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  • #16
    Originally posted by Angel's Girl View Post
    Well, some people die in the hospitals and then are resuscitated and come back,
    If they're dead, they don't come back.

    If they're resuscitated, then they didn't die to begin with, it just means that their body parts stopped working, and the doctors were able to get them working again.

    Their heart stopped?

    The heart is a pump. It's easy to fix a pump.

    All (and yes, I mean ALL) brain activity ceased (ie, no ecg

    do you not believe that in that moment of truly being dead, you can at least see Jesus before Judgement and Him send you back and that really be the source of resuscitation.
    "It is appointed unto man once to die..."

    Seems pretty clear to me.

    There are people who can prophesy.
    Prophesying is simply speaking the truth to someone.

    It's not fortune telling (which is also fraudulent).

    Those people are shown or told things by God.
    Next time you hear someone say something along the lines of, "What I say comes straight from God, you should listen to what I say," do one of two things, preferably both.

    1) Ask them why God didn't just tell you directly, and why He had to use them to tell you.

    2) Ask them to sign a document that says that if their 'prophecy' doesn't come to pass, that they give you permission to kill them. Because that's what happened to people who falsely claimed to be God's prophets, AG.

    If God can do anything,
    God can do anything He wants to do. He cannot do the impossible.

    don't you believe that he can bring these people back even after they have have passed on because it wasn't really their time?
    "It is appointed unto man ONCE to die..."

    Seems like God has already determined that every man should only die once. Why would He go back on His word for only a few individuals?

    Or to warn people who are turning away?
    Jesus Himself addressed this through the story of Lazarus and the Rich Man. Luke 16:29-31

    There are people on YouTube that make their own videos about their experiences and never go on any shows or anything. These people who will never get paid by their story because they don't have enough subscribers because in order to start getting paid by YouTube for your videos, you must reach X amount of subscribers. There are people who are just telling their stories hoping someone will hear.
    And? They've been deceived, and are now spreading the same falsehood as the ones who deceived them.

    It's a very easy thing to do.

    Also...

    "Don't believe everything you read on the internet" - Abraham Lincoln



    Even if you don't believe that these people are telling the truth
    I believe that they think they're telling the truth, that they are being sincere in what they say.

    or really died,
    If they died, they wouldn't be talking.

    Absent from the body, present with the Lord (or in Hell, if they ultimately rejected God).

    then they still teach about the bible to maybe someone who is listening. Someone out there, unlike you, might believe it and turn heir faith to God.
    People get saved through Benny Hinn's ministry as well.

    Doesn't make him any less of a fraud for selling miracles.

    Also, try adding the rest of the verse. Its talking about how Christ was a man who will come back again. Therefore not just dying and that's it, or dying and then Judgement.

    So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation. -Hebrews 9:28
    I don't know about you, but all the people who claim to have come back from the dead still sin.

    Which invalidates their claim to begin with.

    So guess that theory's out the window then...

    Jesus was a man
    He was also God, and raised Himself from the dead.

    Something that normal people can't do, and certainly none of the ones who claim they've come back from the dead.

    who after 3 days came back to warn people and show that he was still alive and even still a man.
    "Still alive?"

    And what, perchance, happened to Israel after He came back from the dead?

    Did they ultimately accept or reject their risen Messiah?

    (He still had a physical body)
    And? To interact with a physical world, one needs a physical body.

    Do you think that if he wanted to, give that gift to some people?
    I think speculating about that is pointless.

    Let's stick to what the Bible actually says.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by JudgeRightly View Post

      I don't know about you, but all the people who claim to have come back from the dead still sin.

      Which invalidates their claim to begin with.
      Your splitting my words apart.
      and really? Jesus came back from the dead... Did he sin? No
      The Giant Panda has an unusual paw, with a "thumb" and five fingers; the "thumb" is actually a modified wrist-bone.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by JudgeRightly View Post

        Let's stick to what the Bible actually says.
        I will, and I also know what is right and wrong. So you can tell me whatever. I learn my way and you learn yours. We are both sinners yes, but if you state you are a Christian and believe what the bible says, then I will meet you in Heaven when the time comes. There's no use on trying to argue with me and tell me that what I watch is false. I have family members who have been told by God that it is true. People do have relationships with God and can hear him. You can't tell me I'm wrong about that, because there are PLENTY of instances in the Bible. I know what I read and watch, if you don't agree, you don't have to watch, but there's no point in trying to change my mind, because even if these people are fraudulent, they state things that are right in the bible. So whether you agree or not, if a person is faithless, they might watch one and turn towards faith.
        The Giant Panda has an unusual paw, with a "thumb" and five fingers; the "thumb" is actually a modified wrist-bone.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Angel's Girl View Post
          Your splitting my words apart.
          Don't worry about it. Your thread is on near death experiences, so where that "death" line is drawn doesn't really matter. It happens that some come to the Lord when they are near death....for some it takes that long, and something that drastic. It's still that "Aha" moment in a person's life when they come before the throne of Grace. It's actually called sharing your testimony, and our testimonies come in a wide variety of forms.

          It's easy to dismiss some things we hear, but it seems a bit foolish to do so. I know what happened to me when I first came into the light...it wasn't during some near death experience, but it was very dramatic to me. I didn't watch all those videos, but I really liked the second one. Good thread Angel's girl.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by glorydaz View Post
            Don't worry about it. Your thread is on near death experiences, so where that "death" line is drawn doesn't really matter. It happens that some come to the Lord when they are near death....for some it takes that long, and something that drastic. It's still that "Aha" moment in a person's life when they come before the throne of Grace. It's actually called sharing your testimony, and our testimonies come in a wide variety of forms.

            It's easy to dismiss some things we hear, but it seems a bit foolish to do so. I know what happened to me when I first came into the light...it wasn't during some near death experience, but it was very dramatic to me. I didn't watch all those videos, but I really liked the second one. Good thread Angel's girl.
            Thank you.
            The Giant Panda has an unusual paw, with a "thumb" and five fingers; the "thumb" is actually a modified wrist-bone.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Angel's Girl View Post
              That is amazing! I'm so fascinated with these experiences cause 1. they answer some questions we have even after we have read the bible, and 2. they show us the wonders of God that we can't imagine.
              I saw that there are no secrets in front of God; in Heaven everyone knows your thoughts and you know theirs. It's amazing. The experience tore down walls I didn't know I had between God and myself. I watched as I left my body in the prayer room at our church and The Holy Spirit was using my body for worship, singing FAR more beautifully than I've ever heard a human sing, a love song to Jesus and there were several ladies in the prayer room who would then sing the chorus and it spoke of what I was about to see and helped me to understand what I saw when I got there. I knew as I was going up that it was only for a few minutes but it seemed like time didn't matter while I was there. I had been in that prayer room hundreds of times and I always pace around the room when I pray there. I walked past one particular spot in that room every single time I was there but could never step there for some reason. That night, I knew that it was time to stop and stand there, when I did: my journey began. It was in-describable.
              "That man of sin must first be revealed." -- Jesus

              If you haven't tried: you've already failed. -- Aimiel

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              • #22
                One of the most gripping and detailed NDE's I've ever read is the book by Mary Katherine Baxter: "Divine Revelation of Hell." She was taken into hell every night for 30 nights by Jesus to be able to write about it and it is truly remarkable. Quotes below are from visions she received after her experiences.


                “A large machine was brought into an office. The beast put his mark on it, and his voice came out of it. There was also a “big brother” machine that could see into homes and businesses. Only a single machine of this type existed, and it belonged to the beast. The part of the machine that was located in the homes of the people was invisible to the naked eye, but it could and did report to the beast every move the people made. I watched as the beast turned his throne around and faced toward me. On his forehead was the number 666.”

                ― Mary K. Baxter, A Divine Revelation of Hell

                “The beast took the angry man into a large room and motioned for him to lie down on a table. The room and the table reminded me of a hospital emergency room. The man was given an anesthesia and wheeled beneath a vast machine. The beast attached wires to the man’s head and turned on the machine. On the top of the machine were the words, “This mind eraser belongs to the beast, 666.” When the man was removed from the table, his eyes had a vacant stare, and his movements reminded one of a zombie in a movie. I saw a large blank spot on the top of his head, and I knew his mind had been surgically altered so he could be controlled by the beast.”
                ― Mary K. Baxter, A Divine Revelation of Hell
                "That man of sin must first be revealed." -- Jesus

                If you haven't tried: you've already failed. -- Aimiel

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                • #23
                  Hey Berean, haven't seen you around much!

                  Originally posted by The Berean View Post
                  Wait, wut? The Bible doesn't have examples of people dying and being resurrected?
                  I never said it didn't.

                  Berean, when you teach a rule, do you give every exception to the rule every time you mention the rule? No, of course not. You give the rule, and then when it's applicable you provide the exceptions.

                  "Dead men remain dead" is the rule.

                  People being raised from the dead is the exception.

                  However, what's being discussed here are not "exceptions," but rather frauds, and/or those who have believed fraudulent claims now spreading those same claims.

                  The Bible has ten examples of people who were actually 100% dead and came back from the dead.

                  Elijah prays and a Dead Boy's is Resurrected (1 Kings 17:17-24)

                  Elisha Raises the Shunammite's Son (2 Kings 4:18-37)

                  Elisha's Bones Resurrects an Israelite Man (2 Kings 13:20–21)

                  Jesus Raises a Widow's Son (Luke 7:11-17)

                  Jesus resurrects Jairus' Daughter (Luke 8:49-56)

                  Lazarus (John 11:1-44)

                  Resurrection of Jesus (The Gospels)

                  Saints of Jerusalem (Matthew 27:50-54)

                  Peter Prays and Tabitha is Resurrected (Acts 9:36-42)

                  Eutychus Raised from the Dead by Paul (Acts 20:7-12)
                  As I said above, miracles (namely, those appointed by God to do miracles raising the dead) are the exception to the rule.

                  However, not even in Benny Hinn's ministry do you see people being raised from the dead.

                  My point was that people do not come back to life if they're dead, though to be fair, there's more to it than just "the dead don't rise."

                  Now, none of these examples discuss any trip to heaven or hell while dead other than Jesus I believe.
                  Agreed.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    I agree resurrections are the exception to the rule. But God can bring anyone back to life if he chooses to even today. I have never seen this happen personally. But I know two people who swear they have seen it happen. And these are people whom I trust and have known for over 20 years. They are not prone to make up stories or lie to me. I do agree there are lot of frauds out there.
                    Your problem is not technology. The problem is YOU. You lack the will to change...You treat this planet as you treat each other. - Klaatu

                    What are you talking about? There is no such thing as the "Mafia"......it doesn't exist. Just a bunch of lies told to defame honest hardworking Italians like myself. - TomO

                    I will do you, let's see, goofy, wacky, and to the left side of the bell curve
                    . -Ktoyou

                    I'm white. I'm not black. I can't convert to being black. It doesn't matter how much I want to become black. I could listen to rap and date fat white women all day; for all that, I'll still remain white.- Traditio

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by The Berean View Post
                      I agree resurrections are the exception to the rule. But God can bring anyone back to life if he chooses to even today.
                      Of course He could!

                      I have never seen this happen personally. But I know two people who swear they have seen it happen. And these are people whom I trust and have known for over 20 years. They are not prone to make up stories or lie to me.
                      I'm not questioning their sincerity.

                      I'm questioning the veracity of their claim.

                      Someone can be sincere when they tell someone something that is untrue. They may think they're telling the truth, but the facts may contradict their claims.

                      I do agree there are lot of frauds out there.


                      My point is that (at least since the point at which God stopped doing miracles through His people in the Bible), while some may claim that they've seen or experienced coming back from the dead, or that they've "been to heaven/hell," It's better to look at the facts, and that includes scripture, which says that the dead do not return from being dead, and that people who experience heaven/hell have not.

                      The rule is that people do not come back from the dead, and since the only exception is God intervening, and since God isn't currently in the business of intervening, it would be safest to assume that claims of coming back from the dead or visits to heaven/hell are nothing but attention seeking, fraud, or people having been deceived by the former two.

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                      • #26
                        NDE's and the Afterlife...................

                        ~*~*~

                        I recommend a more comprehensive and universal study and science on NDE's and the Afterlife on Kevin Williams site here - NDE's and the Afterlife

                        While what was shared earlier may have some meaningful aspects or insights into NDE's from a limited 'Christian' perspective, a more universal approach is recommended IMO, taking into account many years of NDE studies, studies about consciousness, reflecting universal laws and principles. In all the science and data....certain universal principles hold, therefore provide guidelines and rules the govern the soul's progress and evolution both here and in the afterlife.

                        We pretty much co-create our own 'heaven' or 'hell' by our thoughts, words and actions, and this continues to be the case, as long as our thoughts, words and actions condition or effect our experience, since all 'action' (karma) must produce its effects, - such is the law of cause, effect, consequence, compensation, retribution, etc. Back to universal laws.

                        This by the way does not 'take away' or 'diminish' your own 'brand' of 'religion', but will in fact enhance/empower it....by facilitating the practice of true religion (see James on that). There's always more to learn.


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