he said nothing to her. He did not accuse her, although of all those in the crowd there that day, He was the only one who really had the right to do so. He established a relationship of caring first, he gave her hope, first, then he spoke the truth to her "Go and sin no more". He did not quote the OT. to her, although he could have gone on and on about it. She already knew all that. He did the same with the woman at the well. She already knew that she was a mess, as evidenced by the fact that she did not go to the well at the same time as everybody else. Again, Jesus did not quote the OT to her- she already knew she had a problem. He established a relationship with her first, he answered her questions first, then he told her about God's gift, last, he told her to go and sin no more. He did not put the cart before the horse. She was used to people telling her she was an evil woman - she was used to telling herself that as well. Jesus turned her focus from the sin to the answer. It is my belief that this is the pattern for evangelism we are to follow. You befriend someone, you care about them and their problems, and you share with them, not preach at them. Yes, people need to know the gospel, but let's not make the same mistakes as people in the past - you don't ask people to change their behavior, you just share the love of Christ and let the Holy Spirit do the rest. He is the one who will convict the world (i.e. people) of their sin. Jesus did not sit around telling the disciples what a bunch of losers they were, although they really were a bunch of misfits. He became their friend first, then their teacher. That's my story and I'm stick'in to it!

I am not a Calvinist.

Glad to hear it.

See:

Does God Elect Everyone? http://www.vananne.com/armorofthelord/AOG Does God Elect Everyone.htm[/QUOTE]

 

[serpentdove]

"...he said nothing to her"

He opened his mouth and spoke (Prov 31:9). So did John the Baptist to Herod (Mark 6:17, 18).

"Jesus did not quote the OT to her..."

What's wrong with the OT? :idunno: Do you think God changes? (Mal 3:6).

"It is my belief that this is the pattern for evangelism we are to follow. You befriend someone, you care about them and their problems, and you share with them, not preach at them."

That's great. :thumb: Do that--give friends helpful advice.

The full soul loatheth an honeycomb; but to the hungry soul every bitter thing is sweet [Prov. 27:7].

"This is the reason we have gourmet cooking in our day. We are a pampered people who have so much to eat that the food must be prepared in unusual ways or the foods must be exotic and unusual to whet our appetites. Some people need hummingbird wings or peacock tongues served to them before they can really enjoy their food. That is why cooking reached such a high degree of perfection in the European countries like France, Italy, Spain, and Germany. The ruling class had such plenty that they got tired of eating plain food. A tenderloin steak or filet mignon or strawberries and ice cream were just not good enough for them. So the chefs of that day had to concoct unusual and tasty foods for them.

Contrast this with the hungry man. Food, all food, any food tastes good to him.

One can also apply this to the Word of God. We are to eat it, chew it, ruminate on it. Actually, this is what it means to meditate on the Word of God. May God give us an appetite, a real hunger for His Word!"
McGee, J. V. (1997, c1981). Thru the Bible commentary. Based on the Thru the Bible radio program. (electronic ed.) (3:91). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.

"Yes, people need to know the gospel, but let's not make the same mistakes as people in the past - you don't ask people to change their behavior..."

Would have told John the Baptist that?--Rebuked him a little for confronting Herod, maybe? (Enyart). Jesus said of John the Baptist: "Assuredly, I say to you, among those born of women there has not risen one greater than John the Baptist (Mt 11:11)."

"...[J]ust share the love of Christ and let the Holy Spirit do the rest."

That's great. Do that. :thumb: God says open your mouth and speak (Prov 31:9).

"Jesus did not sit around telling the disciples what a bunch of losers they were..."

"Get behind me, Satan!" (Mt16:23). Satan does not want the word of God getting out either.

" became their friend first, then their teacher."

Friends are good. They do what God says to do (John 15:14)--like opening their mouths (Prov 31:9). False friends are bad (Mt 26:49). Loving your enemy means telling him the truth (Prov 27:5).

 

[serpentdove]

I'm not angry at God. I just realized that your God simply doesn't exist.

So you're a foolish witch. each: I wouldn't say that. God would (Ps 14:1). It's nice to know how to classify people. I don't think they offer a "foolish witch" selection.

 

[lightbringer]

So you're a foolish witch. each: I wouldn't say that. God would (Ps 14:1). It's nice to know how to classify people. I don't think they offer a "foolish witch" selection.

Too bad, it's actually fun to be a little foolish once in awhile, keeps us from becoming anal!

 

[Newman]

Too bad, it's actually fun to be a little foolish once in awhile, keeps us from becoming anal!

Amen. Hakuna Matata.

 

[Thunder's Muse]

God is on the right (Heb 1:3). Where we depart from him in our thinking and worldview, we are wrong--not him. What's wrong with shifting in your seat to the right a little? .

God is a right wing fanatic? Really?

I have placed myself 'more left than right' because I am flexible, compassionate and realise that life is not simply black and white.

They say that when their false teaching is revealed. Notice, they attack the messenger. They did that to Jesus when he revealed truth, too. They "bashed" him something fierce, didn't they?

Well, I can't speak with authority about the Catholic Church, so I'm not going to say anything at all.

We live in a Christ-rejecting world. People must deal with Jesus and the claims of the Bible. We are commanded to repent. It's not a suggestion (Ac 2:38).

Did you ever stop to think why people reject Jesus? Perhaps it has something to do with the people who claim association with him.

Responding in anger and rebellion toward God is not the right response (Nu 14:9; Jos 22:19). It provokes God (Nu 16:30; Ne 9:26) and Christ (Ex 23:20,21; 1Co 10:9). It vexes the Holy Spirit (Isa 63:10).

It is connected with stubbornness (Deut 31:27), corruption (Isa 1:23), and contempt for God (Ps 107:11).
Torrey, R. (1995, c1897). The new topical text book : A scriptural text book for the use of ministers, teachers, and all Christian workers.

Look, I'm not going to get into a debate with you about how God deals with peoples hurts and anger. I believe that God understands, that He is patient and that He loves people enough to see past the walls they have built around their heart. Speaking from personal experience, I know this to be true.

 

[lightbringer]

Amen. Hakuna Matata.

Oh no! I'm seeing pink talking rabbits, wait, I don't drink, don't do drugs, OK, is that a disguise your wearing?

If ya can't have a bit of fun in your life, give it up!

 

[lightbringer]

God is a right wing fanatic? Really?

Hey I got it on good authority, God is a right wing fanatical zealot, just ask ReptilFeathers, he'll tell you!:rotfl:

I wonder if he resembles his (ReptilFeathers) avatar, I bet he does!

 

[Nightangel1282]

Hilary Clinton's favorite Bible verse (Enyart)? Read verse two (Mt 7:2). We are not to judge hypocritically. That means--if you are going to talk the talk, you'd better be willing to walk the walk--you'd better be willing to be judged by the same standard.

So you get to judge anybody who disagrees with your standards? You're such a nice man (sarcasm)

The Christian is to judge rightly (Prov 31:9). You only find the non-judgmental verses of scripture "lovely"?

Well, I don't recall Jesus Christ judging people like you are... Was he wrong in his approach?

God will judge. It is wise to throw yourself upon the mercy of the court before you ever get to trial. Judgment is a first principle of the gospel (Heb 6:2).

I'm not throwing myself at the mercy of ANYBODY. I will fight to the death for my rights!

You are a child-killer

So you're assuming I've had an abortion now? Listen you judgemental idiot, I've never even been PREGNANT! I've never even had SEX (willingly at least), and you're calling me a CHILD KILLER?! You're lucky I'm not allowed to swear in this board or I would ream you out so badly your GOD would turn blue in the FACE!!!! I LOVE CHILDREN!!! I would NEVER EVER IN A MILLION YEARS HARM ONE!! However.... A CLUMP OF CELLS IS NOT A HUMAN BEING!!!!!!! GET THAT THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULL!!!!!!!!!!!

Let's go with your plan--kill them all (Jn 10:10). :reals: Liberals fail to think of consequences for their actions (Eccl 10:2).

Um, no, let's try going with my plan to PRACTICE SAFE SEX!! Just because I don't DISAGREE with abortion, does not mean I think EVERYBODY should get one! What the heck's the matter with you?! I know like ten people who are pregnant right now and only ONE is planning on aborting the child! Want to know why? SHE'S FIFTEEN!!!! AND THE MAN LEFT HER!!! The others are all twenty-thirty years old and were PLANNING on getting pregnant! So your arguments are bull, end of story!

I clarified Adam and Eve were created perfect in the garden. After the fall, they were imperfect. Sin has a real physical effect on the world and people. Using your body as God did not intend also has a real, physical effect on the body (1 Cor. 6:18) and the soul (1 Cor. 6:9). Fornication comes from an evil heart (Matt. 15:19).

No matter how many times I say this, it's not drilling into your thick skull.... IF ADAM AND EVE WERE CREATED PERFECT, THEY WOULD NOT HAVE FALLEN IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!!!!

"Using your body in a way that God did not intend, is like hitching a plow to the back of a Cadillac. You'll destroy your car. Disobey God and you'll destroy not only your physical body , but your heart, mind and soul as well (Pv 5:11). God is not a cosmic killjoy just wanting to take away your fun (Hanegraaff). Every kick has its kick back (Rogers). The playboy's payday is death (Rogers). Payday-- someday. Our lives belong to God. They are not our own. Dishonoring ourselves is dishonoring God as we are made in His image..."full text: (Armor of the Lord http://vananne.com/armorofthelord/)

Please stop with that stupid website. It's filled with fail.

Where did I claim to be perfect? God is perfect (Mt 5:48). We are not (Job 9:20; Php 3:12).

Well, you're acting as though you know everything. And incidentally, if heaven exists and it's filled with people like you, I'll take my chances in Hell, thankyou.

 

[Nightangel1282]

So you're a foolish witch. each: I wouldn't say that. God would (Ps 14:1). It's nice to know how to classify people. I don't think they offer a "foolish witch" selection.

::YAWN!!:: Another scripture from your little Big Book. Give it up. I'm ready to quit listening to you altogether. You see my arguments, but you completely ignore them, so this isn't a debate. It's you saying "I'm right, you're wrong, and here are the scriptures to PROVE it!" Let me say something for the zillionth time... I don't believe in the bible so throwing scripture at me won't work.

 

[Thunder's Muse]

Perhaps it's time to use your ignore button

 

[Nightangel1282]

Perhaps it's time to use your ignore button

I will if he keeps outright saying I'm evil and that I'm a baby killer and everything else he keeps insinuating in his posts.

 

[Thunder's Muse]

I will if he keeps outright saying I'm evil and that I'm a baby killer and everything else he keeps insinuating in his posts.

Some people on TOL like the shock factor. If they have no reasonable argument, they resort to insults and extremes.

It won't take you long to work out which ones they are.

 

[lightbringer]

Some people on TOL like the shock factor. If they have no reasonable argument, they resort to insults and extremes.

It won't take you long to work out which ones they are.

Do I remember those people....seemed the day I joined the name calling and insults started. Some people think the extreme fanaticism will over power every one, so sorry, it doesn't work with all of us.
Some of us will just dig in for the duration and battle it out, especially when there is no foundation for the accusations.

The primary function of the insults and false accusations is to get you to loose your temper and say something that will get you banned, it worked with me, got banned a couple times and got some infractions on my list, can't say that each one was deserved but most where, so I changed tactics with the hecklers.

Hang tough, research what you say, maintain your belief and keep cool headed and they will back off!

 

[lightbringer]

I will if he keeps outright saying I'm evil and that I'm a baby killer and everything else he keeps insinuating in his posts.

To some on TOL you will always be the evil baby killer simply because you are a Wiccan, accept that, continue with your debates and opinions, there are those that will be able to see through all the garbage and see you for what you are!

There where others that where just down right mean and hateful, most of them are gone, when they see they can't get a rise out of you they do go away, some get banned, yes even those that profess to be Christians have been banned.

ReptileFeathers is a special case, but he too will become a non-entity in time. Even some of the Christians get tired of the continual copy and past thing he loves so much, and from time to time announce that.

Keep in mind that at one time in our history the popular religion of the day ran rampant without restraint and tried their best to kill off our belief. All they succeeded in doing was forcing it underground.

We are still here!

 

[serpentdove]

"I have placed myself 'more left than right' because I am flexible, compassionate and realize that life is not simply black and white."

The Bible is a black and white book. You must be nicer than God (Enyart).

"Did you ever stop to think why people reject Jesus? Perhaps it has something to do with the people who claim association with him."

Are we all to be fat cherubs with rosy cheeks and harps at our side? I thought you said you were "flexible". Tell me about this "flexible" deity.

Why do you think God made the prophet Jeremiah and the prophet Ezekiel so different?

"I'm not going to get into a debate with you about how God deals with peoples hurts and anger. I believe that God understands..."

God understands people. He has also made it clear that sin and rebellion are not the right response to him (Ec 7:9; Mt 5:22; Ro 12:19). Are you more understanding than God?

"He loves people enough to see past the walls they have built around their heart."

He loves people. He hates pride (Mal 1:3). Sometimes he breaks hearts to make them new (Is. 48:4).

 

[lightbringer]

The Bible is a black and white book. You must be nicer than God Enyart.

?

 

[serpentdove]

[Nicer than God]?

"Christians today are nicer than God. Or at least they are trying to be so. In the Church there is a standard of niceness that Jesus failed to reach while on earth. Comparing God's attitude and behavior with that of the Church today shows that believers are far more polite, tolerant, understanding and respectful to the wicked than God is..." full text: Nicer Than God http://kgov.com/writings/nicer-god

 

[lightbringer]

"Christians today are nicer than God. Or at least they are trying to be so. In the Church there is a standard of niceness that Jesus failed to reach while on earth. Comparing God's attitude and behavior with that of the Church today shows that believers are far more polite, tolerant, understanding and respectful to the wicked than God is..." full text: Nicer Than God http://kgov.com/writings/nicer-god

What happened to you? "Christians today are nicer than God.":rotfl:

You get "left behind" pun intended!:rapture:

Please, posting Enyart links to me doesn't work...he would be the last Christian I would follow.