What are your reasons for believing in god(s)?

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SUTG

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I am new here. Although I've done quite a bit of reading in the other threads, this is my first post.

My reason for being here is to debate, or preferably discuss, the existence of gods. It would be nice to be challenged and informed. As you can see from my profile, I am an atheist. I have always been an atheist, although I used to go to church every week with my family, and was sent to a Roman Catholic church.

Alot of my friends are Christians (or theists, at least) but I don't think it is always appropriate to try and challenge their beliefs (unless they are interested in the exchange). So, I came here.

If anyone is interested in an exchange, please start with your reasons for believing what you do.


cheers,
SUTG
 

Granite

New member
Hall of Fame
As the existence of deity can't be proven either way, I'm not going to be dogmatic.

That's just me.

Welcome to TOL! :sinapisN:
 

Caledvwlch

New member
Welcome, SUTG (how is that pronounced?). I wish I could help you, but I don't even really know what I believe, so much as I know what I don't believe.
 

SUTG

New member
Wow, you guys are quick. I even recognise two of your usernames from other threads.

Granite1010, I was not asking for proof either way, only reasons for belief. Most of us believe in lots of things we cannot prove.
 

JoyfulRook

New member
I believe in God because of the compelling evidence in the Bible and in the Historical Record.

:zoomin:

I'm not going to get technical right now, because I don't have time, but those are my thoughts.
 

SUTG

New member
Dread Helm said:
I'm not going to get technical right now, because I don't have time, but those are my thoughts.


Fair enough. Stop back when you do have the time.
 

Catatumba

New member
SUTG said:
I am new here. Although I've done quite a bit of reading in the other threads, this is my first post.

My reason for being here is to debate, or preferably discuss, the existence of gods. It would be nice to be challenged and informed. As you can see from my profile, I am an atheist. I have always been an atheist, although I used to go to church every week with my family, and was sent to a Roman Catholic church.

Alot of my friends are Christians (or theists, at least) but I don't think it is always appropriate to try and challenge their beliefs (unless they are interested in the exchange). So, I came here.

If anyone is interested in an exchange, please start with your reasons for believing what you do.
You are an atheist...
Does it not mean that yo do not believe in the Hebrew God, right?
And that you do not have a reasonable influence of the same within you. I just want to make sure that your arguments for your arguments come from the etherphimeral existance of "other gods" as you call it is objective; and not the product of a secularized need to be cool or semi-conscious or un-conscious, or even a confusion, as to what you are seeking to believe.
The greeks were very good at that. It's called mythology.
Paul's most famous "unknown god."
And inside this very context the myth of xstianity, the Jesus thing is called "The Noble Lie."; Is there any room for doubt?
Cheers, Catatumba. :dog:
cheers,
SUTG
 
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Sentinel

New member
Alright, my thoughts on gods are simple, and herein I suppose I shall dip my feet into the water to get started on uncovering my views for the lot of you.

I am pagan, however I happen to have been Christian for a good portion of my life so I know the routine. I do believe in intelligent design- something out there had to have created this because, quite simply, the odds of it having occured on it's own are shamefully slim. Whether or not we were created by a 'God' is left up to question. I worship no god. I respect a great many and have affection for a few, certainly, but do not worship anyone or anything.

Every god of every religion exists. Why is that? Because people believe in them. Belief is something similar to currency amongst the gods, as it were, because if people believe in something, it becomes real. The more belief people have, the more concrete and 'real' that which they believe in becomes. The concept is called 'consensual reality'. This is not to say that if I believe that I can fly, I can jump off a building and fly. Quite the opposite will occur, I assure you. Now, the reason for this? The Consensus states otherwise. The Consensus is formed of the commonly accepted facets of reality, held close to people and nutured. Humanity has made realities of it's beliefs. An example of this would be the dollar bill- it's not worth anything but for the fact that people believe it has value. It is paper with ink on it. Now what kind of worth would that have without the belief that it actually has some? Very little. The United States is not even on the Gold Standard anymore- so it is not representing actual gold in a treasury somewhere (the value of gold could be subject to this, but at the moment, I shall only address the dollar bill). So the dollar bill only is worth a dollar because the government asserts that it is and we believe that it is. This concept is the same one that I apply to gods- they exist because people believe they do and they also believe that their gods are capable of doing things- and thusly, they become capable.
 

Hal_Jordan

New member
Sentinel said:
Alright, my thoughts on gods are simple, and herein I suppose I shall dip my feet into the water to get started on uncovering my views for the lot of you.

I am pagan, however I happen to have been Christian for a good portion of my life so I know the routine. I do believe in intelligent design- something out there had to have created this because, quite simply, the odds of it having occured on it's own are shamefully slim. Whether or not we were created by a 'God' is left up to question. I worship no god. I respect a great many and have affection for a few, certainly, but do not worship anyone or anything.

Every god of every religion exists. Why is that? Because people believe in them. Belief is something similar to currency amongst the gods, as it were, because if people believe in something, it becomes real. The more belief people have, the more concrete and 'real' that which they believe in becomes. The concept is called 'consensual reality'. This is not to say that if I believe that I can fly, I can jump off a building and fly. Quite the opposite will occur, I assure you. Now, the reason for this? The Consensus states otherwise. The Consensus is formed of the commonly accepted facets of reality, held close to people and nutured. Humanity has made realities of it's beliefs. An example of this would be the dollar bill- it's not worth anything but for the fact that people believe it has value. It is paper with ink on it. Now what kind of worth would that have without the belief that it actually has some? Very little. The United States is not even on the Gold Standard anymore- so it is not representing actual gold in a treasury somewhere (the value of gold could be subject to this, but at the moment, I shall only address the dollar bill). So the dollar bill only is worth a dollar because the government asserts that it is and we believe that it is. This concept is the same one that I apply to gods- they exist because people believe they do and they also believe that their gods are capable of doing things- and thusly, they become capable.

I used to believe the same way, with a few additions. If I may, what caused you (if anytihng) to move from Christianity to Paganism?
 

Real Sorceror

New member
Sentinel said:
Alright, my thoughts on gods are simple, and herein I suppose I shall dip my feet into the water to get started on uncovering my views for the lot of you.

I am pagan, however I happen to have been Christian for a good portion of my life so I know the routine. I do believe in intelligent design- something out there had to have created this because, quite simply, the odds of it having occured on it's own are shamefully slim. Whether or not we were created by a 'God' is left up to question. I worship no god. I respect a great many and have affection for a few, certainly, but do not worship anyone or anything.

Every god of every religion exists. Why is that? Because people believe in them. Belief is something similar to currency amongst the gods, as it were, because if people believe in something, it becomes real. The more belief people have, the more concrete and 'real' that which they believe in becomes. The concept is called 'consensual reality'. This is not to say that if I believe that I can fly, I can jump off a building and fly. Quite the opposite will occur, I assure you. Now, the reason for this? The Consensus states otherwise. The Consensus is formed of the commonly accepted facets of reality, held close to people and nutured. Humanity has made realities of it's beliefs. An example of this would be the dollar bill- it's not worth anything but for the fact that people believe it has value. It is paper with ink on it. Now what kind of worth would that have without the belief that it actually has some? Very little. The United States is not even on the Gold Standard anymore- so it is not representing actual gold in a treasury somewhere (the value of gold could be subject to this, but at the moment, I shall only address the dollar bill). So the dollar bill only is worth a dollar because the government asserts that it is and we believe that it is. This concept is the same one that I apply to gods- they exist because people believe they do and they also believe that their gods are capable of doing things- and thusly, they become capable.
Deep thoughts man. I'm starting to believe there are other gods as well. What do you think happens if no one believes in a certian diety? Would it stop existing? How do you think the different mythologies relate to one another? Is there one that is "more" true or is it relative to the number of believers?
 

soothsayer

New member
Dread Helm said:
I believe in God because of the compelling evidence in the Bible and in the Historical Record.
Compelling evidence? :think: The Bible is hardly compelling with all of its errors and inconsistencies. And the historical record can only acertain that people have believed in your god (the same could be said of any god) not that he actually exists, or even ever existed.
:zoomin:

I'm not going to get technical right now, because I don't have time, but those are my thoughts.

Perhaps you're ready to get "technical" now?
 

Real Sorceror

New member
My theory so far is that the three Abrahmic faiths are basically true. However, there are "poser" gods, if you will, that want to be worshiped like God. The Greek, Egyption, and Norse pantheons are examples. They are not really gods in the sense that they did not create the universe and likely did not create anything at all (except perhaps the religions that worship them). I dont think they all have an evil agenda, and many appear to have purely good intentions (like the three core Buddhist dieties). I have no idea what they are or where they came from (likely they where created by God, but for some other purpose)
 

Daniel50

New member
I strongly believe Bible is the "Word of God".The power God is on the word of God.



"And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."
 

Sentinel

New member
Real Sorceror said:
Deep thoughts man. I'm starting to believe there are other gods as well. What do you think happens if no one believes in a certian diety? Would it stop existing? How do you think the different mythologies relate to one another? Is there one that is "more" true or is it relative to the number of believers?

I would probably say that yes, if belief in a certain deity was entirely gone and no one (not one indivdual) believed in their existance any longer, they'd fade into nothingness. That is not to say that if people began to believe again that they could not return, however.

Insofar as mythology goes, I think that it's all to be taken with a grain of salt. I believe in no particular ideology, really. And I don't think that truth can really be measured in the number of believers it his, despite my thoughts on Consensual Reality. Truth is... not necessarily what is commonly believed to be real. It's complicated to explain, honestly.

Insofar as Creation goes, I am not so sure that we were created by some being because, if you consider it, if there was nothing at all other than God- where did God come from? I'd be inclined to say that we were not created by any 'God' but perhaps by some higher being that wanted to try his hand at something. Now, whether that higher being be some form of 'alien' race that we don't know about yet, or if it truly is some sort of god is left up in the air at the moment. I'd hesitate to say 'aliens' because that sounds too sci-fi and is in no way credible, in my estimation. However, I don't think that we are the *only* intelligent life in the entire universe, that'd just be arrogant and foolish of us, for the universe is, essentially, infinate. Just because we haven't encountered anything intelligent in our forays within our own solar system doesn't mean that there aren't other creatures out there that are as (if not more) advanced than we. But still, saying that "We were created by alien influence!" is just... it leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
 

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Sentinel said:
Insofar as Creation goes, I am not so sure that we were created by some being because, if you consider it, if there was nothing at all other than God- where did God come from? I'd be inclined to say that we were not created by any 'God' but perhaps by some higher being that wanted to try his hand at something. Now, whether that higher being be some form of 'alien' race that we don't know about yet, or if it truly is some sort of god is left up in the air at the moment. I'd hesitate to say 'aliens' because that sounds too sci-fi and is in no way credible, in my estimation. However, I don't think that we are the *only* intelligent life in the entire universe, that'd just be arrogant and foolish of us, for the universe is, essentially, infinate. Just because we haven't encountered anything intelligent in our forays within our own solar system doesn't mean that there aren't other creatures out there that are as (if not more) advanced than we. But still, saying that "We were created by alien influence!" is just... it leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
Are these "aliens" supernatural?

Because.... if they are not, you have only set the question of creation back a level and solved nothing.

Said another way.... who created the aliens?
 

Sentinel

New member
Knight said:
Are these "aliens" supernatural?

Because.... if they are not, you have only set the question of creation back a level and solved nothing.

Said another way.... who created the aliens?

I didn't claim that they were supernatural- I don't believe that aliens created us. I think that it's possible, but I can't say that that's what I believe. Quite frankly, I don't know who created what, but I can assure you that something had to start all of this and I don't think it was the Christian God. Sure, s/he might've started humanity going, but I don't think that s/he created *everything*. For all we know, the 'god' that created this universe is a pimply-faced youth in another reality that is presenting this universe as a science experement. The rabbit hole never stops and I don't think humanity will ever really know where it came from or how everything came to be. There are innumerable explanations and each as questionable as the next for none have any real proof that can be quantified.
 

Nineveh

Merely Christian
Real Sorceror said:
...I'm starting to believe there are other gods...

Of course there are. This is no big secret.

The question is, which one is The God?

I know of a God who puts other gods on their face before Him :) 1 Samuel 5:3
 

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Sentinel said:
I didn't claim that they were supernatural
I realize that, hence my question. Nevermind.

You continue....
I don't believe that aliens created us. I think that it's possible, but I can't say that that's what I believe. Quite frankly, I don't know who created what, but I can assure you that something had to start all of this and I don't think it was the Christian God.
So... you are saying you have no clue who created except you have ruled out one possible option? :confused:
 
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