musterion
Well-known member
Perhaps I confused you with Interplanetary; for that I apologize.
Still, the solution is the same in both cases: ignore him.
And stop whining.
ECT Which Gospel?
- Thread starter Danoh
- Start date
Perhaps I confused you with Interplanetary; for that I apologize.
Still, the solution is the same in both cases: ignore him.
And stop whining.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Do you have one of them 2G Blackberry Curves?
achduke
Active member
No, samsung 5 with TOL App.
If I may,terion of mus, to clear the fog, so to speak, and thus protect the babes from the numskulls who assert, that all of the book is about me/you, specifically, is written specifically to me/you/members of thed boc, and is for our obedience, and applies to us. It's rejecting the LORD God's counsel to consider things that differ, and rejecting the 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV order.
"That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus." Ephesians 2:7 KJV
"Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ." Ephesians 2:11-13KJV
"...in time past..."
The LORD God will bless all on-Jews through the nation of His own creation Israel. Israel is created as God’s chosen people, His "elect" for service(holy/sanctify=to be set aside, separated, "severed" for God's use/purpose). God created the nation Israel to have a privileged status before Him as a "peculiar", "different", separated("holy"=sanctified) people:
"But against any of the children of Israel shall not a dog move his tongue, against man or beast: that ye may know how that the LORD doth put a difference between the Egyptians and Israel." Exodus 11:7KJV
"Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: ..." Exodus 19:5 KJV
"For wherein shall it be known here that I and thy people have found grace in thy sight? is it not in that thou goest with us? so shall we be separated, I and thy people, from all the people that are upon the face of the earth." Exodus 33:16 KJV
"But I have said unto you, Ye shall inherit their land, and I will give it unto you to possess it, a land that floweth with milk and honey: I am the LORD your God, which have separated you from other people." Leviticus 20:24 KJV
"For from the top of the rocks I see him, and from the hills I behold him: lo, the people shall dwell alone, and shall not be reckoned among the nations." Numbers 23:9 KJV
"For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth." Deuteronomy 7:6 KJV
"Only the LORD had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day." Deuteronomy 10:15 KJV
"For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God, and the LORD hath chosen thee to be a peculiar people unto himself, above all the nations that are upon the earth." Deuteronomy 14:2 KJV
"Thou hast avouched the LORD this day to be thy God, and to walk in his ways, and to keep his statutes, and his commandments, and his judgments, and to hearken unto his voice: And the LORD hath avouched thee this day to be his peculiar people, as he hath promised thee, and that thou shouldest keep all his commandments; And to make thee high above all nations which he hath made, in praise, and in name, and in honour; and that thou mayest be an holy people unto the LORD thy God, as he hath spoken." Deuteronomy 26:17-19 KJV
"And what one nation in the earth is like thy people, even like Israel, whom God went to redeem for a people to himself, and to make him a name, and to do for you great things and terrible, for thy land, before thy people, which thou redeemedst to thee from Egypt, from the nations and their gods." 2 Samuel 7:23 KJV
/2 Chronicles 17:21 KJV
"And he returned to the man of God, he and all his company, and came, and stood before him: and he said, Behold, now I know that there is no God in all the earth, but in Israel: now therefore, I pray thee, take a blessing of thy servant." 2 Kings 5:15 KJV
"For the LORD hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar treasure." Psalms 135:4 KJV
"He sheweth his word unto Jacob, his statutes and his judgments unto Israel. He hath not dealt so with any nation: and as for his judgments, they have not known them. Praise ye the LORD." Psalms 147:19-20 KJV
"You only have I known of all the families of the earth: therefore I will punish you for all your iniquities." Amos 3:2 KJV
In time past, Gentiles are blessed through Israel's rise to kingdom glory(Isaiah 49:6 KJV, Luke 2:30-32 KJV) as "...the Priests of the LORD....", "...the Ministers of our God:..."(Isaiah 61:6 KJV), "...as His "... messenger..."(Isaiah 42:19KJV ), His "...servant..." He has "chosen..." as His "...elect...(Isaiah 41:8 KJV, Isaiah 44:1 KJV, Isaiah 45:4 KJV, Isaiah. 54:17, Isaiah 65:9 KJV). Israel was to become the LORD God's witness to the unbelieving world of the promised seed , the Lord Jesus Christ(Galatians 3:16), that there is one true and living God(Isaiah 43:1 KJV, Is. 43:10-12 KJV; Matthew 24:14 KJV; Luke 24:48 KJV; Acts 1:8 KJV; Acts 10:41-43 KJV):
" But now thus saith the LORD that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine......Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God." " Isaiah 43:1 KJV, Is. 43:10-12 KJV
And thus, Israel was to be the LORD God's vessel(Jeremiah chapter 18, Jer. 19:11 KJV; Isaiah 52:11 KJV) by which "all families of the earth(shall) be blessed"(Genesis 12:2,3) through the Lord Jesus Christ. Israel was to be the appointed channel and were to be delivered from the curse of the law in order that the blessing of Abraham might come through the Lord Jesus Christ:
References: Genesis 12:1-3 KJV, Gen.22:16-18 KJV, Gen.49:10 KJV; Exodus 19:5-6 KJV; Psalms 67:2 KJV, Psalms 96:3 KJV, Psalms 98:1-3 KJV; Isaiah 41:8 KJV, Is. 42:6-7 KJV, Is. 44:1 KJV, Is. 49:6 KJV, Is. 56:6-8 KJV, Is. 60:3 KJV, Is. 61:6-9 KJV; Jeremiah 33:9 KJV; 2 Chronicles 6:32 KJV; Zechariah 8:13-23 KJV; 1 Kings 8:41-43 KJV; Matthew 5:16 KJV, Mt.28:18-19 KJV; Mark 16:15 KJV; Luke 2:30-32 KJV, Luke 24:46-47 KJV; John 4:22 KJV; Acts 1:8 KJV, Acts 3:25 KJV; Romans 3:1-2 KJV, Romans 9:4 KJV, Romans 15:8 KJV; Galatians 3:16 KJV
And this explains what was happening at the Jordan....baptizing=the "initation" rights for individual members of the nation Israel, as priests, the "kingdom of priests " for service.....Priests had to be washed/sprinkled............
"But now..."
After Israel's(temporarily)"stumble, fall, diminishing, casting away, blindness, unbelief"(Romans 11:11-26 KJV), as documented historically in the book of Acts(which is a historical transition period explaining Israel's fall and subsequent removal temporarily as the "channel/"vessel"), the LORD God temporarily set aside the prophetic program, which dealt primarily with Israel alone, and raised up a new apostle, and yes, a new program, the mystery program, the dispensation of the grace of God, that was unforeseen in any of the prophetic books. And now,there is no more "....middle wall of partition..."(Ephesians 2:14 KJV). The LORD God is no longer distinguishing/discriminating/putting a "difference" or a "separation", between Jew and Gentile(Romans 10:12 KJV), and God "...hath concluded all under sin..." (Romans 11:32 KJV), and God "...hath concluded all under sin..."(Galatians 3:22 KJV), and is no longer during this "...dispensation of the grace of God..."(Eph. 3:2 KJV) bestowing blessings upon those that bless Israel, that honor Israel(per Genesis 12:2)
"For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him." Romans 10:12 KJV
"Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all." Colossians 3:11 KJV
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:28 KJV
"For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;..." Ephesians 2:14 KJV
"That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel." Ephesians 3:6(see also 1 Cor. 10:17 KJV, 1 Cor. 12:12-13 KJV)
And thus, in Ephesians chapter 2 the Apostle Paul "lays out" the basic three-fold division in God’s dealing with mankind:
Time Past (verses 11,12): Genesis through Acts(a transition period)
But Now(verse 13): Romans through Philemon
The Ages to Come (verse 7): Hebrews through Revelation
When the Holy Bible is “laid out” according to this "cool," "groovy" plan by the LORD God, this "not accidental" design, we easily get an overview of not only that we are reading, but when and to whom it was written, and explains the seemingly, yes, "contradictory" passages in the Holy Bible(If you are an honest student of the book), and removes the "fog" through understanding the divine, definite distinction/difference God made in "time past"(the prophetic program), as opposed to the divine no distinction/difference today in this dispensation's 'but now"(the mystery program).
For example:
1. The Lord Jesus Christ's seemingly puzzling statement:
".... for salvation is of the Jews." John 4:22 KJV
Not many would contend that our Lord is proposing that salvation is given through the Jews, in a literal sense. No, the Lord Jesus Christ, as "... a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers:..."(Romans 15:8 KJV-the promises being the covenants/promises given only to Israel), was reaffirming Israel's honored, exalted status as the channel/vessel/vehicle by which the world would be blessed through her instrumentality as a nation of priests, ministers, witnesses....., and as the "blood line" by which the seed should come, i.e., the Lord Jesus Christ.
2. The Lord Jesus Christ's seemingly puzzling actions toward "...a woman of Canaan..." in Matthew chapter 15. He rebuked her, and "... answered her not a word..."(verse 23), and told her, in no uncertain terms, that "..I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel"(verse 24), and referred to her as a "dog"(verse 26-Gentiles were referred to as such by the Jews)="he wouldn't touch a Gentile with a 10 foot pole!" He thus recognized the "difference" between the "chosen" people of Israel and Gentiles, as divinely ordered throughout the OT, and thus "the children's bread"(verse 26) refers back to the Abrahamic covenant provision of Genesis 12:3 KJV( and confirms Paul's point in Romans 15:8):
"And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed." Genesis 12:3 KJV
That is-through Israel, as the vessel, channel, instrument..
And notice that the Lord Jesus Christ only honored her request after she acknowledged and honored Israel's special, privileged status as the vessel, the channel:
"And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table. Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour." Matthew 15:27-28 KJV
This "great faith" of which the Lord is pointing out is her faith in the Abrahamic covenant. She acknowledged her position as a "dog", and Israel's exalted status as the channel of blessing(a difference between Jew and Gentile), and thus, because she blessed Israel(" that bless thee"-Gen. 12:3 KJV), and the Lord Jesus Christ blessed her("I will bless them that bless thee"-Gen 12:3 KJV).
3. A similar situation to the preceding is given in Luke chapter 7 KJV. Notice the centurion is a Gentile. And why did the Lord Jesus Christ honor his request to heal his servant?:
"For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue." Luke 7:5 KJV
The centurion demonstrated his "...great faith..."(7:9) in believing the Abrahamic covenant, and recognizing the "difference":-he "blessed Israel" per Luke 7:5 KJV. And the Lord Jesus Christ blessed him accordingly. And on and on....
The word of God itself provides us with the key to its own proper understanding and rightly dividing the word of truth:
time past: Eph. 2:11-12 sets forth the basic issue in time past- the division between the circumcision and the uncircumcision, between the nation of Israel and the Gentiles. When you find this issue governing the way God was working with mankind, you know you are in time past. This covers the “Old Testament” (see Gen. 17:9-14 KJV, Deut. 4:5-8 KJV, Num. 23:9 KJV), as well as Matthew through John (see Rom. 15:8 KJV, Matt. 10:5-6 KJV; Mt. 15:24 KJV; John 4:22 KJV and the "early Acts" period;(see Luke 24:47 KJV, Acts 1:6-8 KJV; Acts 2:14-36 KJV, Acts :5:32 KJV, Acts 11:19 KJV).
but now: Eph. 2:13 KJV indicates that in the but now portion, Gentiles are no longer “far off” but rather the “middle wall of partition” between Israel and the Gentiles has been eliminated , and now “those who were far off are made nigh.” Romans through Philemon provide the doctrine for the "dispensation of the grace of God":Rom. 11:13 KJV; Romans 15:16 KJV; Romans 16:25 KJV, 1 Cor. 14:37 KJV, Eph. 3:1-9 KJV.
The ages to come: God will bring His purposes to fruition, and thus Eph. 2:7 KJV points to the "ages to come." The books of Hebrews through Revelation focus on this aspect of God's revelation.
Again, The Holy Bible is "laid out" as to Eph 2:11-13 KJV, and verse 7, as follows:
Gen. through much of Acts is God dealing with Israel alone, i,e.: time past=prophecy
Romans through Philemon is God dealing with the body of Christ(boc), i.e.: but now=mystery
Hebrews through Revelation is God resuming, "picking up," His program with the nation Israel, and the "difference" between Israel and Gentiles will once more be resumed, i.e.: ages to come(future)=prophecy again
Until you stop being a rebel, acknowledging how the LORD God shows you to correctly read, understand, and yes, acknowledge differences in the Holy Bible, through rightly dividing the word of truth, per 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV, you will a "masterblender,"
and ashamed, if you are saved, at "the awards ceremony."
I know, I know.....We will pray for you, my dear, mean spirited, misguided, intolerant, MAD wacko.....
Cricket....cricket............
achduke
Active member
I will control my posts. I thought this was a theology site where we could see all views to find the truth. I will try to reason with everyone.
musterion
Well-known member
It is, and we can, and we do. Of course all are welcome to participate freely. It's the deliberately dishonest ones, who show a pattern of dishonesty, who are rightly targeted here. I don't think I get that from your posts.
musterion
Well-known member
Beautifully said.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
"I think Romans 11:25 speaks for itself. "-Brucie boy
There you go folks-that "speaks for itself" close"/stumper can be employed to answer any question, on any topic, on any website, on any planet.
Please, teach me....Please?
Try this: I think the bible speaks for itself.
QED.
Shut down TOL, according to Brucie boy.
"One other thing Johnny, "
=another stock cliche.
And I dig chicks, Brucie, so your Johnny" tough guy act, trying to impress the TOL audience, won't work. Dig?
"you sure like to bully everyone around. Maybe you should listen more and reason with others you do not agree with"
Never heard that one before. You're beginning to bore me, boy. But "thanks" for the "Oprah" impression. Your "opinion" is rejected.
Yes, "Brucie" is an excellent code name. You dig it.
The old "accusation of hate...bully...mean spirited....Can't we all just get along/'love' each other....Alan Alda....." technique.
Standard fare-seen it before, such as on "The View."
Challenge us, Brucie, with something original. We are all busy men/woman, and have enough boredom spammed our way from the secular world drones.
This is a war, for men/women's souls. If you want to sit in pew/bleachers/fox hole, sit on the sidelines, and boo, and be offended, and cry, and pine, and wine, while the soldiers battle/players are in action, "knock yourself out." Just stay out of the way, as war, the bible, is rough.
Are you diggin' me?
And you know that my name is not "Johnny," actress.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Maybe he was thinking of the words of the great poet, Charlie Daniels.
"My name's Johnny, and it might be a sin. I"ll take your bet, you're gonna regret, cause I'm the best there's ever been."
Not "smooth, like you, when you put your arm around your gal, eh Mayor?
Well, I reckon I will respond to Brucie, going forward, as they say in Texas, "If the phone don't ring, you'll know it's me."
Interplanner
Well-known member
John W wrote:
"The LORD God will bless all on-Jews through the nation of His own creation Israel. Israel is created as God’s chosen people, His "elect" for service(holy/sanctify=to be set aside, separated, "severed" for God's use/purpose). God created the nation Israel to have a privileged status before Him as a "peculiar", "different", separated("holy"=sanctified) people:"
This is said as though it were a future thing. The destiny, legacy, objective, meaning of Israel's history has been fulfilled in Christ. That's what the one official, authentic, apostolic, sample sermon says in Acts 13. It was written in an area where a neo-Judaism was cropping up, complete with first-hand contact with the angels who delivered the original torah on Sinai. Impressive!
God's blessing for the nations was justification by Christ, says the sermon. We can be justified from our sins.
We are not waiting for events in another Israel, in a modern one, in a future one.
Sometimes we lose track of the fact that the 1st century (and its "culmination of the time"--Heb 9) was in the future of the OT prophets. We move right on to ourselves as though it was all about us.
"The LORD God will bless all on-Jews through the nation of His own creation Israel. Israel is created as God’s chosen people, His "elect" for service(holy/sanctify=to be set aside, separated, "severed" for God's use/purpose). God created the nation Israel to have a privileged status before Him as a "peculiar", "different", separated("holy"=sanctified) people:"
This is said as though it were a future thing. The destiny, legacy, objective, meaning of Israel's history has been fulfilled in Christ. That's what the one official, authentic, apostolic, sample sermon says in Acts 13. It was written in an area where a neo-Judaism was cropping up, complete with first-hand contact with the angels who delivered the original torah on Sinai. Impressive!
God's blessing for the nations was justification by Christ, says the sermon. We can be justified from our sins.
We are not waiting for events in another Israel, in a modern one, in a future one.
Sometimes we lose track of the fact that the 1st century (and its "culmination of the time"--Heb 9) was in the future of the OT prophets. We move right on to ourselves as though it was all about us.
achduke
Active member
So are you ready to act like an adult?
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Jerry Shugart has said that some people in Texas are "all hat and no horse".
Did you ever go to Gilley's , saint john? I know saint john travolta did.
"This is said as though it were a future thing. The destiny, legacy, objective, meaning of Israel's history has been fulfilled in Christ."
There you go, folks-this "close" can be employed to answer all questions. It's called the "Words without meaning" technique.
It's satanic sophistry, deceit.
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean – neither more nor less."
"The question is," said Alice, "whether you can make words mean so many different things."
"The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master – that's all." (Looking-Glass 6.63-65)
"The word means what I say it means"-The Queen to Alice
Thanks for checkin' in, unpacking that for us, Humpty Queen
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Actually, out in west Texas we say that some are "all hat and no ranch."