ECT Rightly Dividing MADs

[Jerry Shugart]

The commandments spoken by Christ, referenced by John and obeyed by you...what books of the Bible have them?

"This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you" (Jn.15:12).​

The Epistle to the Romans:

"Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law" (Ro.13:8).​

 

[john w]

Do you have any comments concerning the fact that those who received the Hebrew epistles were waiting for an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus?

Show me that you can actually out Jerry me and tell us why we should believe that that those who received the Hebrew epistles were waiting for the Lord's appearance when He returns to the earth and not at the rapture.

Fun and more fun!

Look, kid, I like you, and want you to be safe-you get run over by the higher grade students. You need to stick with the milk, in your Acts 2 Romper Room playground,as my brilliant, albeit humble, expositions you cannot bear. You choke on the meat.

Do you have any comments on why you attack/assassinate the messenger, and why you run and hide?It is evident that you have nothing to say, and when you do, it is laughable, absurd! Why should we believe you, instead of God the Father, the Lord Jesus Christ, Paul, Peter?


How did I do?


Here is the clincher-Sir Robert Anderson says clearly in these books....:


https://www.google.com/search?q=sir+robert+anderson+book+pics&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj3pYyS2trZAhWHtlMKHZAZArEQsAQIJg&biw=1008&bih=491

 

[Jerry Shugart]

How did I do?

Do you really have to ask?

All you did was to ignore the fact that those who received the Hebrew epistles were expecting an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus and only those in the Body were expecting that appearance.

That by itself completely destroys you silly idea that the Hebrew epistles were not written to those in the Body of Christ.

 

[musterion]

"This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you" (Jn.15:12).​

The Epistle to the Romans:

"Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law" (Ro.13:8).​

John said commandmentS, plural. Where's the rest of the commandments of Christ that you obey?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

John said commandmentS, plural. Where's the rest of the commandments of Christ that you obey?

"Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself" (Mt.22:39).​

The epistle to the churches of Galatia:

"For the whole law is fulfilled in one statement: Love your neighbor as yourself" (Gal.5:14).​

Now it is your time to actually answer a point of mine. Those who received the Hebrew epistles were expecting an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus and only those in the Body were expecting that appearance.

With this fact in view why do you continue to believe that those who received the Hebrew epistles were not baptized into the Body of Christ?

 

[john w]

Do you really have to ask?

All you did was to ignore the fact that those who received the Hebrew epistles were expecting an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus and only those in the Body were expecting that appearance.

That by itself completely destroys you silly idea that the Hebrew epistles were not written to those in the Body of Christ.

Why do you ignore God the Father, the Lord Jesus Christ,Paul, Peter, Paul, and run and hide from Romans-Philemon, that clearly destroys your silly, absurd, laughable ideas and theories? The bible by itself refutes you. Why should we believe you, instead of the bible, Paul? I've seen it before-you attack the messenger, and assassinate others, instead of consulting "The Modern English" lexicons. This is what Sir Cliff Clavin says about "the Greek:"

"Well, you know Jerry, Ma told me that it's a little known fact, that 'the Greek' gods play Hydra and go seek, and that the ancient Greeks wore Tennis Zeus on their feet."

How did I do, kid?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

The bible by itself refutes you.

Then give me evidence from the Bible which refutes the idea that those who received the Hebrew epistles were not expecting an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus.

How did I do, kid?

You might actually try quoting Scripture to support your ideas.

 

[DAN P]

"Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself" (Mt.22:39).​

The epistle to the churches of Galatia:

"For the whole law is fulfilled in one statement: Love your neighbor as yourself" (Gal.5:14).​

Now it is your time to actually answer a point of mine. Those who received the Hebrew epistles were expecting an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus and only those in the Body were expecting that appearance.

With this fact in view why do you continue to believe that those who received the Hebrew epistles were not baptized into the Body of Christ?

Hi , Jerry and the reason that those in Hebrews are not in the B O C IS AT LEAST 2 fold !!

The Israel has been set aside Isa 6 , Luke 13:6-9 , Acst 13:46 , 18:6 , 28:28 and 2 Cor 3:13-16 !!

The second reason is that the B O C has been caught up in 2 Thess 4:13-18 , 1 Cor 15:51----- and 2 thess 2:1-4 !!

When the B O C has been taken up , then Israel will be saved , Rom 11:25 !!

Your premise and CONTEXT are no where to be found !!

dan p

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Your premise and CONTEXT are no where to be found !!

I have already demonstrated that those who received the Hebrew epistles were expecting an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus and only those in the Body of Christ were expecting that coming.

We also know that in the first century believing Jews were baptized into the Body of Christ (1 Cor.12:13).

Despite these fact you continue to insist that only some of the first century Jewish believers were baptized into the Body and others were not.

So tell me, why were only some of them baptized into the Body and the others not?

In the following passage Paul speaks on both Jewish believers and Gentile believers making up the Body:

"For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby" (Eph.2:14-16).​

Paul says that the middle wall of partition between the Jewish believers and the Gentile believers has been broken down. But if you are right then that middle wall remains in place for some of the Jewish believers.

 

[john w]

Then give me evidence from the Bible which refutes the idea that those who received the Hebrew epistles were not expecting an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus.

Anyone can see that I have answered every challenge I have been given, including whatever lame point you were trying to make about the commandments of God.Why should I believe your silly, absurd, lame, laughable evidence, instead of believing the bible?Anyone can see that you have not provided even one verse which supports your silly idea.You might actually try quoting Scripture to support your ideas. Why are you attacking the messenger, and assassinating me?All you prove over and over is the fact that you put more faith in what some people say about the Scriptures than you do in what they actually say.


You are nothing but an Acts 2 "it all says the same thing"ist, posing as a Mid-Acts dispensationalist! You with your itching ears run off after Haggee, Robertson of Acts 2 fame. It won't be long until you will be full-fledged Church of Christ-er, Pentecostal, because you are half way there now.


Evidently you do not believe Romans-Philemon!So you think the bible is in error?

Let us look at the following question asked by Sir Yogi Bera-

Sir Yogi is asked: What time is it?

Sir Yogi asks: You mean now?


And you still have not addressed what I said about Genesis-Revelation and the context in which those words are used.We can understand , and it is obvious that you do not want to actually discuss the subject of this thread because all you want to do is to assassinate my character by questioning my honesty!

Why don't you show us that you can actually discuss the subject of this thread in an intelligent manner because so far you have not said even one intelligent thing!Why are you running and hiding from Paul?

We see clearly that you just ignore what Paul said in Romans-Philemon about the body of Christ. You are evidently standing in the spotlight saying nothing!Why should we believe you, instead of Paul?


How did I do?Cat got your tongue or are you just being dishonest again?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Why should I believe your silly, absurd, lame, laughable evidence, instead of believing the bible?Anyone can see that you have not provided even one verse which supports your silly idea.

Why don't you believe what James said about the appearance of the Lord Jesus being imminent?

 

[john w]

Why don't you believe what James said about the appearance of the Lord Jesus being imminent?

It is clear that we see that you are running and hiding. Why don't you believe what Paul said about the appearance of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the body of Christ? Why should we believe you, instead of God the Father, the Lord Jesus Christ, and Paul, in Romans-Philemon? And why are you clearly attacking the messenger?


How did I do?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Why don't you believe what Paul said about the appearance of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the body of Christ?

What makes you think that I don't? Here are Paul's words about that appearance:

"For our citizenship is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our lowly body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body...The Lord is at hand (eggus)" (Phil.3:20-21;4:5).​

The Greek word eggus means "of times imminent and soon to come to pass" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).

I believe what Paul say about this and since his words are addressed to those in the Body then I believe that the Lord's imminent appearance applies to them. So why do you accuse me of not believing what Paul said about this appearance?

Now let us look at another verse from the Hebrew epistles where the same coming of the Lord is described as being near:

"You too, be patient and stand firm, because the Lord's coming is near" (James 5:8).​

The Greek word translated "is near" at James 5:8 is eggizo and in this verse that word means "to be imminent" (A Greek English Lexicon, Liddell & Scott [Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1940], 467).

In an article found on the "Pre-Trib Research Center" web site Dr. Renald E. Showers writes:

"In light of James' statements C. Leslie Mitton wrote, 'James clearly believed, as others of his time did, that the coming of Christ was imminent.' On the basis of James' statements we can conclude that Christ's coming was imminent in New Testament times and continues to be so today, and that this fact should make a difference in the way Christians live" [emphasis added] (Showers, The Imminent Coming of Christ).​

Paul Sadler, past President of the Berean Bible Society, said the following:

"The 'secret' resurrection that will take place at the Rapture should never be confused with the 'first' resurrection at the Second Coming of Christ. Those who rightly divide the Word of truth now see that only the members of the Body of Christ will be raised at the Rapture" [emphasis mine] (Sadler, Exploring the Unsearchable Riches of Christ [Stephens Point, WI: Worzalla Publishing Co., 1993], 167).​

Since there can only be one imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus and since only members of the Body of Christ are looking for that imminent appearance then it is certain that the first century Jewish believers were indeed baptized into the Body of Christ.

But you don't believe that because for some reason you think that only some of the first century Jewish believers were baptized into the Body but not all of them.

What is the difference between the believing Jews who were baptized into the Body and those who were not?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

-DELETE-

 

[DAN P]

What makes you think that I don't? Here are Paul's words about that appearance:

"For our citizenship is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our lowly body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body...The Lord is at hand (eggus)" (Phil.3:20-21;4:5).​

The Greek word eggus means "of times imminent and soon to come to pass" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).

I believe what Paul say about this and since his words are addressed to those in the Body then I believe that the Lord's imminent appearance applies to them. So why do you accuse me of not believing what Paul said about this appearance?

Now let us look at another verse from the Hebrew epistles where the same coming of the Lord is described as being near:

"You too, be patient and stand firm, because the Lord's coming is near" (James 5:8).​

The Greek word translated "is near" at James 5:8 is eggizo and in this verse that word means "to be imminent" (A Greek English Lexicon, Liddell & Scott [Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1940], 467).

In an article found on the "Pre-Trib Research Center" web site Dr. Renald E. Showers writes:

"In light of James' statements C. Leslie Mitton wrote, 'James clearly believed, as others of his time did, that the coming of Christ was imminent.' On the basis of James' statements we can conclude that Christ's coming was imminent in New Testament times and continues to be so today, and that this fact should make a difference in the way Christians live" [emphasis added] (Showers, The Imminent Coming of Christ).​

Paul Sadler, past President of the Berean Bible Society, said the following:

"The 'secret' resurrection that will take place at the Rapture should never be confused with the 'first' resurrection at the Second Coming of Christ. Those who rightly divide the Word of truth now see that only the members of the Body of Christ will be raised at the Rapture" [emphasis mine] (Sadler, Exploring the Unsearchable Riches of Christ [Stephens Point, WI: Worzalla Publishing Co., 1993], 167).​

Since there can only be one imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus and since only members of the Body of Christ are looking for that imminent appearance then it is certain that the first century Jewish believers were indeed baptized into the Body of Christ.

But you don't believe that because for some reason you think that only some of the first century Jewish believers were baptized into the Body but not all of them.

What is the difference between the believing Jews who were baptized into the Body and those who were not?

Hi Jerry and I believe that Jews can be saved !! 2 Cor 3:16 say it is possible , even today !!


One , Israel has been set aside as 2 Cor 3:13-16 says !!

Any Jews saved today , are BAPTIZO / PLACED into the B O C and all Jews , Gentiles , Bond and Free and all Males and Females LOSE THEIR IDENTITY in Christ as all in the B O C are a new Creation !!

dan p

 

[musterion]

"Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself" (Mt.22:39).​

The epistle to the churches of Galatia:

"For the whole law is fulfilled in one statement: Love your neighbor as yourself" (Gal.5:14).​

You quoted John for your obedience and John said commandmentS, plural.

Where's the rest of the commandmentS spoken by Christ that you obey?

 

[musterion]

He's trolling us.

 

[Interplanner]

"Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures" (Ro.1:1-2).​

Since the gospel of God was promised in the OT then it is not the same gospel which was kept secret since the world began.

You are nothing but a Bullingerite posing as a Mid-Acts dispensationalists!

Secret to whom?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Where's the rest of the commandmentS spoken by Christ that you obey?

"If ye love me, keep my commandments" (Jn.14:15).​

Do you not obey His commandments? It is a fact that the following words of Paul are either speaking of the commandments of God or the commandments of the Lord Jesus or both:

"Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more. For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus. For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication: That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour; Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God: That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified. For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness" (1 Thess.4:1-7).​

Do you deny that the commandments spoken of here are the commandments of the Lord Jesus or are the commandments of God?

I have answered you but you continue to run and hide from the fact that those who received the Hebrew epistles were waiting for an imminent appearance of the Lord Jesus and only those in the Body of Christ were waiting for that appearance!

You have absolutely no interest in finding the truth in this matter because all you care about is defending your mistaken beliefs!

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Secret to whom?

That gospel is the one Paul preached to the Jews, that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God.

The gospel which Paul preached to the Gentiles was kept secret since the world began.