Do you believe in predestination ?

beloved57

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If He did, why would He ask not to have to bear the cup? If it was determined, don’t you think he’d feel silly asking. “I’ve predetermined it but I’m going to ask anyway.”
So did you read Luke 22:22 ? What did he say there ?
 

Poly

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If He did, why would He ask not to have to bear the cup? If it was determined, don’t you think he’d feel silly asking. “I’ve predetermined it but I’m going to ask anyway.”
So in that verse, with Him saying it was predetermined, it makes it more absurd for Him to ask that he might not have to bear the cup.

Unless predetermined doesn’t mean what you mean.

If my kid acts up in the store, I can predetermine that he will be spanked when He gets home. Once at home, he might beg and plead that I not do it. Because of his desperate cries, I might consider for just a moment that I might not do it. In the end, I decide that I would be doing neither of us a favor. But it was my decision and I very well could have changed my mind and said “Just don’t let it happen again.” If I decided that, it wouldn’t mean that I hadn’t predetermined it. It would mean my dead set intentions had changed.

And please don’t think in the least that I’m trying to make this scenario anywhere close to the perfect Christ who took on punishment for the world though he did no wrong.
 

beloved57

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So in that verse, with Him saying it was predetermined, it makes it more absurd for Him to ask that he might not have to bear the cup.

Unless predetermined doesn’t mean what you mean.

If my kid acts up in the store, I can predetermine that he will be spanked when He gets home. Once at home, he might beg and plead that I not do it. Because of his desperate cries, I might consider for just a moment that I might not do it. In the end, I decide that I would be doing neither of us a favor. But it was my decision and I very well could have changed my mind and said “Just don’t let it happen again.” If I decided that, it wouldn’t mean that I hadn’t predetermined it. It would mean my dead set intentions had changed.

And please don’t think in the least that I’m trying to make this scenario anywhere close to the perfect Christ who took on punishment for the world though he did no wrong.
Just answer this. Judging from Lk 22:22

22 And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!

Did Jesus know that His death had been predetermined Yes or No please.
 

JudgeRightly

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Just because one event is predetermined doesn't mean that all things are predetermined.

And had there been another way, He could have had the cup passed from Him. In other words, His going to the cross was predetermined, but not set in stone until he actually did it.
 

Poly

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Just answer this. Judging from Lk 22:22

22 And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!

Did Jesus know that His death had been predetermined Yes or No please.
That’s not fair. If you answer my question that I asked first then I will answer yours. Why would Christ ask that this cup be passed from Him if He already knew it was established from the foundation of the world and God does not change? Why in the world would he sit in a garden with so much distress and tears coming out as blood and literally begging that if it was possible, please let there be some other way?
 

beloved57

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That’s not fair. If you answer my question that I asked first then I will answer yours. Why would Christ ask that this cup be passed from Him if He already knew it was established from the foundation of the world and God does not change? Why in the world would he sit in a garden with so much distress and tears coming out as blood and literally begging that if it was possible, please let there be some other way?
I respectfully decline from any further discussion about this matter since you wont answer that simple question. One last time, according to Lk 22:22

22 And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined:
but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!

Did Jesus know that His death was predetermined by God ? Yes or No
 

Poly

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I respectfully decline from any further discussion about this matter since you wont answer that simple question. One last time, according to Lk 22:22

22 And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!

Did Jesus know that His death was predetermined by God ? Yes or No
Look at the pot calling the kettle black? I asked you a question first. I would be more than willing to answer yours. But it’s hypocritical to state you won’t answer mine till I answer yours when I asked first.
 

Hoping

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I believe in predetermination...in this way...
If we do "X", it is predetermined what will happen to us.
If we do "Y", something different is predetermined to be our outcome.
I do not believe I was predetermined to do "X" or "Y".
They are my choices.
 
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