Evolution

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PureX

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Originally posted by Morphy Because there is no proof god exists... I think existence of god can be neither be proved nor disapproved. That's why.

But I have a strong sympathy for Christians and I want more and more people to belive in god.
There is a simple solution, and that is to stop trying to "prove" the existence of God - which can't be done - and to start focussing on the advantages of faith in God, instead. Unfortunately, many religious Christians have no faith in God at all, and so they spend all their time trying to "prove" that God is real by proving that their religious beliefs are based on real events. As a result they end up looking ridiculous, and then making faith in God look ridiculous, too.

The solution is to let go of this need for "proof" which is based on a lack of faith anyway, and focus instead on faith itself, and the real positive results of choosing to place our faith in a loving God. When we do this, evolution and faith in God have no conflicts.
 

brother Willi

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Originally posted by PureX

There is a simple solution, and that is to stop trying to "prove" the existence of God - which can't be done - and to start focussing on the advantages of faith in God, instead. Unfortunately, many religious Christians have no faith in God at all, and so they spend all their time trying to "prove" that God is real by proving that their religious beliefs are based on real events. As a result they end up looking ridiculous, and then making faith in God look ridiculous, too.

The solution is to let go of this need for "proof" which is based on a lack of faith anyway, and focus instead on faith itself, and the real positive results of choosing to place our faith in a loving God. When we do this, evolution and faith in God have no conflicts.
"proof", would eliminate free will.

you get "proof", after you decide.

but that "proof" comes not on our command
 

PureX

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Originally posted by brother Willi "proof", would eliminate free will.
Not really. There is a huge amount of evidence to support the theory of evolution, yet lots of people still choose to just ignore it. Reality and "proof" don't mean much to people compared to their ideas about reality and how they support themselves emotionally through those ideas.
Originally posted by brother Willi you get "proof", after you decide.
Well, you get what you choose to believe is "proof", yes.
Originally posted by brother Willi but that "proof" comes not on our command
Actually, it does, I think. We're setting the criteria of what we choose to call "proof", so it actually is by our own "command" that we experience it. Most of us just refuse to recognize this, though.
 

Frank Ernest

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Let's not stray from the point

Let's not stray from the point

"Hello Frank Ernest
If God created the earth and all that is in it then time did not exist until He created it. Where billions of years comes from beats me. If God's word is truth then we must accept it as truth. So when God did create one day then we must understand that it was a literal day. We cannot change God's word to suit ourselves, we should His word to change us.
Genesis 1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
Genesis 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Where is the billions of years that you speak within these verses.
Love
Val "

I covered the first two verses of Genesis. No time frame is recorded. Simple as that. I did not speak of anything beyond verses 1 and 2.

Verses 3-5 are obviously subsequent to verses 1-2. Therefore, AFTER God created heaven and earth, and the earth became ruined and desolate, He said, "Let there be light: ..." Again no time frame is given. Scripture does not tell us exactly when the "first day" occurred.
 
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Frank Ernest

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Physics 101

Physics 101

"now for that time shift question
4.3 billion years ?
time do shift."

Great! And this means what?

"speed has force in its equasion."

F=ma?

"force is acceleration?"

Applied force to a mass produces acceleration, but force is not acceleration.

"can speed exist without acceleration? "

Newton thought so. (2nd Law of Motion). I assume you mean velocity rather than speed.

"UMMMM nope"

You'll have to argue that one with Newton.

"can speed continue in a vacuem, without acceleration?"

Same Newtonian answer.

"UMMM yep."

You're at 50%.

"how can we get speed without acceleration? "

Initially, medially or terminally? You're being very confusing.
 
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Morphy

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Originally posted by PureX

There is a simple solution, and that is to stop trying to "prove" the existence of God - which can't be done - and to start focussing on the advantages of faith in God, instead. Unfortunately, many religious Christians have no faith in God at all, and so they spend all their time trying to "prove" that God is real by proving that their religious beliefs are based on real events. As a result they end up looking ridiculous, and then making faith in God look ridiculous, too.
Yeah - I've seen it many times. Like people who believe there is no evolution inspite of obvious scientific facts.

I listen pastor's Enyart program and I really enjoy it, but when I hear him denying evolution with silly pseudoarguments I'm jam-packed with doubts. If he is so mistaken on evolution - how can he be right on other, bible-related issues???

Originally posted by PureX
The solution is to let go of this need for "proof" which is based on a lack of faith anyway, and focus instead on faith itself, and the real positive results of choosing to place our faith in a loving God. When we do this, evolution and faith in God have no conflicts.

And what is your view? What's the god's role in evolution?
 
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Morphy

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Originally posted by brother Willi

science is science

give to science, that which is science's

give to God, that which is God's

:D

Say to pastor Enyart and 'the brightest audience in the country' to render scientists the things that are science's and render the god the things that are god's...
 

Morphy

New member
Originally posted by PureX

Not really. There is a huge amount of evidence to support the theory of evolution, yet lots of people still choose to just ignore it. Reality and "proof" don't mean much to people compared to their ideas about reality and how they support themselves emotionally through those ideas.

Sad but true...

I've posted the proof of evolution above and nobody has refuted it, yet I'm convinced they'll keep denying evolution exists...

Originally posted by PureX
Well, you get what you choose to believe is "proof", yes.
Actually, it does, I think. We're setting the criteria of what we choose to call "proof", so it actually is by our own "command" that we experience it. Most of us just refuse to recognize this, though.

Wisely said. Nothing more can be added.
:thumb:
 

Morphy

New member
Re: Let's not stray from the point

Re: Let's not stray from the point

Originally posted by Frank Ernest
Verses 3-5 are obviously subsequent to verses 1-2. Therefore, AFTER God created heaven and earth, and the earth became ruined and desolate, He said, "Let there be light: ..." Again no time frame is given. Scripture does not tell us exactly when the "first day" occurred.

I don't know if you are intrested in, but according to presence science the Earth was initially covered with clouds, therefore there was no daylight... But it was approximately 5 billions years ago...
 

brother Willi

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Originally posted by PureX

Not really. There is a huge amount of evidence to support the theory of evolution, yet lots of people still choose to just ignore it. Reality and "proof" don't mean much to people compared to their ideas about reality and how they support themselves emotionally through those ideas.

"KINDS" to what we see today is what you call "evolution" my friend.

abiogenises, CAN NOT BE PROVEN

Well, you get what you choose to believe is "proof", yes.
Actually, it does, I think. We're setting the criteria of what we choose to call "proof", so it actually is by our own "command" that we experience it. Most of us just refuse to recognize this, though.
NOPE, GOD'S will NOT mine.

we cammand nothing

God is in us, we just need to listen.
 

brother Willi

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Frank Ernest

we do not disagree, i think.

i said "well thought out"

time is as time does.
to us inside, we can only measure as we do.

is time in a jar, the same as outside the jar?

depends what the jar is doing:D
 

aharvey

New member
Originally posted by PureX

There is a simple solution, and that is to stop trying to "prove" the existence of God - which can't be done - and to start focussing on the advantages of faith in God, instead. Unfortunately, many religious Christians have no faith in God at all, and so they spend all their time trying to "prove" that God is real by proving that their religious beliefs are based on real events. As a result they end up looking ridiculous, and then making faith in God look ridiculous, too.

The solution is to let go of this need for "proof" which is based on a lack of faith anyway, and focus instead on faith itself, and the real positive results of choosing to place our faith in a loving God. When we do this, evolution and faith in God have no conflicts.

PureX,

If I were eligible to do so, I'd pick this as a POTD. There is no inherent conflict between faith in God and evolution. There is a conflict between a woodenly literal interpretation of the Old Testament and evolution. Big difference.
 

aharvey

New member
Originally posted by brother Willi

science is science

give to science, that which is science's

give to God, that which is God's

:D

So, bw, what does evolutionary theory take away from God besides a woodenly literal interpretation of the Old Testament?
 

Yorzhik

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LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Let's see, I have 1 more substantial answer to post, and then I can get back to this thread. It should take no longer than 4 more days.
 

Morphy

New member
Originally posted by brother Willi

"KINDS" to what we see today is what you call "evolution" my friend.

abiogenises, CAN NOT BE PROVEN

So what you're basically saying is that evolution has some natural boundaries, namely, 'kinds' cannot be crossed. So why don't you enlighten me where are those boundaries. Come on - maybe god intervenes when somewhere suddenly adenine is replaced with guanine what could create gene specific to different 'kind'? :chuckle:

Show me the natural boundaries. I'm waiting.
 

Morphy

New member
Originally posted by aharvey
There is a conflict between a woodenly literal interpretation of the Old Testament and evolution. Big difference.

Seems logical. As a matter of fact - if I was a god and wanted to explain to primitive people how evolution created all species, I'd do it exactly like bible does: in the beginning there was sea with simple creatures, then life emerged from the ocean to newly created islands and finally a man has appeared.
 

Morphy

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Originally posted by Yorzhik

Let's see, I have 1 more substantial answer to post, and then I can get back to this thread. It should take no longer than 4 more days.

I'm waiting impatiently :)
 
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