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Were Early Church Fathers Young Earth Creationists?

6days

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Theistic evolutionists often argue that young earth 'creationism' is a recent belief. However that argument doesn't seem to hold water as the early church fathers were virtually all young earth creationists. Yet the argument is often used by those who want to add time into Scripture, that the church fathers thought Genesis was an allegorical story. The two early church fathers most often used as example is Origen and Augustine.

Origen stands out from the other church fathers in that he had very strange ‘theology’… He did not believe there was ever a first Adam…He believed in the pre-existence of souls and that eventually everyone, including the Devil, would be saved. So…. Using Origen as a source isn’t convincing.

Here are a few of the other early church fathers. They all believe in a young earth, although some thought creation might have been instantaneous. Some, like Augustine believed in instant creation because he used a Latin Bible allowing that interpretation. Had Augustine knew Hebrew, he almost certainly would have understood the Hebrew context did not allow for anything other that God creating in 6 days. Instantaneous creation doesn’t present a huge theological problem, because it still has no death in the world before Adam sinned. Notice, Augustine is a young earth creationist also. (Listed by year of death of each)

100AD "...but those who were sent to Alexandria as interpreters, gave him only the books of the law, while there were a vast number of other matters in our sacred books. They, indeed, contain in them the history of five thousand years;..."Josephus Antiquities of the Jews Book 1 preface par 3

200AD "All the years from the creation of the world amount to a total of 5698 years, and the odd months and days." Theophilus to Autolycus book 3 ch 28

236AD "Since, then, in six days God made all things, it follows that 6,000 years must be fulfilled" Hipplytus Extant Works and Fragments Exegetical Interpetation of the visions of Daniel and Nebuchadnezzar

254AD "After these statements, Celsus, from a secret desire to cast discredit upon the Mosaic account of the creation, which teaches that the world is not yet ten thousand years old, but very much under that, while concealing his wish, intimates his agreement with those who hold that the world is uncreated." Origen Against Celsus book 1

300AD "For when a thousand years are reckoned as one day in the sight of God, and from the creation of the world to His rest is six days "Methodius Extracts From the Work on Things Created par 9

350AD"Therefore, since all the works of God were completed in six days, the world must continue in its present state through six ages, that is, six thousand years." Lactantius Divine Institutes book 7

373AD "Although both the light and the clouds were created in the twinkling of an eye, still both the day and the night of the First Day continued for twelve hours each" (Commentary on Genesis 1, p. 287).Regarding the First Day of creation "No one should think that the Creation of Six Days is an allegory; it is likewise impermissible to say that what seems, according to the account, to have been created in six days, was created in a single instant," St. Ephraim the Syrian Commentary on Genesis I

379AD "(Some) have attempted by false arguments and allegorical interpretations to bestow on the Scripture a dignity of their own imagining. But theirs is the attitude of one who considers himself wiser than the revelations of the Spirit and introduces his own ideas in pretence of an explanation. Therefore, let it be understood as it has been written. St. Basil the Great, Hexaemeron 9:1, pp. 135-36

395AD "Moses, I say, who was born some thousands of years after the Creation of the world" Gregory of Nyssa Answer to Eunomius’ Second Book

397AD "At this command the waters immediately poured forth their offspring. The rivers were in labor. The lakes produced their quota of life. The sea itself began to bear all manner of reptiles...We are unable to record the multiplicity of the names of all those species which by Divine command were brought to life in a moment of time. At the same instant substantial form and the principle of life were drought brought into existence...The whale, as well as the frog, came into existence at the same time by the same creative power (5:1, 2, pp. 160-62) He (Moses) did not look forward to a late and leisurely creation of the word out of a concourse of atoms (1:2, pp. 5, 7). And fittingly (Moses) added: He created, lest it be thought there was a delay in creation. Furthermore, men would see also how incomparable the Creator was Who completed such a work in the briefest moment of His creative act, so much so that the effect of His will anticipated the perception of time (Ibid., 1:5, p.8). The Church Fathers were unanimous in asserting God creates immediately and instantaneously, that it is His word which produces all things and is not the property of the waters or earth to bring forth life. St. Ambrose of Milan - Hexaemeron 7:2, p.107


407AD "But the world, though subsisting now five thousand years, and..." John Chrysostom Homily 10 on the Statues par 5

420AD "The world was created by God nearly six thousand years ago,"Sulpitius Severus Sacred History book 1 ch 2

430AD "Unbelievers are also deceived by false documents which ascribe to history many thousand years, although we can calculate from Sacred Scripture that not 6,000 years have passed since the creation of man." Augustine City of God Book 12 ch 10

We could examine what Jesus believed and taught. He referred to Adam and Eve existing from “the beginning of creation” Mark 10:6. Jesus also referred to Abel existing at a time near the “foundation of the world”…not billions of years later. Luke 11:50
 

Jacob

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200AD "All the years from the creation of the world amount to a total of 5698 years, and the odd months and days." Theophilus to Autolycus book 3 ch 28
Interesting. We are currently in the year 5779. I have heard a different number of years before. I wonder if this was it or if this is why.
 

SabathMoon

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There seems to be a consensus that the earth was 6000 years old on the 7th day. None of them had read the Old Testament until recently.
 

6days

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It makes sense they were young earth. There were no fancy scientists claiming some bone was 4 billion years old.
However, there always has people arguing for an old earth. Even in Scripture Paul argued against old earth beliefs with the Epicureans. The early church fathers continued arguing against old earth. Augustine said people who believed in an old earth had been deceived.
 

SabathMoon

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God rested (past tense) on the 7th day; that was about 6,000 years ago. And...of course the early church fathers had read the Old Testament.

They didn't read it as often as you think is my point. They calculated the age of the earth using Hellenistic science, AKA Hellenistic philosophy. What else were they wrong about?
 

6days

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They didn't read it as often as you think is my point. They calculated the age of the earth using Hellenistic science, AKA Hellenistic philosophy. What else were they wrong about?
No SabathMoon… The early church fathers estimated the age of the earth from God's Word. Like Augustine said, "we can calculate from Sacred Scripture that not 6,000 years have passed since the creation of man."
 

6days

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What relevance does what the "early church fathers" believed, have on veracity? And what relevance does when you discover objective truth, in determining whether it is, in fact, objective truth, have?

That, "Watson" is the question.

I agree... What people believe does not determine truth. However, if there are Biblical scholars who we generally trust, it can help us form opinions.

But, as stated in the OP; the reason for the post was to show theistic evolutionists arguments are false when they claim the early church fathers were accepting of old earth beliefs. Old earth beliefs that place thorns, suffering and physical death before sin entered our world, destroy the purpose of the cross.
 

john w

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I agree... What people believe does not determine truth. However, if there are Biblical scholars who we generally trust, it can help us form opinions.

But, as stated in the OP; the reason for the post was to show theistic evolutionists arguments are false when they claim the early church fathers were accepting of old earth beliefs. Old earth beliefs that place thorns, suffering and physical death before sin entered our world, destroy the purpose of the cross.

I need not address the question,and will not, since it is quite irrelevant, and leads to rabbit trails.
 

SabathMoon

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No SabathMoon… The early church fathers estimated the age of the earth from God's Word. Like Augustine said, "we can calculate from Sacred Scripture that not 6,000 years have passed since the creation of man."

I believe they weren't in agreement with one another too, and that you have selectively quoted them. Augustine didn't believe souls(psuchai) were not immortal, because like a JW and not being one, he believed in a form of everlasting punishment where people just die.

These quotes seem to show poor calculation. But they don't agree with Glenn Morton either.

100AD "...but those who were sent to Alexandria as interpreters, gave him only the books of the law, while there were a vast number of other matters in our sacred books. They, indeed, contain in them the history of five thousand years;..."Josephus Antiquities of the Jews Book 1 preface par 3

200AD "All the years from the creation of the world amount to a total of 5698 years, and the odd months and days." Theophilus to Autolycus book 3 ch 28


I apologize for jumping to conclusions, and it also seems the LXX was also used in calculation the age of the earth. The genealogy in the LXX is much longer and not the same as the Hebrew text.
 

6days

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SabathMoon said:
"I believe they weren't in agreement with one another too, and that you have selectively quoted them."
Why are you resistant to believing that all the early church fathers rejected old earth beliefs? It seems funny you believe I have selectively quoted, yet you are unable to back up your claim. Old earth beliefs that have suffering in our world before first Adam sinned, compromises the Gospel.
 

SabathMoon

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Why are you resistant to believing that all the early church fathers rejected old earth beliefs? It seems funny you believe I have selectively quoted, yet you are unable to back up your claim. Old earth beliefs that have suffering in our world before first Adam sinned, compromises the Gospel.

The early church fathers made mistakes. I would call them out on anything which they wrote and said incorrectly. They calculated the age of the earth by using of all things the genealogies in the LXX.

Further, it was old earthism that the hellenes believed; it was perpetual earthism past and present. This is different from modern doctrines of evolution.
 

6days

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Sabathia Moon said:
The early church fathers made mistakes. I would call them out on anything which they wrote and said incorrectly. They calculated the age of the earth by using of all things the genealogies in the LXX.
What are you trying to say? If you think the Hebrew text instead of Septuagint allows for an old earth, you are mistaken. Neither the LLX nor MT allows for billions of years. The Hebrew context does not allow for anything other than creation much less than 10,000 yrs.
 

SabathMoon

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What are you trying to say? If you think the Hebrew text instead of Septuagint allows for an old earth, you are mistaken. Neither the LLX nor MT allows for billions of years. The Hebrew context does not allow for anything other than creation much less than 10,000 yrs.

You are obviously unaware that the genealogy in the Septuagint is longer, and so it explains the ECF +2000 miscalculation.
 

Crucifer

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Everyone who didn't know the Earth was more than 6000 years old believed the Earth was only 6000 years old. :chuckle:

Doesn't really get much more simple than that. People who didn't know the Earth was a sphere thought existence was a snow globe, and they interpreted this from scriptures as well.
The point of the Bible is not to be a science book.
 
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