Pope Francis extends Catholic priests' right to forgive abortion - $199.95

glassjester

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It's disproportionately a homosexual problem. Your church, as has been told in numerous books, purposely ordained homosexual priests, and ta da...look what happened.

I will ask again.

Do you have any specific piece of information (even one reliable statistic) that leads you to believe that sexual abuse is a particularly Catholic problem?

Or is this something you just like to believe for fun?
 

aCultureWarrior

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I will ask again.

Do you have any specific piece of information (even one reliable statistic) that leads you to believe that sexual abuse is a particularly Catholic problem?

Two books by Catholics and a website that you conveniently haven't talked about.

http://bishop-accountability.org/priestdb/PriestDBbylastName-A.html

Note how the priests are moved around and continue their atrocities against innocent children.

Or is this something you just like to believe for fun?

You have me confused with your priests: They rape little boys for fun, I expose the degenerates so that hopefully it won't continue to happen on a wide scale like it has.
 

Tambora

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Yes, but I am referring to the few who did do bad things. Almost all of them had nothing to do with pedophelia.


You as a conservative, like me, know how the news media totally perverts and twists the facts to attack our side, yes? I would suggest to you that they have done the same on this issue, and you should not be so quick to accept these things at face value. The liberal media HATES the Catholic Church more than they hate a million Trumps.
It has NOTHING to do with being liberal or conservative, Catholic Crusader.
And it has nothing to do with any hatred of any church.
It's about adults molesting CHILDREN.
And every time you try to downplay your church's involvement in such a shameful thing just makes you look desperate to hide your head in the sand.

It is NOT anit-Catholic to be disgusted at ANY adult that molests a child.

I don't think keeping sin in the dark is what GOD intends for any church.
 

Tambora

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You've said twice now that the Catholic Church, specifically, covers up sex abuse
Have you been living under a rock?

and you said that you don't think schools do.
Right. I don't think out public school system has a protocol to hide child molesters.
Do you?

I'll ask again (and I've provided 3 links for you), do you have any reason to believe that?
My over 60 years of life reading and seeing news reports.

What do you do? Not use your own brain but scramble for a biased internet link to tell you what to believe?

I honestly can't believe you would even try to imply that the RCC didn't have a problem with child molesters.
 

Crucible

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Priests aren't allowed to divulge people's confessions. If a priest confesses to taking sexual liberties with a young boy, they can't really do anything about it unless they forsake their vows.

That's just the way they are- the Catholic Church tends not to get involved with secular authorities, going by the example of Paul and the runaway slave. Basically, if you are ordained into the Catholic ministry and commit a crime, they are not going to give you up to the authorities.

It's kind of bizarre that a Calvinist who has to tell it, but people don't really do themselves any justice in continuously going after the Catholic Church in this regard- if it's anything, it's a starved moral complex running after the juiciest bite it can savor, and there's nothing more easy to bash than child molestation :rolleyes:
 

aCultureWarrior

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Priests aren't allowed to divulge people's confessions.

Which has absolutely nothing to do with the pederasty problem amongst Catholic Priests.

If a priest confesses to taking sexual liberties with a young boy, they can't really do anything about it unless they forsake their vows.

And when the young boys tell their parents about it and they go to the Catholic hierarchy?

tumblr_l0cnxu4QJl1qac8ago1_1280.gif


That's just the way they are- the Catholic Church tends not to get involved with secular authorities,...

It's called "Accessory After The Fact"

Definition

Someone who assists another 1) who has committed a felony, 2) after the person has committed the felony, 3) with knowledge that the person committed the felony, and 4) with the intent to help the person avoid arrest or punishment. An accessory after the fact may be held liable for, inter alia, obstruction of justice.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/accessory_after_the_fact

going by the example of Paul and the runaway slave.

So you're comparing the Apostle Paul who helped someone gain freedom with the Catholic hierarchy who covered up child molestation allegations? Wow.

Basically, if you are ordained into the Catholic ministry and commit a crime, they are not going to give you up to the authorities.

Thanks Sherlock, that's already been established.

It's kind of bizarre that a Calvinist who has to tell it, but people don't really do themselves any justice in continuously going after the Catholic Church in this regard- if it's anything, it's a starved moral complex running after the juiciest bite it can savor, and there's nothing more easy to bash than child molestation :rolleyes:

Just think of the good you could do if you told about the horrific childhood that you went through and what caused you to take up with a homosexual 'mentor'.
 

Tambora

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Priests aren't allowed to divulge people's confessions.
They better hope I don't hear it cause I'm going to shout it from the rooftops.
As everyone should to PROTECT THE CHILDREN, not the child molester.
It is no LESS of a legal or moral crime just because he confessed in a church.

Ya know, we hear about this vow to protect child molesters in a church confessional, but where is the vow to PROTECT CHILDREN????
Why would GOD, or any sane reasonable person, ever think that protecting a child molester's confession is of more value or more holy or more righteous or more moral than the protection of the child?
Does not even scripture teach us that is was more merciful for the priests to give hungry David and his soldiers the forbidden sacred shew bread than to "stick to the rules"?

The priest should tell, and then the priest can go to another priest and confess that he revealed a confession.
Win win.
 

glassjester

Well-known member
You have me confused with your priests: They rape little boys for fun, I expose the degenerates so that hopefully it won't continue to happen on a wide scale like it has.

Do you expect me to buy those 2 books, read them, and then respond to you? Come on.

Have you even read them? If so, you must be able to cite at least one statistic, right?
No? Not even one? Hm...

Can you provide any numbers at all about how many priests, as you say, "rape little boys?"
Or maybe you could quantify this "large scale."
Then perhaps you'd be willing to compare that to the population in general, in order to determine whether this is a specifically Catholic problem, or in fact, a human problem.

Can you?
 

glassjester

Well-known member
My over 60 years of life reading and seeing news reports.

So cite one of them.


What do you do? Not use your own brain but scramble for a biased internet link to tell you what to believe?

I honestly can't believe you would even try to imply that the RCC didn't have a problem with child molesters.

I am not.

I am asking if you can provide even one bit of evidence that this problem is diproportionately Catholic.
Can you? If you can't, is it possible you are operating under a bias? Or is that impossible?
 

Danoh

New member
It has NOTHING to do with being liberal or conservative, Catholic Crusader.
And it has nothing to do with any hatred of any church.
It's about adults molesting CHILDREN.
And every time you try to downplay your church's involvement in such a shameful thing just makes you look desperate to hide your head in the sand.

It is NOT anit-Catholic to be disgusted at ANY adult that molests a child.

I don't think keeping sin in the dark is what GOD intends for any church.

Now there's the objective Tam, I once knew :thumb:

By the way; you misspelled "anti."
 

Catholic Crusader

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It has NOTHING to do with being liberal or conservative, Catholic Crusader.
And it has nothing to do with any hatred of any church.........

You obviously missed my point completely. I was trying to draw an analogy: First, I was establishing the FACT that the media twists and perverts facts to attack what they do not like. I used your experience as a conservative to help you see that fact. As a conservative you have personally known how the media lies about conservatives, yes? So that's that - the media lies, and you know it does.

Okay? So that fact is established.

Next, I was trying to point out to you that MY personal experience as a Catholic is that I have also seen how the media LIES about the Catholic Church. This too, I know to be an absolute fact, and in fact it lies about the Church much worse than it lies about Trump or Republicans, Okay?

So, I was asking you to believe me when I say that some of these reports that you have just accepted as fact have much more to them than the media reports. I am asking you to believe me when I say "The Church" simply did not move peopleto protect perdophiles. There much much more than that going on here. I could write an entire page on it, but briefly there are two things involved here that change the whole thing:

1) Administratively, the Church is not a single entity. A bishop is like a state governor. One state governor has absolutely nothing to do with the actions, good or bad, of another state governor. So to say, "The Church did so-and-so..." is a non sequitur. Its like saying "America did so-and-so" if the governor of Rhode Island broke a law.
2) Pedophelia was never thie issue. This is the real big media lie. Almost all cases of abuse involved young men, by which I mean 14, 15, 16 and up. The issue is homosexuality, not pedophelia. It was still abuse and I am not excusing it but one must properly identify the abuse that took place.

Please do not have knee-jerk reactions to what I say. This is serious stuff and I ask you to think about what I am saying.
 

aCultureWarrior

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Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
You have me confused with your priests: They rape little boys for fun, I expose the degenerates so that hopefully it won't continue to happen on a wide scale like it has.

Do you expect me to buy those 2 books, read them, and then respond to you? Come on.

If you were sincere and wanted to know the truth about how your church purposely allowed homosexual males into the priesthood while turning away God-fearing men, then yes, I would expect you to do your own research into this sickening subject. But since you won't, here's my expectation:

I expect you to do what any decent person would do: Find a new church.

Have you even read them? If so, you must be able to cite at least one statistic, right?
No? Not even one? Hm...

I'm amazed how you Catholics take the destruction of children's lives lightly by attempting to put it into a statistic.

Can you provide any numbers at all about how many priests, as you say, "rape little boys?"
Or maybe you could quantify this "large scale."
Then perhaps you'd be willing to compare that to the population in general, in order to determine whether this is a specifically Catholic problem, or in fact, a human problem.

Can you?

Let's see what Frank has to say about the subject shall we?

One in 50 priests is a paedophile: Pope Francis says child abuse is 'leprosy' infecting the Catholic Church

Pope Francis has revealed that around one in every 50 Catholic priests is a paedophile.
Condemning the issue as a ‘leprosy’ which infects the Church, the Pontiff was yesterday reported as claiming that even bishops and cardinals are among the ‘2 per cent’ carrying out child abuse.
He also said that many more in the Church are guilty of covering it up, adding: ‘This state of affairs is intolerable.’

*Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nterview-Italian-newspaper.html#ixzz4QqCifhAs

Actually Frank, the problem in your church is mainly with pederasts...

On that note:

How about I help you go "church shopping" glassjester and we can look for a real Christian church that doesn't purposely hire homosexuals and then cover it up when they find out that homosexuals do what they do best:

molest innocent children.

130311-papal-conclave.jpg

http://ivcaffeine.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/130311-papal-conclave.jpg
 

Catholic Crusader

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You trust in wicked idolators.........

Wow. Shouldn't you be serving up some juice at some compound in the woods somewhere?


..............Among the Christian churches, only the Catholic Church has existed since the time of Jesus. Every other Christian church is an offshoot of the Catholic Church. The Eastern Orthodox churches broke away from unity with the pope in 1054. The Protestant churches were established during the Reformation, which began in 1517. (Most of today’s Protestant churches are actually offshoots of the original Protestant offshoots.)

Only the Catholic Church existed in the tenth century, in the fifth century, and in the first century, faithfully teaching the doctrines given by Christ to the apostles, omitting nothing. The line of popes can be traced back, in unbroken succession, to Peter himself. This is unequaled by any institution in history.

Even the oldest government is new compared to the papacy, and the churches that send out door-to-door missionaries are young compared to the Catholic Church. Many of these churches began as recently as the nineteenth or twentieth centuries. Some even began during your own lifetime. None of them can claim to be the Church Jesus established.

The Catholic Church has existed for nearly 2,000 years, despite constant opposition from the world. This is testimony to the Church’s divine origin. It must be more than a merely human organization, especially considering that its human members— even some of its leaders—have been unwise, corrupt, or prone to heresy.

Any merely human organization with such members would have collapsed early on. The Catholic Church is today the most vigorous church in the world (and the largest, with a billion members: one sixth of the human race), and that is testimony not to the cleverness of the Church’s leaders, but to the protection of the Holy Spirit.

FOUR MARKS OF THE TRUE CHURCH

If we wish to locate the Church founded by Jesus, we need to locate the one that has the four chief marks or qualities of his Church. The Church we seek must be one, holy, catholic, and apostolic.

The Church Is One (Rom. 12:5, 1 Cor. 10:17, 12:13)
Jesus established only one Church, not a collection of differing churches. The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but one spouse, and his spouse is the Catholic Church. His Church also teaches just one set of doctrines, which must be the same as those taught by the apostles (Jude 3). This is the unity of belief to which Scripture calls us (Phil. 1:27, 2:2). Over the centuries, as doctrines are examined more fully, the Church comes to understand them more deeply (John 16:12–13), but it never understands them to mean the opposite of what they once meant.

The Church Is Holy (Eph. 5:25–27, Rev. 19:7–8)
By his grace Jesus makes the Church holy, just as he is holy. This doesn’t mean that each member is always holy. Jesus said there would be both good and bad members in the Church (John 6:70), and not all the members would go to heaven (Matt. 7:21–23). But the Church itself is holy because it is the source of holiness and is the guardian of the special means of grace Jesus established, the sacraments (cf. Eph. 5:26).

The Church Is Catholic (Matt. 28:19–20, Rev. 5:9–10)
Jesus’ Church is called catholic ("universal" in Greek) because it is his gift to all people. He told his apostles to go throughout the world and make disciples of "all nations" (Matt. 28:19–20). For 2,000 years the Catholic Church has carried out this mission, preaching the good news that Christ died for all men and that he wants all of us to be members of his universal family (Gal. 3:28). Nowadays the Catholic Church is found in every country of the world and is still sending out missionaries to "make disciples of all nations" (Matt. 28:19). The Church Jesus established was known by its most common title, "the Catholic Church," at least as early as the year 107, when Ignatius of Antioch used that title to describe the one Church Jesus founded. The title apparently was old in Ignatius’s time, which means it probably went all the way back to the time of the apostles.

The Church Is Apostolic (Eph. 2:19–20)
The Church Jesus founded is apostolic because he appointed the apostles to be the first leaders of the Church, and their successors were to be its future leaders. The apostles were the first bishops, and, since the first century, there has been an unbroken line of Catholic bishops faithfully handing on what the apostles taught the first Christians in Scripture and oral Tradition (2 Tim. 2:2). These beliefs include the bodily Resurrection of Jesus, the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist, the sacrificial nature of the Mass, the forgiveness of sins through a priest, baptismal regeneration, the existence of purgatory, Mary’s special role, and much more —even the doctrine of apostolic succession itself. Early Christian writings prove the first Christians were thoroughly Catholic in belief and practice and looked to the successors of the apostles as their leaders. What these first Christians believed is still believed by the Catholic Church. No other Church can make that claim.

Pillar of Fire, Pillar of Truth

Man’s ingenuity cannot account for this. The Church has remained one, holy, catholic, and apostolic—not through man’s effort, but because God preserves the Church he established (Matt. 16:18, 28:20). He guided the Israelites on their escape from Egypt by giving them a pillar of fire to light their way across the dark wilderness (Exod. 13:21). Today he guides us through his Catholic Church.

The Bible, sacred Tradition, and the writings of the earliest Christians testify that the Church teaches with Jesus’ authority. In this age of countless competing religions, each clamoring for attention, one voice rises above the din: the Catholic Church, which the Bible calls "the pillar and foundation of truth" (1 Tim. 3:15).

Jesus assured the apostles and their successors, the popes and the bishops, "He who listens to you listens to me, and he who rejects you rejects me" (Luke 10:16). Jesus promised to guide his Church into all truth (John 16:12–13). We can have confidence that his Church teaches only the truth.


END EXCERPT QUOTE


 

Ask Mr. Religion

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Romanists Walk Back Their Foilbles

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Read English man. I said that Jesus chose 12 apostles and one betrayed him. That's an 8% failure rate. We do much better.

In other words, we {"unlike Our Lord" is implied here} do not have an 8% fail rate among priest. If you learn how to speak English you'll understand that was a tongue & cheek way of saying almost all priests are good men. And the few bad ones we have are because men are men - sinners.
Funny how the Romanist assigns failure to Our Lord's efforts, as if the outcome was some function of natural statistics. Our Lord's infallible choice of His apostles, knowing exactly one would betray him, notwithstanding, of course. :AMR:

Only in Romanism does their obvious "foot in mouth" statements morph to be merely "tongue-in-cheek" when they are caught in their infelicities.

Of course this is to be expected. Pinning the Romanist down on anything related to doctrine or dogma is much like trying to nail jelly to a wall. They will walk back all obvious painting of themselves into corners in hopes their challenger or onlooker will give them a pass.

Speaking English is one thing. Knowing how to use English properly is something quite different.

AMR
 
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glassjester

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Pope Francis has revealed that around one in every 50 Catholic priests is a paedophile.
Condemning the issue as a ‘leprosy’ which infects the Church, the Pontiff was yesterday reported as claiming that even bishops and cardinals are among the ‘2 per cent’ carrying out child abuse.
He also said that many more in the Church are guilty of covering it up, adding: ‘This state of affairs is intolerable.’

Do you realize there is no source for this statistic? In fact, the entire conversation reported in that article is based on an alleged interview between Pope Francis and a 90 year old "reporter." He did not record the interview in any way, and did not even transcribe the conversation while there. He later "recalled" some of the things the pope said in their conversation and wrote it up in a newspaper (La Repubblica) that he, himself, owns.

For the record, La Repubblica is a definitively leftist (and historically anti-Catholic) publication. Don't you normally like to discredit and dismiss those types of news outlets, ACW?
 

aCultureWarrior

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Do you realize there is no source for this statistic? In fact, the entire conversation reported in that article is based on an alleged interview between Pope Francis and a 90 year old "reporter." He did not record the interview in any way, and did not even transcribe the conversation while there. He later "recalled" some of the things the pope said in their conversation and wrote it up in a newspaper (La Repubblica) that he, himself, owns.

For the record, La Repubblica is a definitively leftist (and historically anti-Catholic) publication. Don't you normally like to discredit and dismiss those types of news outlets, ACW?

Bill Donohue steps on his tongue in this article stating that the Catholic Church doesn't have a pedophilia problem, but has a homosexual problem (correctly acknowledging that it is a pederasty problem, not a pedophilia problem).

He then goes onto say that there shouldn't be a blanket policy prohibiting homosexual priests, even though a study showed that 37% of homosexuals admitted to having sex with children (I wonder what percent of child rapists never admit to it?).
https://www.onfaith.co/onfaith/2010...hs-issue-is-homosexuality-not-pedophilia/6536

When the conservative faction of your church doesn't want to take a hardline stance on the cause of the problem, then it's not difficult to figure out why there is a problem.

keefe0323.gif

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glassjester

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When the conservative faction of your church doesn't want to take a hardline stance on the cause of the problem, then it's not difficult to figure out why there is a problem.

I don't necessarily disagree. Any man who is "openly gay" has already bought into this culture's lie that sexual orientation (1) exists and (2) is hardwired.

But then there would just be the problem of secretly gay men, which is likely the case for most gay men entering the clergy, already.

What do you do to prevent that? "Extreme, extreme" vetting?
 
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