PureX
Well-known member
A progressive income tax is the least 'painful' and most fair. Flat taxes and sales taxes unfairly burden the poor, who end up paying a greater share of their income on taxes.
Bernie Sanders, Anti-American!
- Thread starter Ktoyou
- Start date
ClimateSanity
New member
While Scandinavians have no poverty, it is because the state uses transfer payments to keep them out. Without those payments, the poverty rate would be high. Your point dodges a larger issue....It is capitalism that brought billions of people out of poverty and those people are not kept out of poverty through transfer payments from the state.
Scandinavians may not have poverty, but you cannot point to any Scandinavians that were brought out of poverty in the 20 TH century due to job creation in the private sector. All jobs are there because the state artificially keeps companies afloat through subsidies.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
the cbc was awash with talk today about how all the media attention given to the liberal PM Justin "pretty-boy" Trudeau will help Bernie spread his socialist message
meanwhile, while Trudeau campaigned on a pledge to increase government spending and limit the Canadian federal deficit to $10 billion, projections are that this first year of his prime ministership will see a deficit three times as large :doh:
meanwhile, while Trudeau campaigned on a pledge to increase government spending and limit the Canadian federal deficit to $10 billion, projections are that this first year of his prime ministership will see a deficit three times as large :doh:
HisServant
New member
Tariffs are the most fair... no citizen pays anything, except for a larger cost for imported goods.
Tariffs were the governments only source of income till they screwed up and instituted an income tax.
Sorry, Ktoyou, you don't know what you're talking about and you don't even know what socialism is . You're totally clueless about Bernie Sanders and what he represents .
He is NOT a Marist or communist - he is a social democrat , which means he believes in Democratic government but one with a strong safety net to prevent poor people from falling through the cracks .
This is the best way to PREVENT poverty and unemployment .
The Republican party is trying to DESTROY America's already inadequate social safety net , which would be absolutely catastrophic . They're doing this in the name of "personal responsibility" and "self-reliance", which are nothing but code words for imposing dog eat dog uncontrolled free market capitalism on America .
Europe has become the most prosperous and poverty-free region of the world because of social Democracy . Yes, it has a lot of problems now, but not because of its social democratic economic policies . America SHOULD become more like Europe . But the greedy bastards of the GOP allied with
greedy, ruthless superrich industrialists like the Koch brothers have nearly ruined America by imposing supply side , "trickle down economics on America, which is always disastrous .
Prosperity does NOT trickle down and it never has or will . Supply side economics only concentrates an enormous amount of wealth in the hands of a tiny rich minority and makes the poor and middle class poorer and poorer .
He is NOT a Marist or communist - he is a social democrat , which means he believes in Democratic government but one with a strong safety net to prevent poor people from falling through the cracks .
This is the best way to PREVENT poverty and unemployment .
The Republican party is trying to DESTROY America's already inadequate social safety net , which would be absolutely catastrophic . They're doing this in the name of "personal responsibility" and "self-reliance", which are nothing but code words for imposing dog eat dog uncontrolled free market capitalism on America .
Europe has become the most prosperous and poverty-free region of the world because of social Democracy . Yes, it has a lot of problems now, but not because of its social democratic economic policies . America SHOULD become more like Europe . But the greedy bastards of the GOP allied with
greedy, ruthless superrich industrialists like the Koch brothers have nearly ruined America by imposing supply side , "trickle down economics on America, which is always disastrous .
Prosperity does NOT trickle down and it never has or will . Supply side economics only concentrates an enormous amount of wealth in the hands of a tiny rich minority and makes the poor and middle class poorer and poorer .
drbrumley
Well-known member
Spoken like a true Keynesian. Tell me PureX, what gives anyone the right to take income that was earned?
Hardly, 10% of $200,000 is ten time more tax than 10% of 20,000.
He also believes in supporting abortion all the way up untill birth.
Bernie Sanders Expresses Support for Allowing Abortion Without Restriction Until Birth
Most communists have a little or no value for life, it is an inhumane ideology. :Commie:
These things are the only things [were I American] that would stop me voting Sanders, I would positively vote Republican [which I kinda despise] because of the liberal policies of the Democrats.
As for his socialism I always believed that if any Democrat were to splain socialist policies then Americans would go for it...Sanders proves it
McCarthy is now totally discredited by everyone...but the myths linger on in the American mind
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PureX
Well-known member
The purpose of tariffs are to protect American products and jobs from cheap foreign products and labor. Sadly, we no longer do that, and have subsequently lost much of our industrial manufacturing, which has cost us both in terms of jobs and productivity, but also has made us frighteningly dependent upon the rest of the world for most of our manufactured goods. And that's not a position we want to be in, not just because of the loss of jobs, but because it makes us very vulnerable to the economic and political whims of other nations.
Tariffs alone would not pay this nation's bills. Not even close. And to try to make then do so would be so prohibitively expensive to the rest of the world that they could not trade with us.
Grow up and accept the fact that taxation is a necessary part of living in a modern complex society in which we choose not to allow our own citizens to die of disease, starvation, and predatory commerce, in the streets. And stop voting for politicians that want to encourage exactly that that sort of social existence.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
if the purpose of taxation is to prevent people from dying of disease, starvation, and predatory commerce, which class of people benefit the most from taxation?
the poor, of course
so shouldn't the poor bear the cost of that benefit?
in other words, if taxation primarily benefits the poor, why should the wealthy fund that benefit?
PureX
Well-known member
No one in this country earns an income without the cooperation and participation of everyone else in our society. Therefor, the money we generate as a society, and the income we earn as individuals members of that society, belongs to all of us. The idea that you are some sort of lone ranger, living out on the plains by the effort and skill of your own hands is nonsense. None of us live that way anymore. And none of us are ever going to, again. We now live in a very large, complex, INTER-DEPENDENT society in which each of us plays our part as best we are able, and by which each of us is compensated according to our contribution (or at least this is the goal). None of us "owns" anything without the agreement and cooperation of everyone else.
So stop pretending you are the lone ranger so you can justify your own selfishness. You are not the lone ranger and you never will be. You are one citizen among about 320 MILLION of us, and you are able to live as you do because the rest of us are all doing our part to support the whole complex socio-economic machine. And we all have the right to say how the wealth that machine generates gets distributed.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
purex bloviates forth with an unsupportable claim:
and then proceeds to draw conclusions from his false premise:
:darwinsm:
classic! :thumb:
ok
i have the right to say that you should give me half of what you have
and then proceeds to draw conclusions from his false premise:
purex said:
:darwinsm:
classic! :thumb:
purex said:
ok
i have the right to say that you should give me half of what you have
PureX
Well-known member
But for people who earn a subsistence income, that 10% is cutting into their ability to subsist. While for people who earn 10% or more over a subsistence income, that 10% is not cutting into their subsistence at all. So that the poorer one is, the more flat taxes diminish one's ability to subsist. And of course life is not just about subsisting, it's also about advancing beyond subsisting, which then increases the harm being done.
It's not about the numbers, it's about the cost in terms of quality of life. This is why sales taxes on necessity products is also grossly unfair to the poorest among us.
Both of these tax systems are constantly being promoted by wealthy people who want to pay less in taxes, even though they can afford to pay more. And it's just because they are greedy, and they don't care that such tax systems do the most harm to the poorest among us.
Is that really the kind of person you want to be?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
poor people aren't greedy?
good, then they shouldn't squawk if they're asked to pay more in taxes :thumb:
Foxfire
Well-known member
PureX
Well-known member
So … what … you're suggesting that the poor pay 100% tax and die of starvation? … So they can be approved of by a Bible quote?