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  • THE SAVIOUR OF THE WORLD

    1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

    2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

    John spoke of Jesus as being the propitiation or the appeasement for the sins of the world.

    John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

    John the baptist identified Jesus as the Lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world. God promised to provide the sacrificial lamb to Abraham (Genesis 22:7-8).

    1 John 4:14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world.

    4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.

    It is to be noted that when John speaks of Christ being sent to be the Saviour of the world in verse 14 above, the next verse links confession of Jesus as the Son of God, which was required of Israel (Matthew 10:32 Matthew 16:15-16 John 4:42).

    John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

    3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

    3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

    John, in verse 16 and 17 above, speaks of Christ loving the world and being sent to save the world.

    In verse 18 saving the world is conditioned upon Israel believing on Christ; Israel had to believe only in his name. The gospel Israel had to believe was the gospel of the kingdom (Matthew 4:23), in which, Christ would establish his kingdom on earth and reign with believing Israel; and that Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah, the Son of God. This can be seen in John 20:31 below:

    John 20:31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

    God also purposed that the world would be blessed in the kingdom on earth:

    Zechariah 8:22 Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the LORD of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the LORD.

    8:23 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.

    Jesus told the twelve disciples that the prophets spoke of his death and resurrection (Luke 18:31-33) but the meaning was hid from them and they did not understand it (Luke 18:34).

    How God could take away the sin of the world and remain just was not yet made known.

    All that the death and resurrection of Christ would accomplish was not known until revealed to Paul (1 Corinthians 2:8).

    2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

    Jesus revealed to Paul that by the cross sin was not being imputed or reckoned to the world.

    The word of this reconciliation that is preached must be believed. The gospel that Christ died for our sins and rose for our justification must be believed (Romans 4:25).

    By the cross God could be just and the justifier of those who trust in Christ Jesus and his blood (Romans 3:24-26

  • #2
    Originally posted by DougE View Post

    John spoke of Jesus as being the propitiation or the appeasement for the sins of the world.

    John the baptist identified Jesus as the Lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world. God promised to provide the sacrificial lamb to Abraham

    It is to be noted that when John speaks of Christ being sent to be the Saviour of the world in verse 14 above, the next verse links confession of Jesus as the Son of God, which was required of Israel


    John, in verse 16 and 17 above, speaks of Christ loving the world and being sent to save the world.

    In verse 18 saving the world is conditioned upon Israel believing on Christ; Israel had to believe only in his name. The gospel Israel had to believe was the gospel of the kingdom in which, Christ would establish his kingdom on earth and reign with believing Israel; and that Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah, the Son of God. This can be seen in
    Jesus came only for the Jews who already belonged to God by faith. The rest of the Jews were cut off and bound to the place of the disobedient Gentiles who did not come into the covenant with God, and all had to wait until Jesus was crucified.

    In the book of John, God says it is NO MORE by human descent---that means it does NOT matter ANYMORE who is blood related to Abraham. All Israel were blood related to Abraham, AND IT DIDN'T matter anymore because Jesus' blood only matters now.



    See John 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.


    So everything you said is off.

    Originally posted by DougE View Post

    God also purposed that the world would be blessed in the kingdom on earth:

    Zechariah 8:22 Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the LORD of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the LORD.

    8:23 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.

    Jesus told the twelve disciples that the prophets spoke of his death and resurrection (Luke 18:31-33) but the meaning was hid from them and they did not understand it (Luke 18:34).

    How God could take away the sin of the world and remain just was not yet made known.

    All that the death and resurrection of Christ would accomplish was not known until revealed to Paul (1 Corinthians 2:8).

    2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

    Jesus revealed to Paul that by the cross sin was not being imputed or reckoned to the world.

    The word of this reconciliation that is preached must be believed. The gospel that Christ died for our sins and rose for our justification must be believed (Romans 4:25).

    By the cross God could be just and the justifier of those who trust in Christ Jesus and his blood (Romans 3:24-26
    You just keep saying that about Paul and with that, you have to deny that anyone said Jesus was the Savior of the world and forgives sins and to have faith in him.

    You have to deny that Peter saved the first Gentiles and explained it that God does NOT show favoritism over Jews.
    Oh how I love the Word of God!

    Don't just hear the word and believe it---do it.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by God's Truth View Post

      Jesus came only for the Jews who already belonged to God by faith. The rest of the Jews were cut off and bound to the place of the disobedient Gentiles who did not come into the covenant with God, and all had to wait until Jesus was crucified.

      In the book of John, God says it is NO MORE by human descent---that means it does NOT matter ANYMORE who is blood related to Abraham. All Israel were blood related to Abraham, AND IT DIDN'T matter anymore because Jesus' blood only matters now.



      See John 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.


      So everything you said is off.



      You just keep saying that about Paul and with that, you have to deny that anyone said Jesus was the Savior of the world and forgives sins and to have faith in him.

      You have to deny that Peter saved the first Gentiles and explained it that God does NOT show favoritism over Jews.
      That is Funny.

      Jesus came for THE JEWS.

      What are you saying, Paul came for the Gentiles?


      Please explain how Jews was for the Jews?

      Oh here is an easy one for you, Paul CAME for the Gentiles.

      So the Jews are that believe are saved by Jesus.

      But

      The Gentiles

      Are only saved by Paul.

      Is this what you are saying?

      ???????

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Child of God View Post

        That is Funny.

        Jesus came for THE JEWS.
        Jesus came first for the Jews who already had faith in God.

        Originally posted by Child of God View Post

        What are you saying, Paul came for the Gentiles?
        Paul was sent to the Jews and the Gentiles, but the Jews didn't trust him. The Jews thought he was just trying to trick them into saying they believed in Jesus so that he could put them in prison. So Jesus sent him far away to the Gentiles..

        Paul put many of the saints in prison, and when they were put to death, he cast his vote against them. Paul began to destroy the church. Going from house to house, he dragged off men and women and put them in prison. Acts 22:4, Acts 22:20, Acts 26:10, Acts 8:3.

        Read here where Paul tells the Lord Jesus Christ about how the Jews think he is just trying to trick them, and then Jesus sends him far away to the Gentiles.

        Acts 22:19 ‘Lord,’ I answered, ‘they know very well that in one synagogue after another I imprisoned and beat those who believed in You. 20And when the blood of Your witness Stephen was shed, I stood there giving my approval and watching over the garments of those who killed him.’ 21Then He said to me, ‘Go! I will send you far away to the Gentiles.’”


        Originally posted by Child of God View Post

        Please explain how Jews was for the Jews?
        What do you mean?

        Originally posted by Child of God View Post
        Oh here is an easy one for you, Paul CAME for the Gentiles.

        So the Jews are that believe are saved by Jesus.

        But

        The Gentiles

        Are only saved by Paul.

        Is this what you are saying?

        ???????
        No. Paul preached Jesus to the Gentiles. That is what I mean.
        Oh how I love the Word of God!

        Don't just hear the word and believe it---do it.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by God's Truth View Post

          Jesus came first for the Jews who already had faith in God.


          Paul was sent to the Jews and the Gentiles, but the Jews didn't trust him. The Jews thought he was just trying to trick them into saying they believed in Jesus so that he could put them in prison. So Jesus sent him far away to the Gentiles..

          What do you mean?



          No. Paul preached Jesus to the Gentiles. That is what I mean.
          And Jesus was received by the Jews with great rejoicing, the Jews made Jesus their King, repented of their sins toward God, What else?

          I bring this up because you say BUT PAUL was rejected by the Jews.

          We all know the Jews Made Jesus their King, Correct?

          The Jews made Jesus KING OF THE Jews, but Paul was rejected by the Jews.

          Is that what you are arguing?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by God's Truth View Post

            Jesus came first for the Jews who already had faith in God.
            The Word of God in the Scriptures very much disagrees with you.
            According to the Scriptures the Jews did not have have faith in God.

            You are seeing things that are not in Scripture.

            Originally posted by God's Truth View Post

            Paul was sent to the Jews and the Gentiles, but the Jews didn't trust him. The Jews thought he was just trying to trick them into saying they believed in Jesus so that he could put them in prison. So Jesus sent him far away to the Gentiles..
            Paul was a charlatan.

            Originally posted by God's Truth View Post
            Paul put many of the saints in prison, and when they were put to death, he cast his vote against them. Paul began to destroy the church. Going from house to house, he dragged off men and women and put them in prison. Acts 22:4, Acts 22:20, Acts 26:10, Acts 8:3.

            Read here where Paul tells the Lord Jesus Christ about how the Jews think he is just trying to trick them, and then Jesus sends him far away to the Gentiles.

            Acts 22:19 ‘Lord,’ I answered, ‘they know very well that in one synagogue after another I imprisoned and beat those who believed in You. 20And when the blood of Your witness Stephen was shed, I stood there giving my approval and watching over the garments of those who killed him.’ 21Then He said to me, ‘Go! I will send you far away to the Gentiles.’”



            What do you mean?



            No. Paul preached Jesus to the Gentiles. That is what I mean.

            Paul could not hold his own against a well informed Jew concerning the Scripture.
            So Paul decided he would go where they had not heard the Scripture.


            YET THE DISCIPLES MADE CONVERTS DAILY. in Jerusalem.

            Comment


            • #7
              Douge
              THE SAVIOUR OF THE WORLD
              Yes, speaking of Gods Sheep all over the World, both jew and gentile Sheep
              "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
              preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
              called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
              a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

              Charles Spurgeon !

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by God's Truth View Post

                Jesus came only for the Jews who already belonged to God by faith. The rest of the Jews were cut off and bound to the place of the disobedient Gentiles who did not come into the covenant with God, and all had to wait until Jesus was crucified.

                In the book of John, God says it is NO MORE by human descent---that means it does NOT matter ANYMORE who is blood related to Abraham. All Israel were blood related to Abraham, AND IT DIDN'T matter anymore because Jesus' blood only matters now.



                See John 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.


                So everything you said is off.



                You just keep saying that about Paul and with that, you have to deny that anyone said Jesus was the Savior of the world and forgives sins and to have faith in him.

                You have to deny that Peter saved the first Gentiles and explained it that God does NOT show favoritism over Jews.
                Before Christ Gentiles could come to God through Israel. Their forgiveness was based on Christ's redemption.
                When Christ came Gentiles could believe on his name as well as the Jews.
                When Christ revealed the gospel of grace both Jew and Gentile could be freely justified by faith.
                In the future kingdom when Christ returns, Gentiles can come to God through Israel once again.
                The whole world could always be saved through Christ.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Child of God View Post

                  And Jesus was received by the Jews with great rejoicing, the Jews made Jesus their King, repented of their sins toward God, What else?

                  I bring this up because you say BUT PAUL was rejected by the Jews.

                  We all know the Jews Made Jesus their King, Correct?

                  The Jews made Jesus KING OF THE Jews, but Paul was rejected by the Jews.

                  Is that what you are arguing?
                  John the baptizer came to prepare the way for Jesus. Jesus wouldn't have come until the Jews repented of their sins.

                  John the baptizer prepared the way for Jesus. He came preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins (Luke 1:76-80).

                  Malachi 3:1
                  "Behold, I will send My messenger, who will prepare the way before Me. Then the Lord whom you seek will suddenly come to His temple--the Messenger of the covenant, in whom you delight--see, He is coming," says the LORD of Hosts.


                  Matthew 3:3
                  This is he who was spoken of through the prophet Isaiah: "A voice of one calling in the wilderness, 'Prepare the way for the Lord, make straight paths for Him.'"

                  Isaiah 40:3
                  A voice of one calling: "Prepare the way for the LORD in the wilderness; make a straight highway for our God in the desert.


                  The people who repented of their sins were those Jews who believed Jesus was the Messiah.

                  There were Jews who had faith in God and knew Jesus was the King for whom they waited:

                  John 12:13
                  Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.


                  John the baptizer prepared the way for Jesus by having the people repent of their sins.

                  We all have to repent of our sins to prepare the way for Jesus to live in our hearts.

                  We see that Jesus taught the same to repent of sins, and the apostle Paul did too.

                  John the baptizer:

                  Luke 3:8 Therefore produce fruit worthy of repentance. And do not begin to say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' For I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.

                  Jesus:

                  Mark 1:14 After the arrest of John, Jesus went into Galilee and proclaimed the gospel of God. 15“The time is fulfilled,” He said, “and the kingdom of God is near. Repent and believe in the gospel!”

                  Apostle Paul:

                  Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and then to the Gentiles, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and demonstrate their repentance by their deeds.


                  Same one and only gospel that saves--- repent of your sins and believe.


                  Apostle Paul preaches the same gospel as John the baptizer and Jesus Christ himself.
                  Paul is concerned that some of the Corinthians might not really be saved because they did not repent of their sins.
                  2 Corinthians 12:21 I am afraid that when I come again my God will humble me before you, and I will be grieved over many who have sinned earlier and have not repented of the impurity, sexual sin and debauchery in which they have indulged.
                  Oh how I love the Word of God!

                  Don't just hear the word and believe it---do it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Child of God View Post

                    The Word of God in the Scriptures very much disagrees with you.
                    According to the Scriptures the Jews did not have have faith in God.

                    You are seeing things that are not in Scripture.



                    Paul was a charlatan.




                    Paul could not hold his own against a well informed Jew concerning the Scripture.
                    So Paul decided he would go where they had not heard the Scripture.


                    YET THE DISCIPLES MADE CONVERTS DAILY. in Jerusalem.
                    You say such untruthful things. You speak against the Holy Bible.
                    Oh how I love the Word of God!

                    Don't just hear the word and believe it---do it.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by beloved57 View Post
                      Douge


                      Yes, speaking of Gods Sheep all over the World, both jew and gentile Sheep
                      Jesus tells us how to become sheep.
                      Oh how I love the Word of God!

                      Don't just hear the word and believe it---do it.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by DougE View Post

                        Before Christ Gentiles could come to God through Israel. Their forgiveness was based on Christ's redemption.
                        When Christ came Gentiles could believe on his name as well as the Jews.
                        When Christ revealed the gospel of grace both Jew and Gentile could be freely justified by faith.
                        In the future kingdom when Christ returns, Gentiles can come to God through Israel once again.
                        The whole world could always be saved through Christ.
                        When Jesus came, it was to the Jews who already belonged to God by faith.

                        Jesus says when he is crucified, then all could come to him to be saved.

                        The new covenant which was about faith that Jesus blood washes away your sins wasn't in force until Jesus shed his blood on the cross.

                        Jesus is the Lamb of God. The lamb's blood had to be shed for forgiveness of sins.

                        No such thing as saved Gentiles while Jesus walked the earth. Jesus had to die and the Gentiles had to repent of their sins and believe.
                        Oh how I love the Word of God!

                        Don't just hear the word and believe it---do it.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by God's Truth View Post

                          Jesus tells us how to become sheep.
                          Thats in your imagination
                          "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
                          preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
                          called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
                          a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

                          Charles Spurgeon !

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by beloved57 View Post
                            Douge
                            Yes, speaking of Gods Sheep all over the World, both jew and gentile Sheep
                            Gentiles are never referred to as sheep in the Bible.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by beloved57 View Post

                              Thats in your imagination
                              Is that your way of saying please tell how to become a sheep according to Jesus?

                              How are Gentiles, Canaanites, Samaritans, Greeks, etc, saved if they don't become sheep?

                              Jesus called some none Jews 'dogs' and 'pigs'.

                              The Jews when disobedient were called 'heifers'.

                              We have to be like sheep to be saved.

                              We become like sheep when we follow Jesus around and want him more than anything. We have to humble ourselves and be ready to do what ever Jesus wants us to do. We have to have faith and repent of our sins, and call on him to help, just like a child


                              Matthew 15

                              The Faith of a Canaanite Woman

                              21Leaving that place, Jesus withdrew to the region of Tyre and Sidon. 22A Canaanite woman from that vicinity came to him, crying out, “Lord, Son of David, have mercy on me! My daughter is demon-possessed and suffering terribly.”

                              23Jesus did not answer a word. So his disciples came to him and urged him, “Send her away, for she keeps crying out after us.”

                              24He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.”

                              25The woman came and knelt before him. “Lord, help me!” she said.

                              26He replied, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs.”

                              27“Yes it is, Lord,” she said. “Even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their master’s table.”



                              Not all Israelites had faith in God, for obeying the law did NOT have to do with faith, see Galatians 3:12.

                              Romans 11:32 For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

                              Romans 11:19 You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in."



                              The Jews who were not sheep, they were bound over to the same place as the Gentiles.

                              Do you really think that ANY cut off Jews were sheep?

                              Do you really think that any Gentiles were sheep?

                              The cut off non sheep were put with the Gentiles.


                              We have to become sheep to get saved.
                              Last edited by God's Truth; February 13th, 2020, 01:02 PM.
                              Oh how I love the Word of God!

                              Don't just hear the word and believe it---do it.

                              Comment

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