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  • heir
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    That speaks of THEIR Promise as not over a done with for the failure of their unbelieving fellow Israelites.
    They had the advantage as in to the Jew first all throughout the Acts period (Acts 26:17 KJV which is the time of Acts 9, Acts 13:26 KJV, Acts 13:46 KJV, Romans 1:16 KJV). Why you want to say that Israel was cast away in Acts 7 is beyond me. Israel had fallen, but had not been cast away. Paul was sent to certain Gentiles that Paul may provoke to emulation them which were his flesh, and might save some of them! You can't get around it!

    Romans 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

    Romans 11:8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day.

    Romans 11:9 And David saith, Let their table be made a snare, and a trap, and a stumblingblock, and a recompence unto them:

    Romans 11:10 Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway.

    Romans 11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

    Romans 11:12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?

    Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

    Romans 11:14 If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Originally posted by heir View Post
    They were called the "handwriting of ordinances". That's the term and it isn't hard to see that we were never under them as they were against us/contrary to us!

    Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;


    And the weaker brother was about those under dietary restrictions because there were two programs running simultaneously, the remnant was being gathered and the middle wall of partition was intact. Your modern day cultural application doesn't work. You don't become a Jew that you may win the Jew. LOL

    1 Timothy 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
    Two separate issues. No arguement there.

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Originally posted by heir View Post
    I am believing what saith the scripture! It says the Jew had an advantage at the time of acts 20! "Much every way" and why is right there for you to believe yet you don't because you refuse to let go of the false premise that Israel was cast away in Acts 7 instead. They clearly were not!

    Romans 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?

    Romans 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
    That speaks of THEIR Promise as not over a done with for the failure of their unbelieving fellow Israelites.

    Lol, Paul began his indictment against unbelieving Israel in Romans 2:17 - which you have confused as proselytes out of your consistent failure to understand the sense of words like "called" when and where they are being used.

    It is a condemnation there against the hypocritical Jew.

    There is a hole in how you approach studying these things out. Yours is the same hole of the 28ers.

    But all you do is take offence when this is pointed out to you. Quit being so hard on yourself; we all make mistakes.

    Leave a comment:


  • heir
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    Typical "Ambassador" practices ("practices" being another sense of the word "ordinances") when dealing with those who's faith and or customs differ from our own.

    The "ambassador" is ever the one under "ordinance" to step up to the plate (no pun intended) and adjust his ways to that of those he is dealing with, so long as he does not compromise who and what he himself represents.

    1 Corinthians 8:4 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.

    1 Corinthians 8:7 Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat it as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.

    1 Corinthians 8:9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.

    Try "not for us"-ing that when dealing with people from other cultures - see how far that gets your intent in dealing with them to begin with.

    Many Koreans, for example, made that mistake, when they first began gracing our shores with their own beautiful culture and its uniquely its own "ordinances" or "norms."

    One would buy something in a Korean owned store; stick one's hand out for the change, only to be met; to one's offence (out of one's own ignorance), with the (1st Generation) Korean custom of putting the change on the counter.

    Over time the Koreans came to have "that knowledge," their "conscience" as to this practice no longer "a stumblingblock to them that are weak."

    The Apostle Paul might say "this witness is true..."

    1 Corinthians 9:20 And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

    1 Corinthians 10:32 Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:

    So, no, I have no problem conducting myself at times as if one under ordinance...
    They were called the "handwriting of ordinances". That's the term and it isn't hard to see that we were never under them as they were against us/contrary to us!

    Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;


    And the weaker brother was about those under dietary restrictions because there were two programs running simultaneously, the remnant was being gathered and the middle wall of partition was intact. Your modern day cultural application doesn't work. You don't become a Jew that you may win the Jew. LOL

    1 Timothy 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:

    Leave a comment:


  • heir
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    You are proof texting those passages at the begining of Romans 3.
    I am believing what saith the scripture! It says the Jew had an advantage at the time of acts 20! "Much every way" and why is right there for you to believe yet you don't because you refuse to let go of the false premise that Israel was cast away in Acts 7 instead. They clearly were not!

    Romans 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?

    Romans 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Originally posted by patrick jane View Post
    or·di·nance
    ˈôrd(ə)nəns/
    noun
    [COLOR=#878787 !important][/COLOR]


    Consider word studying the use of that word both throughout the KJV and in Paul's various uses of same.

    Leave a comment:


  • patrick jane
    replied
    or·di·nance
    ˈôrd(ə)nəns/
    noun
    [COLOR=#878787 !important][/COLOR]


    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Originally posted by heir View Post
    There were Gentiles under these ordinances.

    20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

    Why were certain Gentiles to whom Paul was sent under them? Are we? Why or why not?
    Typical "Ambassador" practices ("practices" being another sense of the word "ordinances") when dealing with those who's faith and or customs differ from our own.

    The "ambassador" is ever the one under "ordinance" to step up to the plate (no pun intended) and adjust his ways to that of those he is dealing with, so long as he does not compromise who and what he himself represents.

    1 Corinthians 8:4 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.

    1 Corinthians 8:7 Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat it as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.

    1 Corinthians 8:9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.

    Try "not for us"-ing that when dealing with people from other cultures - see how far that gets your intent in dealing with them to begin with.

    Many Koreans, for example, made that mistake, when they first began gracing our shores with their own beautiful culture and its uniquely its own "ordinances" or "norms."

    One would buy something in a Korean owned store; stick one's hand out for the change, only to be met; to one's offence (out of one's own ignorance), with the (1st Generation) Korean custom of putting the change on the counter.

    Over time the Koreans came to have "that knowledge," their "conscience" as to this practice no longer "a stumblingblock to them that are weak."

    The Apostle Paul might say "this witness is true..."

    1 Corinthians 9:20 And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

    1 Corinthians 10:32 Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:

    So, no, I have no problem conducting myself at times as if one under ordinance...
    Last edited by Danoh; April 6th, 2016, 11:12 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    You are proof texting those passages at the begining of Romans 3.

    I have to believe you are doing so unaware that you are; you and STP simply do not strike me as being knowingly up to know good going into the passages.

    What I see in your assertions is holes in your method of study you are possibly unaware of. Which is why you end up concluding what you end up concluding as to what one or another passage is talking about.

    The opening of Romans 3 is one in several points Paul will relate as to the fact that Israel's fall as a nation is temporary.

    That God also remains faithful to the PROPHESIED aspect of His Two-Fold Purpose: Prophecy and Mystery.

    Circumcision, as Musterion pointed out, having identified that nation as a people through whom God will carry out said Prophetic, Covenant Sealed Plan and Purpose.

    He is relating how that the failure of some to have believed, in no way hinders the faith of God - His faithfulness to His PROPHESIED purpose in that nation.

    How that the oracles He gave them abound with evidence to His faithfulness to His PROPHESIED Pupose for and through that nation; regardless of how many times in their past they have gotten in their own way.

    Paul then returns to what he was relating about Israel's temporary fallen condition and how they ended up that spiritual UNcircumcision WITH the Gentiles.

    Keep in mind, sister, that we differ in our basic, foundational understanding of key aspects within Paul's writings.

    Again, I admire your zeal, but until those aspects are agreed on, we can only go round and round with one another.

    As a result, there really is no point in getting all worked up

    All we can do in light of that is compare notes; which often ends up yielding its' own worthwhile fruit in one area or another; sometimes years after said notes were compared...

    Leave a comment:


  • heir
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    Nope; their casting away took place in Acts 7.
    No way or they would not have had the advantage at the writing of the Roman epistle which was written at the time of Acts 20!

    Romans 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
    Romans 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
    Romans 3:3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?

    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    You are proof texting that.
    The "proof" is that God was still dealing with Israel and those associated all through the Acts of the apostles!
    Last edited by heir; April 6th, 2016, 07:13 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • heir
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    All you are doing is proof texting your view - and poorly.

    Unless it is now okay to ignore two of those and go and fornicate and go and worship with the Roman Catholics and their idols
    There were Gentiles under these ordinances.

    20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

    Why were certain Gentiles to whom Paul was sent under them? Are we? Why or why not?

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Originally posted by SaulToPaul View Post


    You rib me and heir hundreds of times over the past six months...I say nothing.

    I rib you once and you take offence.
    You're sure that is what I took; aren't you

    Ok, mr distinctions

    Leave a comment:


  • SaulToPaul
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    Don't tell me you want to go there, STP; not when you would come off as better than that.

    I think I'll just leave you to that; if that is where you want to go.


    You rib me and heir hundreds of times over the past six months...I say nothing.

    I rib you once and you take offence.

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Originally posted by SaulToPaul View Post
    So you say, Tet...
    Don't tell me you want to go there, STP; not when you would come off as better than that.

    I think I'll just leave you to that; if that is where you want to go.

    Leave a comment:


  • SaulToPaul
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    You are proof texting that.
    So you say, Tet...

    Leave a comment:

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