Creation vs. Evolution

Status
Not open for further replies.

alwight

New member
jumpin in late, i'm new but i like what this said, i'm not a scientist. opportunity and working with what's available seems to be the natural order of life. the general concept of evolution is obvious. but the missing link is God i think. I believe in evolution created by God. however, the concept of everything from nothing is so amusing to me. theoretical phycisists are better than stand up comics. alot of folks waste alot of time trying to pick one way
Hi patrick jane, I don't believe in any god but I'd like to think that there is plenty that we don't currently understand. Quantum tunnelling for example is counter intuitive but stars wouldn't be stars without it. So why not something from apparently nothing? Which perhaps indicates the existence of an unknown factor or something fundamental that we cannot currently detect. Dark matter cannot yet be detected but apparently has to exist anyway.

Dismissing theoretical physicists as comical jokers is rather unwarranted I think particularly if you don't fully understand the physics we are already rather more familiar with.
 

Mark SeaSigh

BANNED
Banned
Cry yourself to sleep tonight, AL.

Evolution failed you.

=M=

Any Given Evol said:
If Theories say Things About Space Evolving; Oh! That must mean, Biological Evolution is Possible!!!

Yeah!!!

:rotfl:

==================================


Once Again, I Bring you another Edition of:

Oh, The Silly things You Atheists Say;

Enjoy.

Atheists Disprove Evolution;

First Atheist; Dr. Weisenberg From Vid said:
Given Enough "Time", You can Change "Anything" Into "Anything"; There is no actual Reason or Understanding connected to this statement prior to this part of this sentence you are reading now, which should be placed in this part of the sentence which basically describes, and gives credit/logic to the First Two lines of thought. (Question/Truth as Seen by the Speaker/Writer)
 
Last edited:

MichaelCadry

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Dear patrick jane,

I'll not tell you all the details because they are for someone more advanced. Few are ready for it. But I will tell you that the Lord God said, "I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace and create evil (calamity). I, the Lord, do all of these things." See Isaiah 45:7.

God does not have us all following Him like puppy dogs with no lack of a choice. Therefore, He has provided everyone a choice on whether they want Him, Love and Peace, or Lucifer/Satan, Hate, and Havoc/Burning. A spirit, good or bad, does not die. God created souls and spirit that they could not die, but instead they have eternal life or eternal damnation. It's one or the other. Have I said enough for now? Do you know anything about the visions I've had or how many times I've been visited by the Holy Ghost. I am also baptized in water at the Baptist Church I belong to. I used to go to a Nazarene Church, but now I don't. So I've fulfilled all that I should. Do you know it says that there will be two witnesses, two candlesticks and two olive trees who stand by the God of the whole earth? These are my two witnesses/prophets. (See Rev. 11:4). I don't want you to believe me. Just consider that it is going on out there in the earth. It is happening, just as God said it would. I have my idea, but I can't even say that I know positively who the second witness is. That's God's trump card. But it says these two shall be killed by the devil and after 3 and 1/2 days, the spirit of Life from God will enter their bodies again and they shall rise back to life, and then they shall rise up to heaven. See Rev. 11:11. It says in that same hour there will be an great earthquake, which I believe will be the biggest earthquake ever since man has been on earth. I say I believe, for your sake. Then will Jesus Return in great Glory with the clouds of Heaven, and He shall separate the wheat (who He wants to keep) and the chaff (who He wants to cast away because it is a useless by-product). This is getting long, so I'll close for now. I'm not trying to toot my horn at all. I think I am less of a person than anyone else on earth, for reasons I may explain later. I am trying to let your ears hear the seventh angel's horn, and when it sounds, "the mystery of God shall be finished, as He has declared to His servants, the prophets." (See Rev. 10:7). So you see easily, that Mohamed was not the last prophet, nor a prophet as far as I am concerned.

God Be With You And Keep You From The Confuser,

Michael
 
Last edited:

Mark SeaSigh

BANNED
Banned
I forgive you for making Irrational Statements, without Backing them With Logic or Proof, Jane; However, don't do it again, or you will surely die.

[Ecclesiastes 12:13 KJV] 13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this [is] the whole [duty] of man.

[Deuteronomy 6:2 KJV] 2 That thou mightest fear the LORD thy God, to keep all his statutes and his commandments, which I command thee, thou, and thy son, and thy son's son, all the days of thy life; and that thy days may be prolonged.

=M=
 

patrick jane

BANNED
Banned
right now i have trouble seeing who some posts are intended for, i apologize if offended anyone. i made some remarks that were generalized. i'm learning. i've watched too much history channel and i lack understanding, speciation is a better definition and i agree with observable science. i believe in physicists and we learn from theories. it's just some that i heard on tv like all possible universes exist. because if so, then one would be able to contact us right now, if ALL possible universes exist. obviousy, i'm not smart enough to discuss math or advanced sciences or astrophysics or metaphysics. eventually all human understanding reaches the point of unknown, no matter the i.q. and i don't want to kicked off TOL before i even get started should i be in the back alley ? i don't even know who i'm responding to
 

Mark SeaSigh

BANNED
Banned
right now i have trouble seeing who some posts are intended for, i apologize if offended anyone. i made some remarks that were generalized. i'm learning. i've watched too much history channel and i lack understanding, speciation is a better definition and i agree with observable science. i believe in physicists and we learn from theories. it's just some that i heard on tv like all possible universes exist. because if so, then one would be able to contact us right now, if ALL possible universes exist. obviousy, i'm not smart enough to discuss math or advanced sciences or astrophysics or metaphysics. eventually all human understanding reaches the point of unknown, no matter the i.q. and i don't want to kicked off TOL before i even get started should i be in the back alley ? i don't even know who i'm responding to

I believe in Physical Laws, Too/Also; what does that have to do With Biological Evolution?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_law

I may not believe in Every Theory in Physics, but I believe in the Laws, and the Observable Truth, which is Therein.

Now, Wake Up.

=M=

Are you really "Homeless"?

Or, is your whole life and Belief system a Fake?

==================================


MUSIC!!!

Nights in White Satin - The Moody Blues
 

MichaelCadry

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Dear MarkS,

I guess you are wondering about me and all of you are. When I was working at ABC-TV in Manhattan, NYC, I wrote to a NY Daily News reporter about the things that God had come to pass upon me, and he wrote a letter back saying only, "Frankly I don't see any story." Well, I was livid. How could Jesus' Second Coming not be a hell of a story. God told me to write him back and tell him that within 48 hours of him receiving my letter to him, seven inches of snow shall fall upon his Daily News Bldg. His name was Don Singleton. Well, sure enough, a couple days later, when he got the letter, it began snowing that morning. I remember thinking "Darn it", 'cause I'm not thrilled with snow unless I look at it from a nice warm room. An angel spoke in my ear saying, "This is the snow that you wrote to him about." I was freaking out. All day at work, it snowed outside. At the end of the day, when I took the Staten Island Ferry home and got to my house, my girlfriend Salli ran to me saying, "Michael, this reporter has been calling you all afternoon and wants you to call him back." Well, as I walked to the phone to call him, the phone rang and it was him. And he was terrified and he said please don't pray for him for anything else, and what did I want? I told him I wanted a 3-hour interview. He said okay! Seven inches fell on the Daily News Bldg. I have the NY Post article that says the 7 inches of snow fell. I went to the interview, but he said he couldn't help me and I would have to talk to the owner of the newspaper. I just figured heck with it, because the owner of the newspaper would want another sign and whatever. God said that's why an evil generation seeks a sign. Anyway, all of that for NOTHING AT ALL!! Except one terrified reporter.

I still have all of the newspaper reports of the 7" of snow, and letters from the reporter, etc. Those are what I call my Proof Pages. I have Proof of what I claim. Well, I'd best close for now.

I know that Mark already knows, right??!! But the rest of you are without a clue. God really is with me and gave me a testimony to bear witness of to all people around me, including friends, family, and the general public. So I do it. Will close for now.

There Are Things Going On That You Don't Even Know About Yet!!

Praise Jesus!!

Michael
 

alwight

New member
Right, AL;

You believe that Evolution happens, All the Time!!!
Evolution is a continuous process.

Wherever there is self replicating life.

Speciation is the Theory of Evolution, biologically speaking.

If there is No Proof for Speciation, how is there Proof for Evolution?
Proof isn't a requirement, there only need be a reasonable consistency between the evidence and the explanation.

You believe that Evolution Caused Stars to be, you think Evolution started the First Life on this Planet.
Hmm?
Errr No I don't.

Or, you believe that some Meteor landed here long ago, which contained life that Evolved on some Other Planet.
No I suspect that life probably started here

Either Way, you think it happens, you believe that it Happens; Where is the Evidence?
Everywhere where life can be found.

Did you know that Other Scientists of Darwin's Day, Rejected Darwin?
Yes, so what?

Right, AL; you believe that we should use Techniques to keep some people from Reproducing with the Rest of the Population.
I Understand.
I understand that you made that up.

You want people to Get a Disease which Restricts the Oxygen capabilities of Red Blood Cells.
I don't want anyone to get any diseases, why don't you ask your God to take them all away?

Evolution, Right..... More like Mutation, and Genetic Disorder Disease.
Mixed and matched random stuff Mark?

What does that have to do with Speciation, AL;
Or, the Theory of how the Various Forms of Animals came to be on this Planet?
Darwin's book explains about the origin of species but not the origin of life.


What does the Word "Evolution" Mean to you, Biologically?
Gradual adaption by means of natural selection.

The very fact that Evolutionists have to reach to Destructive Genetic Mutation, (which doesn't make New Reproductive Animals, instead it Causes them to become Unable to Reproduce); Shows the Lack of Evidence for the Theory of Evolution.
What makes new life is the ability of the current generation to live long enough to reproduce. Anaemia may be debilitating but a premature death prevents any chance of reproduction.

The Theory of Evolution is Dead; Except to those who Still believe in Her.
Barbie?
Not unless a better theory comes along that also consistently explains the evidence. Simply not liking it while believing in un-evidenced mythology instead imo is not being particularly consistent with anything.
 

patrick jane

BANNED
Banned
ok

ok

so howcan i talk to =M= and
michael again, or send pm or make a buddy list ? ur right =M= i am sleepy. no faking. i have a strange sense of humor and i make light of my situation. you can judge me if want. everyone does it to each other whether we admit it or not. i see people acting like animals more than enlightened beings. tonight even more because i live in St Louis and know good people in Ferguson. the media is only showing bad suff. i'm signing off soon. yes i am homeless, so there ! i am blessed with people that care. hey that rhymes, i look forward to more judgement and good conversation. bye
 

Mark SeaSigh

BANNED
Banned
Evolution is a continuous process.

Got You!

AL said:
Wherever, there is self replicating life.


Proof isn't a requirement, there only need be a reasonable consistency between the evidence and the explanation.

Isn't a Requirement for What?

AL said:
Errr, No I don't.

No, I suspect that life probably started here;

AL said:
Everywhere where life can be found.
=M= said:
Mutation can be found, not Speciation; Which is the Point of me asking for Evidence of Speciation.
AL said:
Yes, so what?

AL said:
I understand that you made that up.
AL said:
I don't want anyone to get any diseases, why don't you ask your God to take them all away?

Didn't you say that Sickle Cell Anemia is a "Good/Advantageous" Mutation; Something that gives Reason for the belief in the Theory of Evolution?

AL said:
Mixed and matched random stuff Mark?
=M= said:
Evolution, Right..... More like Mutation, and a Genetic Disorder Disease.

Oh, you're Right, AL!!! You OCD punctuation hater.

Darwin's book explains about the origin of species, but not the origin of life.
=M= said:
The concept of Speciation is Described in Darwin's Book; Although he Never Used the Word Speciation.
The fact that there is no Evidence of Speciation; Disproves Darwin's Concept on the Possible origins of all the Various Forms of Animals we share the Planet with Came to be.

AL said:
Gradual adaption by means of natural selection.

=M= said:
So, it's not fast then? It's Gradual...? Or, Is it Gradual and Fast?
You just proved that things do not all evolve at the same pace.

Of course, I don't hear anyone saying they do, so good job agreeing with everyone, I guess. . .

So, the fact that Modern Anatomy appears in the very first Animals that are in the Fossil record, isn't a problem for you, Eh?
=M= said:
Yeah, I realize that Evolutionists believe that Animals "Evolve" at different rates. However, there are Examples of Animals in the Fossil record, which are Presented in this Article, That are believed to have remained anatomically unchanged for Hundreds of Millions of Years.

When you consider that Evolutionists believe that Man changed from a Tree Climbing ape like being to a Human in 3 million years, but other animals have remained Anatomically Unchanged for over 450 Million years; Evolution Theory is Obviously False.

This is very interesting, that Evolutionists believe that there is No Logic Failure in Believing that "Evolution Happens", but there is no Evidence that Anatomy has been Lost or Gained in any Species, the Entire time they have Existed on this Planet.

When you have a Creature, such as A Starfish, Which is Supposed to Be From the Early Cambrian, and remaining Anatomically Unchanged Since; It's pretty hard to believe that it's ever been anything but a Starfish.

Now do you understand?

Or, do you need some more Examples?

Ophiopetra-lithographica-aboral-larger-010813_585.jpg


Above Starfish which is Supposed to be 150+ Million years old, but for some reason, it looks just like it's modern Version. Almost like Evolution doesn't even Happen.

Modern Brittlestar.

IL2-012%20brittle%20star,%20Ophiarachna%20affinis%20cf..jpg


Evolution - is the change in the inherited characteristics of biological populations over successive generations.

So, where is the Evolution come into Play, when considering that All the Animals in the Fossil Record had Modern Looking Anatomy?

===================================

The above Brittlestar, is not the Oldest Starfish that contains Modern Starfish Anatomy; In Fact, Starfish have always contained the anatomy that their modern Versions do today.

As I mentioned before, there are Modern Looking starfish in the Pre-Cambrian Rock layers.
The above starfish was found in the Same Limestone layer that the Famous Archaeopteryx was Found.
You know, the above Dino Bird in the OP, that Evolutionists Swore modern Birds descended from; However, that's obviously not true, given the Two Examples of Birds that lived long before Archaeopteryx.

Well anyway, Now I'm going to go find a Pre-Cambrian star fish, and you let me know if it looks like an animal that has been evolving for Hundreds of Millions of years; or does it look just like a Starfish?

...

All Right Kids, here she Is!!!
Supposedly 430 Million years old, and Still contains all the Same Anatomical Structures that Modern Starfish do, It's "Australaster Giganteus", Otherwise known as, "Hey Look at that Cushion Star like 430 MYO FOSSIL~"

Australaster-giganteus-t.jpg


http://www.fossilmuseum.net/fossils/starfish/Australaster-giganteus/Australaster.htm

A Modern Cushion Star;
bahamstar.jpg


==================================

So Yeah, like I said; There is Evidence Against Evolution.

It's up to you to decide what to Do about it.

Praise God for His works, for they are many On the Earth.

Thank God for Creating all these Various Forms of Life that We share the Planet with, It was His hands that Fashioned them!!!

[Isaiah 6:3 KJV] 3 And one cried unto another, and said, Holy, holy, holy, [is] the LORD of hosts: the whole earth [is] full of his glory.

What makes new life is the ability of the current generation to live long enough to reproduce. Anaemia maybe (More Like Is) debilitating but a premature death prevents any chance of reproduction.

But AL?

Not unless a better theory comes along that also consistently explains the evidence. Simply not liking it while believing in un-evidenced mythology instead imo is not being particularly consistent with anything.

=M=

Oh, and about that "a".

LOL!!! Never Mind.

So, AL;

If Animals are Constantly Evolving ("Animals", those are Included with Everything, right?); Why do Many Fossils of Animals appear to not have evolved at all since before the times of what's Considered the time of the Dinosaurs, which I guess that's Supposed to be 200/250-50 Million years B.C.?


How is that Possible, If;

AL said:
Evolution is a continuous process?
 
Last edited:

Mark SeaSigh

BANNED
Banned
No Man is right about Everything; I'm just certain that the theory of evolution is Fully Flawed.

=M=

To an Atheist; the Word "Evolution", is constantly substituted for the Word "Mutation".

I Personally Like words more that start with M's, but that's not why I think people should stop using the word Evolution; unless referring to the actual Theory it's named after in Biology, which is the Theory of How the Various Species came to Exist.

Deal with it Atheists, you are wrong.
 

alwight

New member
So, AL;

If Animals are Constantly Evolving("Animals", those are Included with Everything, right?); Why do some appear to not have evolved at all since before the times of what's Considered the Dino, which I guess that's Supposed to be 200/250-50 Million years B.C.


How is that Possible, If;

You're clutching at straws Mark.
Despite any apparent similarities with the fossil record from the distant past there is nevertheless an evolutionary history for starfish.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starfish
"The fossil record for starfish is ancient, dating back to the Ordovician around 450 million years ago, but it is rather poor, as starfish tend to disintegrate after death. Only the ossicles and spines of the animal are likely to be preserved, making remains hard to locate..."

"...Starfish are keystone species in their respective marine communities. Their relatively large sizes, diverse diets and ability to adapt to different environments makes them ecologically important..."


"Evolutionary history
...A 2012 study found that speciation in starfish can occur rapidly. During the last 6,000 years, divergence in the larval development of Cryptasterina hystera and Cryptasterina pentagona has taken place, the former adopting internal fertilization and brooding and the latter remaining a broadcast spawner..."
There is a huge diverse variety of starfish around today that have all adapted to their particular environment, so finding one that happens to resemble an earlier shape isn't particularly remarkable. We should also consider that the fossil record only shows the spines and calcium hardened parts. If a particular basic shape is what works best then there is no evolutionary diktat that requires it to change anyway.
 

Mark SeaSigh

BANNED
Banned
Ok, AL; Let's Go See what Wiki has to Say.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starfish

You're clutching at straws Mark.
Despite any apparent similarities with the fossil record from the distant past there is nevertheless an evolutionary history for starfish.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starfish
There is a huge diverse variety of starfish around today that have all adapted to their particular environment, so finding one that happens to resemble an earlier shape isn't particularly remarkable. We should also consider that the fossil record only shows the spines and calcium hardened parts. If a particular basic shape is what works best then there is no evolutionary diktat that requires it to change anyway.

From your Wiki Article;

"The fossil record for starfish is ancient, dating back to the Ordovician around 450 million years ago, but it is rather poor, as starfish tend to disintegrate after death. Only the ossicles and spines of the animal are likely to be preserved, making remains hard to locate. With their appealing symmetrical shape, starfish have played a part in literature, legend, design and popular culture. They are sometimes collected as curios, used in design or as logos, and in some cultures, despite possible toxicity, they are eaten."

I posted a Picture of one of the Oldest Starfish in the Fossil Record; What new Anatomy has Appeared, that the Original Starfish Did not Contain?

If they have Looked Exactly like Starfish for supposedly over 450 Million Years; What do you believe they Mutated From?

A Sand Dollar?
Possibly a Sea Cucumber?
Oh, I know! A Sea urchin, cause they have Spikes, Right?

Or, is the Evolutionary Belief system of "How Starfish Happened", even Less Reasonable Than That?

Let's See;

By the late Paleozoic, the crinoids and blastoids were the predominant echinoderms, and some limestones from this period are made almost entirely from fragments from these groups. In the two major extinction events that occurred during the late Devonian and late Permian, the blastoids were wiped out and only a few species of crinoids survived.[83] Many starfish species also became extinct in these events, but afterwards the surviving few species diversified rapidly within about sixty million years during the Early Jurassic and the beginning of the Middle Jurassic.[7][85] A 2012 study found that speciation in starfish can occur rapidly. (I'd say, It's almost like they Just Appeared that Way =M=) During the last 6,000 years, divergence in the larval development of Cryptasterina hystera and Cryptasterina pentagona has taken place, the former adopting internal fertilization and brooding and the latter remaining a broadcast spawner.[86]

Wiki said:
The majority of the early fossils were sea urchins, probably because their hard tests are easily preserved.

No Way! I almost don't believe I'm Reading this In Wikipedia. LOL!!!

Echinoderms first appeared in the fossil record in the Cambrian. The majority of the early fossils were sea urchins, (probably because their hard tests are easily preserved). The first known asterozoans, which includes both starfish and brittle stars, date back to the Ordovician. They were the Somasteroidea, which exhibit characteristics of both groups. Modern starfish and brittle stars probably had a common somasteroid ancestor.[83] Starfish are infrequently found as fossils, possibly because their hard skeletal components separate as the animal decays. However, although starfish fossils are uncommon, there are a few places where accumulations of complete skeletal structures occur, fossilized in place in Lagerstätten — so-called "starfish beds".[84]


I wonder how Old Sand Dollars Are, and if they always have contained that cool Design, on the Top of them...

============================================


Sea Urchin;
sea-urchins08-sea-urchin_17935_600x450.jpg


I'd Say I'd have to agree with Wikipedia, Sea Urchin to Starfish, is quite an Abrupt Change. What a Mutation!!!
It's an Atheist Miracle!!! LOL!!!

Evolutionists believe in Magic.

Wiki said:
Echinoderms first appeared in the fossil record in the Cambrian.

The Cambrian (/ˈkæmbriən/ or /ˈkeɪmbriən/) is the first geological period of the Paleozoic Era, lasting from 541.0 ± 1.0 to 485.4 ± 1.9 million years ago (mya) and is succeeded by the Ordovician.

The Ordovician /ɔrdəˈvɪʃən/ is a geologic period and system, the second of six of the Paleozoic Era, and covers the time between 485.4 ± 1.9 and 443.4 ± 1.5 million years ago
Wiki said:
The first known asterozoans (Starfish), which includes both starfish and brittle stars, date back to the Ordovician.

Are you telling me that the First Starfish that Ever Lived, Looks just like the Starfish we see Today?

Containing Every Functional anatomical feature, that they did when they first Appeared?


=M=

Give Up AL; You have a Religion, a set of beliefs that are not based On Observed Truth (Science).


All Right Kids, here she Is!!!
Supposedly 430 Million years old, and Still contains all the Same Anatomical Structures that Modern Starfish do, It's "Australaster Giganteus", Otherwise known as, "Hey Look at that Cushion Star like 430 MYO FOSSIL~"

Australaster-giganteus-t.jpg


http://www.fossilmuseum.net/fossils/starfish/Australaster-giganteus/Australaster.htm

A Modern Cushion Star;
bahamstar.jpg
 
Last edited:

DFT_Dave

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
We each represent an example of a transitional form and evolution doesn't simply stop or reach an objective.

Acquiring resistance to diseases that are themselves evolving would also be a form of adaption. Arguably however such adaption may not be happening if science prevents diseases from killing those more susceptible.

How did we go from Eldrege saying, "geologists have found rock layers of all divisions of the last 500 million years and no transitional forms were contained in them", to we are all transitional forms?

How long does it take for a species to evolve?

--Dave
 

DFT_Dave

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Evolution is a continuous process.

Wherever there is self replicating life.

So having offspring is evolution even if they turn out to be just like the parents?

--Dave
 

The Barbarian

BANNED
Banned
How did we go from Eldrege saying, "geologists have found rock layers of all divisions of the last 500 million years and no transitional forms were contained in them", to we are all transitional forms?

Well, let's test that idea. Name me two major groups, said to be evolutionarily connected, and I'll see if I can find a transitional form.

Most creationists cut and run or make a series of excuses at this point. But maybe you've got more integrity than that Do you?


How long does it take for a species to evolve?

--Dave

One mutation can do it. All that needs to happen is a mutation that makes the new organism unable to reproduce with the older population.

The evolution of O. gigas from O. lamarckania is an example. A polyploidy event that produced a new species, complertely unable to reproduce with the old population.
 

alwight

New member

Are you telling me that the First Starfish that Ever Lived, Looks just like the Starfish we do Today?
What I actually said Mark was that one particular starfish around today does look rather like the surviving impression from the distant past. But given all the very different varieties of starfish that abound then that probably isn't a particularly surprising thing at all. I'm not aware of any way to compare the soft tissue since only the hard parts are seen in the fossil, are you?

Containing Every Functional anatomical feature, that they did when they first Appeared?
Wrong, anatomy also includes soft tissue not just the fossilised skeleton.

Give Up AL; You have a Religion, a set of beliefs that are not based On Observed Truth (Science).
My "religion" is not simply a belief in what looks somewhat like something else therefore it is that same something else.:plain:
 

alwight

New member
How did we go from Eldrege saying, "geologists have found rock layers of all divisions of the last 500 million years and no transitional forms were contained in them", to we are all transitional forms?

How long does it take for a species to evolve?

--Dave
I gather that The Barbarian will be willing to look for a transitional form of any that you care to suggest.:)
How long is a piece of string Dave?
 

Mark SeaSigh

BANNED
Banned
Well, let's test that idea. Name me two major groups, said to be evolutionarily connected, and I'll see if I can find a transitional form.
=M= said:
Trees or Mushrooms; What do you think existed First?

Sure, Barbie; Urchin to Starfish/Brittlestar?

I already Established that Evolutionists believe that the Urchin reproduced it's way to a Starfish; Explain.

Barbie said:
Most creationists cut and run or make a series of excuses at this point. But maybe you've got more integrity than that Do you?

Some creationists Post from their Phone, and don't have the Time to waste on Barbie Girl; Most people don't like Debating you because you use Evasive answers, and Unfounded Reasoning.

I personally don't mind; If anybody is actually reading this, you end up looking bad, not me.

Barbie said:
One mutation can do it. All that needs to happen is a mutation that makes the new organism unable to reproduce with the older population.


If an Animal becomes Unable to Reproduce with it's original Population, Who is it going to Reproduce with?


The evolution of O. gigas from O. lamarckania is an example. A polyploidy event that produced a new species, complertely unable to reproduce with the old population.

Are you talking about Plants or Flies?


[/QUOTE]

Name One Animal; Which Evolutionists believe has Changed as Drastically as Chimp-Like Animal to Man, in the Past Three Million Years, Barbie.


Or, any other Evol, who feels Up to the Challenge.

=M=

Barbie said:
The evolution of O. gigas from O. lamarckania is an example. A polyploidy event that produced a new species, complertely unable to reproduce with the old population.

Barbie; Tell me more about these O. Gigas. Are you talking about Fruit Flies, or are you talking about Plants?

5.1.1.1 Evening Primrose (Oenothera gigas)

While studying the genetics of the evening primrose, Oenothera lamarckiana, de Vries (1905) found an unusual variant among his plants. O. lamarckiana has a chromosome number of 2N = 14. The variant had a chromosome number of 2N = 28. He found that he was unable to breed this variant with O. lamarckiana. He named this new species O. gigas.

Barbie;

Don't you know that the Scientists found out that those Fruit Flies can Interbreed?


Please feel free to Give a Source that Tells how they believe that these Fruit Flies are Actually a Different Species. Even the source where you Got that Information from Originally, would be appreciated.

I would really love to see an Example of Animal Speciation, or Even Insect Speciation; I'm honestly not Impressed when a man finds a Never before Found Self-Pollinating version of a Plant.

There are Plenty of Self-Pollinating fruit Trees.
Would you say that a Cherry Tree, which is Self-Pollinating; Is not a Cherry Tree?

Here's My Source;

www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-speciation.html

If you believe that Animals Speciate, and that is the Origin of the Various Forms of Animals we Share the Planet with; Don't you think there would be Proof That Animals can Speciate, Barbie?



Oh, and one more Question, Barb;

What do you believe Caused the Fruit Trees to Produce Fruit?


I know you were talking about the Fruit Flies, Barbie.

The Names are Close, I can see how you would confuse the Evidence for a Self-Pollinating Plant, with the false information that Fruit Flies had been observed Speciating. Oh, and Barbie; Please try to not Skip anymore Questions, it leaves you looking like you don't know the Answers.
 
Last edited:

DFT_Dave

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Well, let's test that idea. Name me two major groups, said to be evolutionarily connected, and I'll see if I can find a transitional form.

Most creationists cut and run or make a series of excuses at this point. But maybe you've got more integrity than that Do you?

One mutation can do it. All that needs to happen is a mutation that makes the new organism unable to reproduce with the older population.

The evolution of O. gigas from O. lamarckania is an example. A polyploidy event that produced a new species, complertely unable to reproduce with the old population.

Let's just answer my questions.

How did we go from Eldrege saying, "geologists have found rock layers of all divisions of the last 500 million years and no transitional forms were contained in them", to we are all transitional forms?

How long does it take for a species to evolve?

Evolution is a continuous process.

Wherever there is self replicating life.

So having offspring is evolution even if they turn out to be just like the parents?

--Dave
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top