But he didn't say that because it would have been liable.
Roy Moore, OJ Simpson, And why I don't believe you.
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But he didn't say that because it would have been liable.
The article points out that the criticism of his uniform is subjective. But that doesn't make it wrong. Snopes calling it wrong is just as subjective as the original claim.
Also, most police departments regulate how their uniforms should be worn, and it would be strange to allow unofficial pins to be worn in uniform.
What do you mean?
He doesn't have the power if he gets jumped from behind.
Let me explain something objectively true to you: He didn't get detained because of his attitude he got detained because of his actions. When you feel you need to give a stranger on a plane a rebuke you cross a line that shouldn't be.
Which is hostile.
There's nothing not hostile about it.
Threatened and interested are both in his purview. If he had seen Black have the same interaction with someone else he would have been justified.
Simple question; What was that about? Do you have a problem with that person? Do you mean that person ill? Are you going to do anything to cause that person ill?
Questions cops asks people millions of times a day.
Perfectly legitimate question. If he can't keep his mouth shut, perhaps he has trouble controlling other impulses. And if wasn't worried, why did he have his guys escort him to baggage and the other guy out the door:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Clarke_(sheriff)
I'll be sure to call all of them next time someone accosts me on a plane.
He didn't "fail to show deference" and he wasn't detained "for his attitude". No one knows what you're attitude is until you open your mouth and start shaking your head.
He was detained for his actions. He was questioned as to what they meant and why he couldn't resist the impulse to approach some one in an airplane and "rebuke them" as you put it.
That's not what planes are for.
Until he jumps you in the parking lot. Or his Twitter followers do.
Right, the guys at the audit department. I'll call them for the next riot.
Unsolicited signs of disapproval are hostile. Clarke only had his guys detain one person from that flight. Do you think all the people on that plane we're fans? Probably not. But none of them felt the need to go shaking their heads at people.
Yup. the guy that just couldn't contain himself and had to go out of the way to let some one know he didn't like him.
Clarke was minding his own business, Black should have minded his.
He doesn't need to be afraid to be interested. And if he wasn't afraid should he have been? What if black had killed him later? We'd be asking why he didn't text his own guys at the airport who are standing around with dogs anyway.
And we'll see how that turns out.
Well he resigned. So, there's that.
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Would you be this put out if the incident happened on a train? If you see that much hostility in a 'head shake' and subsequent walking away then that's paranoia. Seems as though there's good reason why this clown resigned.
Well, he was the Sheriff so he'd be the elected official in charge of that I'd guess.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Clarke_(sheriff)
Almost 40 years a cop, a Homicide Detective in America's 31st largest city.
I'll trust his instincts over the Audit Department any day.
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Good for you. Hopefully he did some decent work in that career as well.
I'm sure he's seen somethings he'd rather forget.
Which goes back to my point, which is that in allowing himself to wear such items, he is telling you something about himself. It's not a normal thing to do for a law enforcement officer.
Incidentally, apparently one of the badges is a novelty "US Secret Service" badge.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...e-wears-actually-mean/?utm_term=.2c1eb511b7dd
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Quite possibly, and done perhaps.
That's your authoritarian tendencies talking.
Which he wasn't worried about. No matter how you work at creating a reasonable scenario for an unreasonable response that continued well beyond even that point of harassment it's running afoul of every investigative agency involved before you get to the smell test, a simple and clear examination of the facts.
The sheriff didn't fear for his safety. We know this because he didn't indicate any trepidation to the officers he had detain the man. We know why he had them detain the man because of the question he wanted them to ask him. And we know from what followed that not only was he petty in the moment and immediately after, but he continued to push it. Just an impossible thing to rationally defend.
If you find a headshake hostile you should cloister immediately.
Not exactly. The interest has to be predicated on a reasonable apprehension which no one investigating believed existed.
A guy who doesn't respond to a challenge except to walk away isn't having problems controlling his impulses. The guy who abuses his authority and has that guy harassed on social media does. That's Clarke.
Same reason he wanted them to ask the question. Same reason for the social media nonsense. And it's not because he was worried about the guy.
Don't be a snowflake.
I'd agree he wasn't really detained for his attitude. He was detained because of Clarke's attitude. Or, Clarke's feeling about Black's.
Supra. And the response wasn't justifiable. It was an abuse of authority, which isn't just my opinion, but is in line with everyone that looked into it.
Depends on the sign. A throat slash? Reasonable. A middle finger? Same. A head shake and a walk away? No.
I completely agree he had the man detained because he knew the guy didn't approve of him. And that's an abuse of his power, as every authority that looked into it believed.
He can and should be free to say anything that doesn't rise to the actionable. If he'd tried to follow Clarke about, made gestures that were threatening, any number of things would cross the line. What he did didn't do that. No body charged with looking at it believed that it did or that Clarke's actions in response were called for. Simple as that.
And then some.
And there's nothing in the narrative to seriously imply that Clarke's instincts were telling him that Black was a threat to him. What is clear is that Clarke didn't like running into a negative response, used the language of a bully in responding, and when Black did the reasonable thing in walking away couldn't let it go, used his office to have the fellow harassed and continued the conduct beyond even that sad point.
On the plus side, he won't be doing that again in the foreseeable future.
Here's the list of his flair from you link:
So just like he said a mixed bag of memories, antiabortion baby feet, a motorcycle club, and the thing you call "a novelty "US Secret Service" badge" is #13?
Not exactly a novelty. Something you get for helping out with a Presidential visit.
He probably has more memories and mementos he could put on there, 40 years worth.
He obviously feels it has some Mojo for him, and it obviously does for you since you can't look past the uniform and see the man inside of it.
Barbarian observes:
America has come a long way down the path to dictatorship when a citizen can be detained for asking a sheriff if he's a sheriff, and refusing to talk further with him.
Clarke figured that he was the master, and that citizen got uppity with him. So he decided to teach him a lesson.
And it backfired on Clarke. Turns out the ruling class hasn't as much power as he thought.
We've come a long way toward that point, but not as far as Clarke thought. So he got his knuckles rapped for it. The fact that Clarke actually thought he could get away with it, is evidence enough that we're giving people like him way too much power.
Hopefully, Clarke isn't going to cost the citizens of the county for his behavior. Ideally, as an elected official, he'd be financially responsible for his own behavior.
He's out of a job, because he thought we were in a Kim Jong-un state, when we've only gotten to being a Donald Trump state. :chuckle:
America has come a long way down the path to dictatorship when a citizen can be detained for asking a sheriff if he's a sheriff, and refusing to talk further with him.
Clarke figured that he was the master, and that citizen got uppity with him. So he decided to teach him a lesson.
And it backfired on Clarke. Turns out the ruling class hasn't as much power as he thought.
We've come a long way toward that point, but not as far as Clarke thought. So he got his knuckles rapped for it. The fact that Clarke actually thought he could get away with it, is evidence enough that we're giving people like him way too much power.
Hopefully, Clarke isn't going to cost the citizens of the county for his behavior. Ideally, as an elected official, he'd be financially responsible for his own behavior.
He's out of a job, because he thought we were in a Kim Jong-un state, when we've only gotten to being a Donald Trump state. :chuckle:
There's nothing Authoritarian about not hassling people on an airplane.
Right. Not the sort of thing you should put on a uniform, in other words.
Still not a badge, per se.
I see the man through the uniform.
Tell me this: If someone approached you on a plane the way he was approached, how would you react? Would you call the police and insist that he be arrested?