Why would God need a hell?

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Mickiel

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well, isn't that special



Oh the treatment will be forced on humanity, when God returns humans are not going to be willing to submit to him , and a simple study of the bible will show that; but Christianity is showing something other than the truth. God will force humanity to submit; the results of God using that force is shown in Isaiah 45:23. The bible NOWHERE shows God " Asking humans will they submit" when he returns. They are not given any choices. But Christianity has messed that truth up, as they have many others.
 

Mickiel

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what do you think Christianity is showing that isn't the truth?

Lets just start with what you tried to show, that God will not force treatment on humanity. The bible shows that he will force treatment on humanity. God is going to destroy one third of all trees and all grass when he returns, Rev. 8:7; he will turn 1/3 of all seas into blood, he will destroy 1/3 of all the boats on the seas and 1/3 of all fish; 1/3 of all humans will be killed; and this is just the beginning of God's treatment of humanity; incredible force!
 

Mickiel

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you misunderstood me

God will not force healing on humanity

Yes he will force healing on humanity; the 7 Trumpets in the book of Revelations are awesome force from God, the reason WHY God is using that force, is to usher in his Kingdom and Peace; which will CAUSE the healing of humanity. I disagree with what you and your religion is teaching, that God will not force the healing of humanity. Yes he will, and its scripture!
 

Mickiel

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yes, that's nice

Its reality as I see it, Christianity is dead wrong about a lot of things, and dead blind to it. A third of this world are Christian, the greatest example of the blind leading the blind that I have ever witnessed. Christians think they are so right, they are totally unable to even see where they are wrong. Just this little example I showed you about yourself, will go absolutely nowhere; you will continue to spread that God will not force the healing of humanity.

Because its all you can see.
 

patrick jane

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Yes he will force healing on humanity; the 7 Trumpets in the book of Revelations are awesome force from God, the reason WHY God is using that force, is to usher in his Kingdom and Peace; which will CAUSE the healing of humanity. I disagree with what you and your religion is teaching, that God will not force the healing of humanity. Yes he will, and its scripture!
You have no idea what God's gonna do -
 

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
What about free will?

What about free will?

Lets just start with what you tried to show, that God will not force treatment on humanity. The bible shows that he will force treatment on humanity. God is going to destroy one third of all trees and all grass when he returns, Rev. 8:7; he will turn 1/3 of all seas into blood, he will destroy 1/3 of all the boats on the seas and 1/3 of all fish; 1/3 of all humans will be killed; and this is just the beginning of God's treatment of humanity; incredible force!

While I myself have some sentiment towards a more universalist perspective in some respects, we still have to consider here the issue of 'free will', for 'freedom of choice' is spoken of in the scriptures. From a 'conditional immortality' view,...souls may choose 'life' or 'death', since eternal life is a gift, so it appears it can be rejected, and ultimately rejected by those who undergo the "second death". I see that 'free will' is highly respected by God,....so if you propose that God will ultimately get his way with all souls (forcing upon them salvation or healing)...then you'd have to conclude by some way or manner that one's will is somehow converted to God's will, and that Love is ultimately an irresistible power, by which all souls must surrender at some point in time. I'm just probing your logic or perhaps a philosophical explanation of a 'forced healing', or an inevitable return to God,...which to me would be some kind of irresistible grace. While some passages (if you want to keep the subject within a 'biblical-context') seem to support universalism, others definitively support 'conditional immortality' (which includes the disintegration/destruction of the wicked). How do you deal with those, or evade the charge of merely 'cherry picking' verses? :)
 

Mickiel

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While I myself have some sentiment towards a more universalist perspective in some respects, we still have to consider here the issue of 'free will', for 'freedom of choice' is spoken of in the scriptures. From a 'conditional immortality' view,...souls may choose 'life' or 'death', since eternal life is a gift, so it appears it can be rejected, and ultimately rejected by those who undergo the "second death". I see that 'free will' is highly respected by God,....so if you propose that God will ultimately get his way with all souls (forcing upon them salvation or healing)...then you'd have to conclude by some way or manner that one's will is somehow converted to God's will, and that Love is ultimately an irresistible power, by which all souls must surrender at some point in time. I'm just probing your logic or perhaps a philosophical explanation of a 'forced healing', or an inevitable return to God,...which to me would be some kind of irresistible grace. While some passages (if you want to keep the subject within a 'biblical-context') seem to support universalism, others definitively support 'conditional immortality' (which includes the disintegration/destruction of the wicked). How do you deal with those, or evade the charge of merely 'cherry picking' verses? :)


There is no way to avoid the charge of cherry picking. You can use 1,000 scriptures, as I have in this thread, and people will still accuse you of doing it. The bible can just be interpreted in more than just one direction; so the verses are just there to pick. It depends on how they are picked and why. Because the fruit is understood differently. Just as in the area of free will, God is understood differently. In my view, God does not " Highly respect free will"; that is an illusion. In my understanding God couldcareless about human will. He is the type of being that his will gets done, he does not give choices. This is the God I see in the bible, free will is an illusion.
 

Mickiel

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most Christians do :idunno:



I see things in scripture totally different than Christians do. In example, most Christians believe in the Trinity; I don't. I don't know where they are getting this Trinity belief, because they are not getting it from the bible. The term" Trinity", does not exist in scripture, the favorite Christian slogan " The Triune God" is nowhere in scripture, there are absolutely zero scriptures that prove God is a Trinity, they use superficial scriptures to sedate their large desire for it to be true. And there are over 200 scriptures that clearly call God " One", not this strange three. So I have seen Christianity create doctrines without biblical support. They do it all the time. Like Tithing, there are absolutely no New Testament scriptures to support Tithing-- none! Those churches did NOT do it, but Christianity has manipulated Old Testament scriptures in order to create the illusion of a doctrine.
 

serpentdove

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...This world is sick, it does not need some eternal punishing hell hanging over its head. It needs healing, not punishing.

You contribute to its sickness because you have not repented (Eccl 10:2, Jn 10:10).

Jesus loves you (Jn 3:16). Jesus is willing to save you (2 Pe 3:9). Repent (Eze 18:30-32; Ac 17:30). Believe (Mk 9:23).

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