Why would God need a hell?

[KingdomRose]

You can cut the ambiblical cord and ignore where you came from; but history has already been recorded; modern day Christianity came from the Roman Catholic church. Like butterfly from Pupi, Christianity was born in Rome. And it still reeks of Roman paganism; still has all kinds of residue from paganism and psychology in its bloodstream.

Very true. That is why JWs don't call themselves "Protestant." They did not come from an offshoot of Catholicism. They go all the way back to the first congregations that were disciples of Christ in the first century.

 

[Mickiel]

Very true. JWs are strong enough to go out into the neighborhoods the world over and tell people the truth about Satan's lies, and people hate us for it. Satan has most of the world under his thumb. And he hates JWs with a purple passion. He makes sure we are the target of people's venom and hate, but we go on giving a witness anyway. (Matthew 24:14)

You know, I am not a Jehovah's Witness, and I am not Christian, so my time here is perhaps short, because I hold no need to protect any religion, or to stand up for a religion. I personally don't think God or Christ are religious beings; I really don't. God is not a Christian, and he is not a Jehovah's witness; in fact I don't view God as being anything human at all. God is not black or white, he is not Islamic or Indian, God is not German ; he is not cultural or traditional, he is not skin and bones , and he is not a male or a female gender.

But I understand that every human group or religion, wants to claim God as their own. We want to make God in our image, because we don't understand what being in his image means. We like being selfish with Christ and God, we want them for ourselves! We make ourselves " Special" by owning God unto our group, and now we are " The anointed." The " Elect!" The " Chosen."

And once we think we get into that area, what's the first thing that we do?

We start putting other people and other groups out! We start closing the doors of salvation on each other. We create doctrines that punish others forever, or kill them forever!

And for some reason, nobody sees anything wrong with this.

 

[KingdomRose]

Would you put yourself in your version of hell? Or would you find a way of escape for your self? Do you love your neighbor enough to save them from your hell? Do you love your neighbor like you love yourself? Eph. 5:14.

If Christians think hell is the future of unbelievers, why aren't they giving their whole hearted effort to save those people? Good thing the salvation of unbelievers is not up to believers. Besides, if I was a god and I set up salvation as a " Human witnessing to human thingy", I would have chosen the Jehovah's Witnesses , because they hustle door to door; if I wanted to condemn much of humanity, I would have chosen Christianity to do that job.

EXCELLENT POINTS!!! There are many here who believe I am going to "hell" because I'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses. Yet do they try to kindly reason with me? NO! Nary a one! They just say *%$# off. And people in their homes say, "I'm Catholic (or whatever) and I'm not interested!" and they shut the door! Nobody tries to "save" us from "hell."

As a last thought....whenever anyone comes to my door to talk about their beliefs, I invite them right in. I am interested in learning why they believe what they believe and what they think of other points of view.:idea: (I hope that they might see some merit in what I have to say.)

 

[Mickiel]

You can read in places in the bible where it says love not the world; its not talking about the people in those scriptures, its referring to the system of this world. But in John 3:16 it is referring to the people. A popular scripture, but the first 6 words are really ignored; " For God so loved the world!" This is the reason WHY God created humanity and had the bible written, and had his only Son killed! Because he Loves the world; or THE PEOPLE!

And NOT just those who worship him and believes in him, God LOVES ALL humans! And he Loves them SO much!

So very much.

God is not a separatist; he is not partial or selective ; God is Universal! His love is universal. And I maintain that the true gospel of salvation would be universal as well.

 

[KingdomRose]

Now, if eternal hell punishing is not real, than why can't so many different cultures and religions see that? Why would even different eras of God's own church miss it? Well that's what part of the meaning of " Deception" means; those who are being deceived, simply really don't know they are being deceived. Jesus in Matt. 24:24, " For there shall arise false prophets who shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch that if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect." Now Jesus did NOT say it was impossible for his elect to be deceived, he said " IF it were possible", and Rev.2:4, 2:14, 2:20, 3:15-20, definitely reveal churches of God, the elect, being deceived in various areas. This is not my opinion, read it for yourself.

Believers can't see the deception of eternal hell punishing, because they are deceived in that area; they can't see they are deceived! Its not in their conscious mind, something " Other than the truth" has entered; and nothing, " Nothing" can open a deceived mind other than God himself.

Its not the individuals fault; something FAR more powerful than man is at work here.

Why do so many believe in "hell" even though there is so much evidence against it? Because the religious leaders of the world LOVE it! It is a perfect way to control the masses of people by making them FEAR ending up in an eternal fire! And the people who figure out that it's a lie will often stay in that church or mosque or temple just because that's where their families have always been. They don't want to rock the boat. Also...there are those who love the idea of frying people just as much as the clergy does. They hope it's true! These are the sadists and the lovers of cruelty among us.

I agree....there's something VERY powerful at work here, and it's the good ole serpent, Satan the Devil.:devil:

 

[KingdomRose]

you are good people
I never pass up an opportunity to talk with you all

Thank you. You sound like a person with a good heart.

 

[serpentdove]

Modern day Christianity has been profoundly shaped by Greek paganism and Roman imperialism.

We study scripture :straight: to root out Greek pagan thought (Ac 17:11, 2 Co 10:5). oly:

The two witnesses will help to clear things up. Do you want them murdered? Will you jump for joy when their bodies lay dead on the ground? Re 11:7-10 :Shimei:

See:

Hermeneutics

 

[KingdomRose]

You know, I am not a Jehovah's Witness, and I am not Christian, so my time here is perhaps short, because I hold no need to protect any religion, or to stand up for a religion. I personally don't think God or Christ are religious beings; I really don't. God is not a Christian, and he is not a Jehovah's witness; in fact I don't view God as being anything human at all. God is not black or white, he is not Islamic or Indian, God is not German ; he is not cultural or traditional, he is not skin and bones , and he is not a male or a female gender.

But I understand that every human group or religion, wants to claim God as their own. We want to make God in our image, because we don't understand what being in his image means. We like being selfish with Christ and God, we want them for ourselves! We make ourselves " Special" by owning God unto our group, and now we are " The anointed." The " Elect!" The " Chosen."

And once we think we get into that area, what's the first thing that we do?

We start putting other people and other groups out! We start closing the doors of salvation on each other. We create doctrines that punish others forever, or kill them forever!

And for some reason, nobody sees anything wrong with this.

I accept the group thing because God has always had an organization on Earth to represent Him. That's His way. Nothing much can get done without order. He had the Jews for centuries, and then the Christian congregation. This is all borne out by Scripture, I'm not just saying it. The church that Jesus accepted was truly united and guided by a "governing body" in Jerusalem. When that was disbanded there was no center of worship, and soon apostate Christendom took over.

JWs don't go along with this because we want to be more special than everybody else. No....we see that this organization follows Christ's teachings to the letter, and we appreciate that. This organization is "no part of the world," and it teaches love of neighbor, even love of our enemies, therefore we will not learn to kill another human being along with the armed forces of any country. I know I detest the false teachings of other religions, but it is not because I want to feel superior to those people associated with them. It is because most religions are not representing the "truth," which is Christ. JWs actually want to make people aware of the truth so that these other people can be set free from lies and the burdens imposed on them by man-made doctrines.

 

[KingdomRose]

We study scripture :straight: to root out Greek pagan thought (Ac 17:11, 2 Co 10:5). oly:

The two witnesses will help to clear things up. Do you want them murdered? Will you jump for joy when their bodies lay dead on the ground? Re 11:7-10 :Shimei:

Ahem....The "two witnesses" are symbolic of something that happened about 90 years ago. They are not literal. They pictured something that happened back in the early 20th century when God's work had been brought temporarily to a halt after His organization's governing body had been put in prison (unjustly). They "came alive" again when the governing body was released from prison. Believe it or not. You'll be looking for "two witnesses" that die and then come back to life all in vain because the scripture has already been fulfilled.

:chuckle:

 

[Lon]

I think you misunderstand because you are identified with the enemy of the personality and you don't even know it.

:nono: According to you, I'm just one of those who doesn't need Jesus either because "we are all going to heaven." It is a fairy tale. A fantasy you choose to believe. I've seen the real monsters in the closet and the ones under the bed and the ones who would kill you for $5, no hesitancy whatsoever and no remorse. They are who they are and God would have to lobotomize them.....or send them to hell. You are foolish and unwise. You would NOT want me in heaven if I were without Christ. I would not have been but a monster, born of a monster. ONLY the Gospel of Jesus Christ saves.

Most people don't know any better.

You guys don't know any better. You all must have been raised in good neighborhoods or something.

We are not taught how to disidentify from the personality and identify with the eternal and infinite part of us.
In fact we have been conditioned by society and programmed since childhood to disregard our own internal divinity in favor of something else.

:nono: The monsters I know, others I ran across, would have killed my mother, my sister, my daughter, if their hands were not stayed. There is/was no repentance in them. There are monsters. Without Christ, I might have been one of them but that is the difference and that is the gospel, that few will find, just as scripture says.

This is a painful loss that hovers in the background of our lives and shows up as hatred and resentment toward ourselves and others.

I don't 'hate' them. I haven't the time for that. I'm happy they are behind bars and can no longer harm people I care about. You want to think they will be 'magically' transformed but that isn't going to happen without a lobotomy. The rich young man who was selfish and ignored Lazarus was told "if they won't believe, nothing can make them believe."

That is why there is so much hostility embedded in the world.

I don't hate the guy who stole my dying father's things when he couldn't get up and stop him. I just don't want to be around him. I don't hate the guy who tried to abduct my mother. I just don't want to be around him, and I want him where he can't hurt anybody else.

Many people have this compulsive need to make themselves feel better for not being able to feel their infinite worth by criticizing others, making them wrong and gaining approval from their peers.

Ah, so the victims are the bad guys....

These are substitutes for the value which we seek in our lives that is inside us already. There are no replacements for the infinite and eternal part of us however. This is what the story of Jesus points to but we are too stuck in trying to solidify someone else's version of the story and the true meaning is lost in favor of something easy and convenient.

So you blame the sheep and nurture the wolf and even join in the bleating, just now, right here, adding your voice of contention, just as I'm giving you now. I've no idea if you are one of the monsters, but I don't want to be anywhere near them. They'd kill your sister for the price of a measly can of beer or a quick fix.

The bottom line is that we are one with God. Notice how quickly the personality will bite of the tree of judgement in order to deny its own divinity.

Hitler was not one with god. There are monsters in this world.
Joh 3:15that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.
Joh 3:16"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Joh 3:18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
Joh 3:19And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil.
Joh 3:20For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed.
Joh 3:21But whoever does what is true comes to the light, so that it may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out in God."

You are calling God a liar.

Here is lack of self-worth staring us right in the face. The belief is that it can't be true because we are identified with feelings of hatred. We need to see and understand this and feel it in its fullness. Watch again how quickly the personality will deny it. It does not want to face the truth but the truth is what makes us free.

:nono: Monsters are monsters and they will not come to the light or learn to love it. They are wicked and do abominable things Psalm 14:1
Your good news is that the killer who killed a loved one, is going to be there, unrepentant, beside you and I, unrepentant.
Luk 16:27And he said, 'Then I beg you, father, to send him to my father's house—
Luk 16:28for I have five brothers—so that he may warn them, lest they also come into this place of torment.'
Luk 16:29But Abraham said, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.'
Luk 16:30And he said, 'No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent.'
Luk 16:31He said to him, 'If they do not hear Moses and the Prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead.'"

 

[serpentdove]

"Ahem....The "two witnesses" are symbolic of something that happened about 90 years ago..."

Ahem, Jehovah's Witness :listen: and you know that's not his name :Shimei: (See: Jehovah's False Witness). The two witness are sent to testify of the truth that Jesus was/is Moshiach (Re 11:7).

Did the children of Israel ever get a response from Moses as to his name?

Queue jeopardy theme (right click, open).

"...You'll be looking for "two witnesses" that die and then come back to life all in vain because the scripture has already been fulfilled."

Then you will need Re 11:3 to go away.

 

[serpentdove]

"Would you put yourself in your version of hell?"

It doesn't work that way (Ro 9:3).

"If Christians think hell is the future of unbelievers, why aren't they giving their whole hearted effort to save those people?"

:yawn: "We give out the word of God. oly: What men do with it is their business." ~ J. Vernon McGee Ge 3:12, Ro 1:20

"Good thing the salvation of unbelievers is not up to believers."

:yawn: "It's a good thing." ~ Martha Stewart

I'd have thrown you into hell already. :juggle: Lk 9:54, Ro 12:19, 2 Pe 3:9

"Besides, if I was a god [sic] and I set up salvation as a "human witnessing to human thingy", I would have chosen the Jehovah's Witnesses , because they hustle door to door; if I wanted to condemn much of humanity, I would have chosen Christianity to do that job."

:yawn: Jer 5:31, 2 Ti 4:3

 

[Timotheos]

It doesn't work that way (Ro 9:3).

:yawn: "We give out the word of God. oly: What men do with it is their business." ~ J. Vernon McGee Ge 3:12, Ro 1:20
:yawn: "It's a good thing." ~ Martha Stewart

I'd have thrown you into hell already. :juggle: Lk 9:54, Ro 12:19, 2 Pe 3:9
:yawn: Jer 5:31, 2 Ti 4:3

Why do you argue against what the Bible says?
Look at John 3:16 and tell me what it says in your Bible.

 

[serpentdove]

"...In Acts 17:28, " For in him we live, move and have our being; we are also his offspring!"

For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring [Acts 17:28].

"He does not call them sons of God but the offspring of God. He is referring to creation and the relationship to God through creation. By the way, this is not pantheism that he is stating here. He is not saying that everything is God. He says that in God we live and move and have our being but that God is beyond this created universe.

Paul quotes to them from their own poets. One of the poets he quoted was Arastus who lived about 270 A.D. He was a Stoic from Cilicia. He began a poem with an invocation to Zeus in which he said that “we too are his offspring.” Cleanthes was another poet who lived about 300 A.D. He also wrote a hymn to Zeus and speaks of the fact that “we are his offspring.” Paul means, of course, that we are God’s creatures." McGee, J. V. (1991). Thru the Bible commentary: Church History (Acts 15-28) (electronic ed., Vol. 41, p. 55). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.

"The creature."

~ Antonio Salieri, Amadeus

 

[Prizebeatz1]

:nono: According to you, I'm just one of those who doesn't need Jesus either because "we are all going to heaven." It is a fairy tale. A fantasy you choose to believe. I've seen the real monsters in the closet and the ones under the bed and the ones who would kill you for $5, no hesitancy whatsoever and no remorse. They are who they are and God would have to lobotomize them.....or send them to hell. You are foolish and unwise. You would NOT want me in heaven if I were without Christ. I would not have been but a monster, born of a monster. ONLY the Gospel of Jesus Christ saves.

You guys don't know any better. You all must have been raised in good neighborhoods or something.


:nono: The monsters I know, others I ran across, would have killed my mother, my sister, my daughter, if their hands were not stayed. There is/was no repentance in them. There are monsters. Without Christ, I might have been one of them but that is the difference and that is the gospel, that few will find, just as scripture says.

I don't 'hate' them. I haven't the time for that. I'm happy they are behind bars and can no longer harm people I care about. You want to think they will be 'magically' transformed but that isn't going to happen without a lobotomy. The rich young man who was selfish and ignored Lazarus was told "if they won't believe, nothing can make them believe."
I don't hate the guy who stole my dying father's things when he couldn't get up and stop him. I just don't want to be around him. I don't hate the guy who tried to abduct my mother. I just don't want to be around him, and I want him where he can't hurt anybody else.


Ah, so the victims are the bad guys....


So you blame the sheep and nurture the wolf and even join in the bleating, just now, right here, adding your voice of contention, just as I'm giving you now. I've no idea if you are one of the monsters, but I don't want to be anywhere near them. They'd kill your sister for the price of a measly can of beer or a quick fix.


Hitler was not one with god. There are monsters in this world.
Joh 3:15that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.
Joh 3:16"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Joh 3:18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
Joh 3:19And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil.
Joh 3:20For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed.
Joh 3:21But whoever does what is true comes to the light, so that it may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out in God."

You are calling God a liar.

:nono: Monsters are monsters and they will not come to the light or learn to love it. They are wicked and do abominable things Psalm 14:1
Your good news is that the killer who killed a loved one, is going to be there, unrepentant, beside you and I, unrepentant.
Luk 16:27And he said, 'Then I beg you, father, to send him to my father's house—
Luk 16:28for I have five brothers—so that he may warn them, lest they also come into this place of torment.'
Luk 16:29But Abraham said, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.'
Luk 16:30And he said, 'No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent.'
Luk 16:31He said to him, 'If they do not hear Moses and the Prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead.'"

I apologize if anything I said personally offends or insults you. That is not my intent. My intent is to turn our attention toward the infinite and eternal part of us because that is the beginning of awakening to the feeling of infinite worth. This is a very real thing that we must feel and know for our own good. The world is lost without it just as I was. There is a huge premium for the enemy to keep this information from us. Someone profits off of keeping us ignorant of our divinity. Notice the intensity with which the personality resists turning its attention toward the inside. It judges itself and the process as bad because of the way it feels. We need to be willing to let go of our concern with what others are doing or have done to us or others. That is a distraction from the salvation we feel when we turn towards the soul. It almost guarantees that we will never see the Kingdom. Don't worry about what others are thinking of doing. I know it's not easy as it seems it will add pain to what we already feel but I promise you it is the Way. It is easy to be deceived because it is so counter-intuitive.

 

[serpentdove]

"What the world needs now, and always has, is sweet love and salvation..."

...And a new Frank Sinatra. :think: Eph 2:8

"...and the religious are arguing over who receives salvation. Isn't that pitiful, humanity needs salvation, and believers in God are bickering over who gets it!"

:yawn: God saves the Jew and gentile still today. Jews believe I am. We believe I am he. Jn 8:24. God never replaced Israel. She’s only been blinded for our sake (Ro 11:25). Your welcome.

"In Haggai 2:7, " I will shake all nations, and the desire of all nations shall come!"

He's been doing that. Have you noticed? Mt 24:7 :juggle:

 

[serpentdove]

Now, if eternal hell punishing is not real, than why can't so many different cultures and religions see that? Why would even different eras of God's own church miss it?

We are in the Laodicean age (Rev. 1:11). This is not the time to be lukewarm. :vomit:

 

[Mickiel]

In John 3:35, " The Father loves the Son and has given ALL things into his hands."

Do you think this means all dogs and cats? Or animals? Does your religion give animals more chance of salvation than humans?

Do you think it means God has given all the grass and trees to Jesus?

It means ALL humans are in Jesus hands ; a place that condemning religions cannot snatch them out of.

 

[Mickiel]

We are in the Laodicean age (Rev. 1:11). This is not the time to be lukewarm. :vomit:

I disagree. We are not in any age for the church of God. And that could last years. But if I were to guess, or speculate, we are heading towards the Philadelpian age; they are not here yet, not in my view. This stage of God's church will have the least deception in it that all previous stages, and they will accomplish everything they set out to do. They will be stronger than any other church era. They will be wiser than all other church phases. And the deceived churches of the time, will KNOW that these people are the real church of God.

God may be preparing them even now. I only wish I live to meet them.

 

[WonderfulLordJesus]

Are you here again slandering our Lord Jesus? You're still clinging to the horrid idea that he teaches people that bad people are FRIED in a fire forever??? How can you say such awful things about sweet Jesus?

You responded to a post not one word of which was my own, rather the word of God from the Bible. It's always interesting, when you guys go into convulsions over scripture, when you fail to see you're railing against the Lord. This should say something to you. Should, anyway.

But thank you for the good laugh, to end the week with. You have me feeling joyful and generous, so here are the verses that warn of hell, again, also seeing that you didn't get it, the first time.

Luke 16:19-31 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day: and there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, and desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; and in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: for I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Matthew 13:40-42 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; and shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Matthew 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels... 46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Mark 9:42-48 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea. And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire: where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Revelation 14:9-11 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, the same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: and the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Here's some bonus verses for you that you, surely, love as well, though I do hope you don't blow a gasket.

John 1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
9 That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

Isaiah 9:6 For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.

John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

John 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.