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Genesis 1:6 Why did God want the water to be divided?

tieman55

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Overall, Brown’s Hydroplate Model is the best to date model and it is solid. But it has problems, to much heat is one, Enyart acknowledges as much talking about the heat after the flood Enyart says "the canopy as one that also has" a heat problem. Another problem is "leaky" as Dr. Baumgardner stated that his biggest objection to Hydroplate, "it would quickly leak". Bob's come back is that "God would have made the earth perfect" ok but the Hydroplate Model doesn't show a perfect earth, it shows a ticking time bomb.

I propose changes that will fix the heat, the leak and the bomb aspects of the Hydroplate model. All the problems are fixed in a new light placed on Genesis 1:6.

I see, Brown and Enyart overlooking the main idea in Gen. 1:6 “And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters."

The two great men, I believe, miss Gen. 1:6 in two different ways, first the raqia (firmament) was metal not granite, Hoba style. And then they jumped right into devising the division before they pondered why God wanted a division in the very first place. To me after looking at it closely, the “why” seems to be only an afterthought of Enyart and Brown.

The only explanation that I could find from Enyart or Brown that explicitly states God's purpose in Gen.1:6 for dividing the waters is Bob's introduction to the Hydroplate seminar when he says God divided the waters for judgement. Enyart, "If the waters were reserved for Judgement". Later on Bob uses Psalms 24 to infer that the water below was "reserved for judgement"... and both of those makes me grimace, even though it is possible, it is not palatable to me, it just doesn't ring true. Bob, knew there were problems with the Hydroplate model and even said "I am not saying it is right in every aspect". And Bob seems to admit that there is a heat problem as he tacitly said both models "have one". (canopy and Hydroplate)

The idea of "reserved for judgement" is just not satisfactory for me. The idea that practically the first thought of our Father is "judgement"? I believe that there has to be a much better reason for God's work in Gen 1:6, and the proof of a better reason will be its leading to an easy fix for the problems with Browns Model via design changes. With no more heat problem, no more leaks, and no ticking time bomb.

As I studied the model, the focus was on with what did God divide the water with? But, I first wanted to know why did He want them divided? I couldn't possibly know in what manner God separated the waters until I knew why He wanted them separate? Only then can I envision an appropriate model.

In trying to determine why God decided to separate water, and using only prior Genesis verses, it doesn't take long, as there isn't much there. All I am left with is, why would you, I or God want to separate water?

Water in nature is fleeting, you can dam it, contain it, but it kind of has a mind of its own. To the extent man can contain water here are a few reasons, mostly by type, you might segregate it: Fresh / salt, potable / non-potable, water use for humans, animal consumption, animal and marine life habitat, water for crop irrigation. Water for swimming, bathing, drinking, cooking, washing, for sanitary uses. And I'm sure there are many others reasons to separate water. For me, it would never enter my mind to use it for judgement, would God? Hey it is possible.

None of those reasons stick out to me, but here is one that does, so I set it apart and I will focus on it. That one reason that makes me think is: hot and cold water. Everyone that I know has a hot water heater and we separate the hot water from the cold. If God had hot and cold water as part of His design, whether He intended it that way or if it was a byproduct, He would have to keep them separated if he wanted to keep them hot and cold. Why might God want to have hot and cold water?

The earth, the animals and man need water, cool water is the most sensible to have in abundance so why would there be a need for vast amounts of hot water? Or maybe a better question is, God had foreseen having vast amounts energy inside the earth, and so He designed it so that He could absorb that energy and use it elsewhere. If He divided the water above and below, the water below could absorb the energy and as any good engineer would do, God would use the heat energy elsewhere.

In Browns Hydroplate model, water is heated by the tidal action of lifting the land in the underground pools via the Sun and moon in the depths of the earth. But unless something is done with that water it is a ticking time bomb, so to speak, as it gets hotter and hotter, so if Brown is right, and I say at minimum he is very close, then God decides to use the heat and control the temperature of the underground vault via heat transfer.

The scripture that helps make this case comes from Enyart. Ps 24:2 Enyart uses a translation that ends in "water" but there are other translations like "currents and the rivers”, “streams and the rivers", Seas and waters, and rivers. Rivers is the number one choice of translators. AMPC: Ps 24:2 “For He has founded it upon the seas and established it upon the currents and the rivers.” That is the version that best fits my vision, for Browns vault's.

Simply change the Hydroplate from segregated water to flowing Rivers, or currents, or streams that carry the heat out and that fixes the heat problem. Where do we take/put the heat? You take it to the upper latitudes where the sun doesn't shine as much, and if you do that you will have plant life up there that large animals like Woolly Mammoths like. That use of water is far more palatable than judgement.

Changing the raqia to metal, like Hoba, changes the dynamics needed for the balance of the crust, and answers Baumgardner leaky problem. Those are changes that fix Browns model.

With the changes in place the timing for the breaking open of the "fountains of the deep" will be far more foreseeable, as it doesn't happen with no warning. The results are mostly the same. With the fixes, the presents of "supercritical" water is optional.

A bit about "supercritical" water. The name infers some great power, which there is none. Supercritical water is used in modern day electrical generation stations. The water is pressurized well above the supercritical of 3200 psi and then heated to well above the supercritical temp 706 F and the water never turns to steam. The water turns to steam as it enters the steam turbine. At that point it is the pressure drop that give the water the ability to vaporize and not the addition of fuel.

I believe the Hydroplate Model is still lacking in a few other ways but is by far and away superior, with all its flaws, to all the other Models.
 

JudgeRightly

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The HPT does not have a heat problem.

And there is nothing wrong with God building a contingency plan into His creation. That's the wise thing to do.
 

tieman55

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Half the water on earth at over 7-800 degrees F is a heat problem.
The HPT does not have a heat problem.

And there is nothing wrong with God building a contingency plan into His creation. That's the wise thing to do.
Half the water on earth at over 7-800 degrees F (those are Walt Brown's numbers) released into the air and water over a few days, That is 23. sextillion Btu's, that is a heat problem.

I never claimed that there is anything wrong with what God does or did, I am saying my view of God, is that He can do better than apparently your view of Him.
 

JudgeRightly

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Half the water on earth at over 7-800 degrees F is a heat problem.

Half the water on earth at over 7-800 degrees F (those are Walt Brown's numbers) released into the air and water over a few days, That is 23. sextillion Btu's, that is a heat problem.

I never claimed that there is anything wrong with what God does or did, I am saying my view of God, is that He can do better than apparently your view of Him.

Fluids expanding causes them to cool rapidly.

The fountains of the great deep were well below the freezing point of water.
 

tieman55

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When gas or liquid expands it absorbs heat but the heat doesn't go away 1st and 2nd laws of thermodynamics, the heat is just dispersed to a wide area, making it worse for the heat problem.

The earth at the time of the flood, according to HPT was lush, it was warm much warmer than today. That makes it
far worse. If you add 23 sextillion BTUs, to a warm planet? It would take a bare minimum of 500 days to radiate off that heat at the rate the earth radiates back to space 121 petawatts of energy per day, according to NASA. You would not need the sun for 500 days.

Bob argues that HPT removes heat in 4 ways but he never claims that it removes 23 sextillion BTU's. Now I am just addressing the stored heat HPT says is there in the supercritical water, and I am in no way touching upon the heat that was generated by the collapse of the continents, or the exposure of the earths core along the Atlantic ridge and else where and it doesn't include volcanic activity which is perhaps all together more than 23 sextillion BTUs
There is a heat problem in the HPT, doesn't need to be, but unless you change the design there is.
 

JudgeRightly

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When gas or liquid expands it absorbs heat but the heat doesn't go away 1st and 2nd laws of thermodynamics, the heat is just dispersed to a wide area, making it worse for the heat problem.

Again, the fountains of the great deep were sub-zero.

Adiabatic cooling and transforming the heat energy into kinetic energy is the answer.

You don't seem very familiar with some of the key components of the HPT, Tieman.

Would you mind watching this video?

Especially before trying to "fix" problems that don't actually exist within the theory, only in your head?

The earth at the time of the flood, according to HPT was lush, it was warm much warmer than today. That makes it far worse.

Not when almost none of that energy remains on the earth.

If you add 23 sextillion BTUs, to a warm planet? It would take a bare minimum of 500 days to radiate off that heat at the rate the earth radiates back to space 121 petawatts of energy per day, according to NASA. You would not need the sun for 500 days.

You've got the scale of the amount of energy released down, but you're severely underestimating the actual fountains of the great deep.

These arent your public-square fountains or your garden hose sprinkler.

These are several-mile-wide jets emanating from a crack in the earth that goes around the earth like the seam of a baseball, formed of supercooled rocky-icy-slurry that is being launched not just into orbit around earth, but deep into the solar system, that formed all of the comets, asteroids, and meteors/oids/ites, and all Trans-Neptunian Objects (TNOs) (which includes Pluto and Charon).

You wanna know where all that energy went? It was dispersed into the solar system.

Bob argues that HPT removes heat in 4 ways but he never claims that it removes 23 sextillion BTU's. Now I am just addressing the stored heat HPT says is there in the supercritical water, and I am in no way touching upon the heat that was generated by the collapse of the continents, or the exposure of the earths core along the Atlantic ridge and else where and it doesn't include volcanic activity which is perhaps all together more than 23 sextillion BTUs
There is a heat problem in the HPT, doesn't need to be, but unless you change the design there is.

The design doesn't need to change. Your perception of where the energy is actually going does.

The energy doesn't go into the atmosphere.

It goes into space, in the form of kinetic energy.

The the Flood was indeed a global event, but it literally affected the entire solar system.
 

JudgeRightly

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Thus you are saying the GOD is error prone to the point that He has to make a contingency plan just in case...So much for the total sovereignty of GOD......

Error prone?

No.

God is a God who risks.

He created beings that had the potential to rebel against Him.

Thus, the contingency was for if they rebelled, not because He might err.
 
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