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U.S. Christian Population in Freefall

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  • #46
    "9/11 was the worst thing that could have happened for religion at large. Young adults grew up after the tragedy seeing radical religious fundamentalism for the hate mongering, violent, divisiveness it prides itself upon....and they're not having it. We're slowly growing out of its pathetic grasp (indoctrination) on society."

    Remember though that "radical religious fundamentalism" is dispensationalism, and TOL is said to be run by dispensationalists.

    In dispensationalism, though there are somewhat different varieties of the theology, the starting postulate of dispensationalism is the statement by Lewis S. Chafer that "Israel is an eternal nation, heir to an eternal land, with an eternal kingdom, on which David rules from an eternal throne so that in eternity, '...never the twain, Israel and church, shall meet." Lewis S. Chafer, Systematic Theology (Dallas, Dallas Seminary Press, 1975), Vol. 4. pp. 315-323..

    Dispensationalism makes a separation between saved Jews and Saved Gentiles, which opposes the doctrine in the New Testament that there is a unity between saved Gentiles and saved Jews. This is a serious and important departure from New Testament doctrine.

    See Ephesians 2: 11-22

    In Galatians 3: 28, for example, Paul uses one verse to state the New Testament doctrine that saved Jews and saved Gentiles are united as one body of the elect. But in Ephesians 2, he uses verses 13 to 22 to spell out in more detail how saved Jews and saved Gentiles are united in one body.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by The Barbarian View Post
      The noisiest and most prominent people claiming to be Christians are often the least likely to act as Christians. And they are driving decent people away from the faith.
      Barbarian is always touting his "observations" and demanding that things be his way.
      Where is the evidence for a global flood?
      E≈mc2
      "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

      "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
      -Bob B.

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by JudgeRightly View Post
        Who was it that warned people of His own followers?
        Yes. No doubt he'd clean the temple of evangelicals who have chosen corruption over Him.

        Who was it that warned people that the majority was wicked (as a rule of thumb)?
        None are truly good. He had harsh words for those who sat in the front of the congregation and thanked God that they were not sinners like other men. And he had praise for those who sat in the back and said "Lord, have mercy upon me, a sinner."

        Until such time as He chooses to give us a theocracy (rather than a government of men, who claim to speak for God), we much govern ourselves as best we can. As our founders noted, democracy is far better than an autocrat or a ruling elite. And they pointed out that a ruling elite, claiming to be ruling in God's name is worse than anything.

        Who is Truth?

        Jesus is.
        Then follow him, instead of the Pharisees, whom he offended constantly.

        If what you teach about spiritual truth doesn't offend, then in all likelihood it isn't truth.
        It offended you, for example. Maybe that's an important clue for you.

        Not to say that everything one says should always offend, but when it comes to the Bible, God, and Christianity, it should be offensive to anyone not in line with them.
        Do you think the woman caught in adultery was in line with them? Do you think Jesus offended her, or the mob seeking to stone her to death?

        Do you think He offended Zacchaeus, who was a traitor and a tax collector? He came to comfort the afflicted and to afflict the comfortable. Pick a side, and stay with it.

        It's why people like yourself and Arthur and Town and more hate what fundamentalists like myself,
        Many fundamentalists are good and decent Christians. Don't indict all of them for what a relatively few Pharisees do.

        The Truth is offensive to you, because you don't want to have it His way. You're not yet lost, because you're struggling against His will, instead of ignoring it. That means you do see the way, even if you're not yet willing to submit to it.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by The Barbarian View Post
          The problem for America, is that the noisiest and most prominent people claiming to be Christians are often the least likely to act as Christians.

          And they are driving decent people away from the faith.
          Indeed ... unfortunately it’s the loud and most hypocritical (such as Jerry Falwell Jr. and most of the GOP) who have received the public platform.
          TRUST
          is a fragile thing.

          Easy to break, Easy to lose
          and one of the hardest things to
          ever get back.







          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by The Barbarian View Post

            Many fundamentalists are good and decent Christians.

            maybe you should focus on this more often, instead of being a trolling jerk always trying to see how much you can get away with before getting banned

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Rusha View Post
              Indeed ... unfortunately it’s the loud and most hypocritical (such as Jerry Falwell Jr....


              who?

              Comment


              • #52
                They're now trolling themselves...

                Comment


                • #53
                  Barbarian celebrates the rise in the popularity of Darwinism, then winners why Americans who identify as Christians are declining.
                  Where is the evidence for a global flood?
                  E≈mc2
                  "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

                  "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
                  -Bob B.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by JudgeRightly View Post
                    Who was it that warned people of His own followers?

                    Who was it that warned people that the majority was wicked (as a rule of thumb)?

                    Oh that's right.

                    Jesus did both of those things.

                    Who was it that is called the Rock of Offense?

                    Jesus is.

                    Who is Truth?

                    Jesus is.

                    If what you teach about spiritual truth doesn't offend, then in all likelihood it isn't truth. Not to say that everything one says should always offend, but when it comes to the Bible, God, and Christianity, it should be offensive to anyone not in line with them.

                    It's why people like yourself and Arthur and Town and more hate what fundamentalists like myself, ok doser, Stripe, Clete, Right Divider, etc, have to say about what the Bible says, because the Truth is inherently offensive.
                    Well, if TH notices this then he can answer for himself but as for myself, I don't "hate" what you and certain others have to say about certain matters as it's pretty much predictable and expected in some ways.

                    To borrow your own often adopted phrase, "Saying it doesn't make it so" JR. Fundamentalism doesn't equal Christianity for a start and you certainly don't have a monopoly of what constitutes biblical truth by any stretch. You can believe that the Genesis account is a rigidly literal account of creation with no leeway for any other interpretation and deny any science (pretty much all of it) in the process. That isn't truth in itself. It's the result of a dogmatic belief system that nobody else is obliged to give credence to.

                    You can believe that the whole of society should be subject to the laws that you would personally wish to see enacted via a "constitutional monarchy" or whatever derived through lots drawn for a king. That's just your belief, it's not truth and the obvious drawbacks and flaws for that have already been pointed out. If the person drawn via a throw of some dice or equivalent is opposed to such a state then they don't even have to do anything and can even voice opposition.

                    Essentially, you and the more zealous proponents of fundamentalism may well be vocal and whatnot but anyone outside of that doesn't take it particularly seriously, much like a "Chick tract" in essence.

                    Out of the list of people above, then doser has been on long term ignore, his trolling became boring a long time back. If the rules hadn't changed then he'd still be on with his demented obsession with TH most likely. Stripe just goes on about "evolutionists" & Darwinist's" with the same tedious tropes. Clete, I don't agree in the main with although I have little to do with and RD just seemed to get more irate with anything to do with science, at least anything that discredited any notion of a young universe/earth.

                    AFAIC, fundamentalism has more in common with legalism than it does with actual Christianity.
                    Well this is fun isn't it?

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by eider View Post
                      In the UK some churches are rising.... increasing.
                      But they are founded upon a bible that promotes love, understanding and a community which welcomes a wide range of hearts and minds.

                      I have experienced some Christians who claim to be sickened when they see words like 'love' or 'understanding' and I reckon that these kinds of Christianity are the ones that are shocking the people far away from the name 'Christianity'.
                      Well, not to say that all of fundamentalism is aligned with the likes of Jack Chick as it isn't, but it's only the more extreme elements of fundamentalism where the likes of his tracts would become acceptable reading as they were in a former church that I was in. That's not to say that everyone in that church endorsed them because thankfully there were plenty that didn't.
                      Well this is fun isn't it?

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Arthur Brain View Post
                        ... doser has been on long term ignore ...

                        "... because i got frustrated by always being bested by his logic and reasoning when all I could come up with was emotional arguments"

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          There seems to be a lot of debate about fundamentalism and this being the cause of the decline of Christianity. I wonder if this is even a major factor? I can only speak to my personal experience. I didn't accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior until I was 30 years old. And Christian fundamentalism had nothing to do with me denying Jesus Christ. And I graduated from a college that is often referred to the largest "Christian secular college" in the nation. By this I mean that my university was/is not a religious or Christian college but has a huge Christian student presence. So I knew many Christians in college. And their behavior was not the reason I rejected Jesus Christ. The reason I rejected Christ was because I love my sins more. I loved to have fun, drink lots of booze, sleep with women who were not my wife, and I believed homosexuality and abortion were ok. My own pride blinded to the reality of God. But the LORD never gave up on me. He kept sending Christian after Christian into my life to share the Gospel and love on me. I still remember one time I got into a long winded debate about creation vs evolution in my dorm room. I had this huge color poster of a T-Rex on my wall. This guy came into my room, looked at the poster, and we got into a debate. Haha. I thought it was strange that he he would just start talking about God and his creation. I didn't agree with him that day but it stuck with me for years. So I guess what I am saying in the end it not what other people did but my own pride and sinful heart that kept me from the LORD.
                          Last edited by The Berean; October 28th, 2019, 01:37 AM.
                          Your problem is not technology. The problem is YOU. You lack the will to change...You treat this planet as you treat each other. - Klaatu

                          What are you talking about? There is no such thing as the "Mafia"......it doesn't exist. Just a bunch of lies told to defame honest hardworking Italians like myself. - TomO

                          I will do you, let's see, goofy, wacky, and to the left side of the bell curve
                          . -Ktoyou

                          I'm white. I'm not black. I can't convert to being black. It doesn't matter how much I want to become black. I could listen to rap and date fat white women all day; for all that, I'll still remain white.- Traditio

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by The Berean View Post
                            The reason I rejected Christ was because I love my sins more. I loved to have fun, drink lots of booze, sleep with women who were not my wife, and I believed homosexuality and abortion were ok.

                            and increasingly, in the churches, it's in the fundamentalist wing that you'll find people who will still believe those things are wrong, wrong not only for you but for everyone you touch, everyone to whom you matter

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by JudgeRightly View Post

                              It's why people like yourself and Arthur and Town and more hate what fundamentalists like myself, ok doser, Stripe, Clete, Right Divider, etc, have to say about what the Bible says, because the Truth is inherently offensive.
                              No, and once again with emphasis, specifically in regards to your "buddy" who you'll routinely give a high five to no matter what he says or trolls about as you did with his "response" to me here. By his own admission he gets on better with Sherman when they have nothing to do with each other. I could tell you why but I'll leave it to you to fill in those particular blanks. I've taken him off ignore for this response only so I'd ask you not to advertise him as an illustrious example of fundamentalism or anything else in future, at least in regards as for me to take seriously.

                              Originally posted by ok doser View Post
                              "... because i got frustrated by always being bested by his logic and reasoning when all I could come up with was emotional arguments"

                              Nope, you've never bested anyone unless it's as the poster who's been banned more than anyone else. In that case you have a pretty much unassailable record along with usernames probably...

                              I just got bored of you doser, like many others who were on the receiving end of your bitter shtick. Your constant obsession with posters has been unhinged, especially with Barb and then just even more completely off the scale with Town Heretic. Knight once kicked you into touch with that on threat of a permanent ban if you didn't knock it off. You still tried to keep it going because he outwitted you at every given turn, not that it took very much considering. Then there was your crass "looking forward to seeing Rusha burn in hell posts" and "annabananahead" garbage when she dismantled you and called you for what you are on a regular basis...

                              Tiresome at every turn. You're straight back on ignore and feel free to drive by as you will, sad though that actually is.

                              Well this is fun isn't it?

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by ok doser View Post
                                and increasingly, in the churches, it's in the fundamentalist wing that you'll find people who will still believe those things are wrong, wrong not only for you but for everyone you touch, everyone to whom you matter
                                It seems odd...are there Christians who longer believe sin is sin? I get that the world at large is a dark wicked place where anything goes. But Christians should know better. Well, the one that actually read their Bible do.
                                Your problem is not technology. The problem is YOU. You lack the will to change...You treat this planet as you treat each other. - Klaatu

                                What are you talking about? There is no such thing as the "Mafia"......it doesn't exist. Just a bunch of lies told to defame honest hardworking Italians like myself. - TomO

                                I will do you, let's see, goofy, wacky, and to the left side of the bell curve
                                . -Ktoyou

                                I'm white. I'm not black. I can't convert to being black. It doesn't matter how much I want to become black. I could listen to rap and date fat white women all day; for all that, I'll still remain white.- Traditio

                                Comment

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