ISRAEL IS THE FOCAL POINT OF THE BELIEVERS

[Totton Linnet]

The Election of Grace Rom. 11:5 are the True Jews: The Church Christ gave His Life for Eph. 5:25!

Human ethnicity is not the criteria which determines whom God Saves.

The True Jews Rom. 2:29 are the only Israel that was Promised Salvation Is. 45:17: jews and Gentiles from all the nations of the earth Rev. 5:9; 14:6; Chosen in union with Christ before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:4-5; 2 Tim. 1:9; John 17:2.

The same are the Seed of Abraham Christ took upon Himself to die for Heb. 2:16; Gal. 3:16.

~~~~~

Your book learning is a real barrier
You read one verse of Paul from romans and then run to your commentary and read a chapter to spin out a doctrine for you

The verse is

even so at this PRESENT time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace
and if by grace then it is no longer of works [you fallen into the works trap, because you say the Jews are cut off for disobedience, very Arminian]
otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works then it is no more grace, otherwise work is no more works.

7.What then? Israel has not obtained that which he seeketh but election hath obtained it

AND THE REST WERE BLINDED.

Come along Nanja, let Tots take you by the hand to read Pauls summing up in verse 25.
For I would not brethren that Nanjalita should be ignorant of this mystery, lest she be wise in her own conceits

BLINDNESS in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in

And so ALL ISRAEL will be saved

 

[Totton Linnet]

Paul says it is FALLEN Israel, DIMINISHED Israel, CAST AWAY Israel which is to be reconciled, received and accepted.

 

[Totton Linnet]

{cough} Balfour Declaration {cough}

Japhetites and Hamites are not Semitic.

You call them what you will they are the same race that Hitler recognised as Jew and the Commies recognised as Jew and they are recognised as Jews in every land they have been in, their names, their culture and their religion.

 

[Nanja]

Your book learning is a real barrier
You read one verse of Paul from romans and then run to your commentary and read a chapter to spin out a doctrine for you

The verse is

even so at this PRESENT time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace
and if by grace then it is no longer of works [you fallen into the works trap, because you say the Jews are cut off for disobedience, very Arminian]
otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works then it is no more grace, otherwise work is no more works.

7.What then? Israel has not obtained that which he seeketh but election hath obtained it

AND THE REST WERE BLINDED.

Come along Nanja, let Tots take you by the hand to read Pauls summing up in verse 25.
For I would not brethren that Nanjalita should be ignorant of this mystery, lest she be wise in her own conceits

BLINDNESS in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in

And so ALL ISRAEL will be saved

In context, Rom. 11:5 is speaking of Jews in Israel, however it is not limited to them, for there is also a remnant [residue] of the Gentiles who are also of the Election of Grace.


The "all Israel" that shall be Saved Rom. 11:26 is not a physical nation, but Spiritual, the ones spoken of in:

Rom. 11:32
For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

That "all" is comprised of all of God's Elect, jew and Gentile, the world that the Deliverer Rom. 11:26, The Lamb of God John 1:29, takes away their sins!


God's Mercy is only for His Elect Children, His Vessels of Mercy "which He had afore prepared unto glory" Rom. 9:23; 2 Tim. 1:9.


This Elect Israel, the Spiritual Nation, is the only portion of mankind that God Promised Salvation to.

Is. 45:17
But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.


Rom. 11:7
What then? Israel [the nation], hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded



Israel Is. 45:17 is the Elect Seed Chosen in Union with Christ Eph. 1:4, and the rest that were blinded are the seed of the serpent, the tares, all the reprobates of the world; castaways, vessels of wrath prepared for destruction Rom. 9:22; Mat. 13:38-39!

~~~~~

 

[Lazy afternoon]

The Election of Grace Rom. 11:5 are the True Jews: The Church Christ gave His Life for Eph. 5:25!

Human ethnicity is not the criteria which determines whom God Saves.

The True Jews Rom. 2:29 are the only Israel that was Promised Salvation Is. 45:17: jews and Gentiles from all the nations of the earth Rev. 5:9; 14:6; Chosen in union with Christ before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:4-5; 2 Tim. 1:9; John 17:2.

The same are the Seed of Abraham Christ took upon Himself to die for Heb. 2:16; Gal. 3:16.

~~~~~

True.

LA

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Why do you just make things up? Hitler never said anything about Israel being chosen, he hated them actually because he was one of those who recognised that actually the Jews do run everything...love them or loathe them they do.

The Jews also these 2,000 years have not swaggered but have rather sighed and groaned under their status as God's chosen people. The WHOLE church [apart from a few individuals] kept silent....that will cost the church dearly during the tribulation, Israel might have provided a refuge from the antichristal storm, a covert, a hiding place. But Israel will remember the church stood by during their time of anguish.

Israel will not be converted until the Lord comes in the clouds and they will look upon Him who they have pierced and mourn for Him as for a firstborn son.

Israel looked upon and mourned on the day of Pentecost onward.

No new turning to Christ by the existing population of all the earth is possible after Christ returns---

Rev 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

If they reject the last witness then they will not turn to Christ when He appears.

LA

 

[beameup]

If they reject the last witness then they will not turn to Christ when He appears.

LA

It just states the He (Jesus) will forgive their sins (when He returns). However, there will only be a "remnant" left when He returns.

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer, and shall turn away [remove] ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. Romans 11:26-27

In those days, and in that time, saith the LORD, the iniquity of Israel shall be sought for, and there shall be none; and the sins of Judah, and they shall not be found: for I will pardon them whom I reserve. Jeremiah 50:20

 

[God's Truth]

It just states the He (Jesus) will forgive their sins (when He returns). However, there will only be a "remnant" left when He returns.

Are you kidding? When Jesus comes again---IT WILL NOT BE TO BEAR SIN.

If Jesus does not bear your sin---then there is NO WAY THEY CAN BE SAVED.

Hebrews 9:28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

 

[God's Truth]

Paul says it is FALLEN Israel, DIMINISHED Israel, CAST AWAY Israel which is to be reconciled, received and accepted.

No one is able to be saved unless they turn to Jesus and repent of their sins.

They must do that BEFORE Jesus comes again, because he will NOT come to bear sin.

Jesus will come unexpectedly...as a thief in the night comes.

Christians have to be ready, which means we cannot be in sin when he comes.

 

[God's Truth]

Elia, I fully understand the horrid acts levied upon the Jews by christiandom.

My wife applied for our son to go to Punahou, Iolani, or Saint Luis high schools (he's a QB) I told her "hell no" I will never support a Catholic Church or school based on what they did to the Jews.

Furthermore, I cringe when I hear Christians quoting Luther, he disgusts me.

That said, call me crazy, wrong and uneducated I might be, but my faith in Yeshua has forever made me a lover of the Abrahamic descendants thru Isaac and I pray for the peace of Jerusalem. I don't blame you for your words against the believers on TOL (which do not include the idiots adhering to replacement theology- you know who you are - ask mr Rong and Nangula).




Sent from my iPhone using TOL

You are in falseness, yet you flirt with the truth sometimes. No matter how you look at it, it proves you are not there.

 

[God's Truth]

No.

The glorying in the flesh Israel (as if they are the chosen people) is what Hitler despised because he considered his white race to be the chosen ones for the thousand years.

Read history correctly.

The RCC backed Hitler.

LA

Hitler did not just want a white race. Don't believe everything you hear as truth because it is called history.

Hitler wanted to get rid of the poor, the mentally ill, and the disabled who were German.

 

[Totton Linnet]

In context, Rom. 11:5 is speaking of Jews in Israel, however it is not limited to them, for there is also a remnant [residue] of the Gentiles who are also of the Election of Grace.


The "all Israel" that shall be Saved Rom. 11:26 is not a physical nation, but Spiritual, the ones spoken of in:

Rom. 11:32
For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

That "all" is comprised of all of God's Elect, jew and Gentile, the world that the Deliverer Rom. 11:26, The Lamb of God John 1:29, takes away their sins!


God's Mercy is only for His Elect Children, His Vessels of Mercy "which He had afore prepared unto glory" Rom. 9:23; 2 Tim. 1:9.


This Elect Israel, the Spiritual Nation, is the only portion of mankind that God Promised Salvation to.

Is. 45:17
But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.


Rom. 11:7
What then? Israel [the nation], hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded



Israel Is. 45:17 is the Elect Seed Chosen in Union with Christ Eph. 1:4, and the rest that were blinded are the seed of the serpent, the tares, all the reprobates of the world; castaways, vessels of wrath prepared for destruction Rom. 9:22; Mat. 13:38-39!

~~~~~

Wrong theology not only makes people hard hearted, it makes them quite stupid.

Paul says it is those who were cast away who will be accepted. The Jews were an elect nation, all who were Jacobs children.

But their election is not the heavenly but the earthly inheritance...why do you suppose God will create a new earth?

 

[steko]

Are you kidding? When Jesus comes again---IT WILL NOT BE TO BEAR SIN.

If Jesus does not bear your sin---then there is NO WAY THEY CAN BE SAVED.

Hebrews 9:28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

There's that ridiculous argument of yours, yet again.

I have never read anywhere on this forum or others that anyone has ever claimed that the Lord Jesus will come back to bear sin. This, He did once and for all, on the cross two-thousand years ago.

 

[intojoy]

You are in falseness, yet you flirt with the truth sometimes. No matter how you look at it, it proves you are not there.

Jezebel speaketh


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

 

[intojoy]

In context, Rom. 11:5 is speaking of Jews in Israel, however it is not limited to them, for there is also a remnant [residue] of the Gentiles who are also of the Election of Grace.


The "all Israel" that shall be Saved Rom. 11:26 is not a physical nation, but Spiritual, the ones spoken of in:

Rom. 11:32
For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

That "all" is comprised of all of God's Elect, jew and Gentile, the world that the Deliverer Rom. 11:26, The Lamb of God John 1:29, takes away their sins!


God's Mercy is only for His Elect Children, His Vessels of Mercy "which He had afore prepared unto glory" Rom. 9:23; 2 Tim. 1:9.


This Elect Israel, the Spiritual Nation, is the only portion of mankind that God Promised Salvation to.

Is. 45:17
But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.


Rom. 11:7
What then? Israel [the nation], hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded



Israel Is. 45:17 is the Elect Seed Chosen in Union with Christ Eph. 1:4, and the rest that were blinded are the seed of the serpent, the tares, all the reprobates of the world; castaways, vessels of wrath prepared for destruction Rom. 9:22; Mat. 13:38-39!

~~~~~

The Remnant refers to the Remnant of believing Jews of which all of the apostles are members.

You seem to have an inconsistency.

If you recognize a difference between Israel and the church then how is it that you can call Israel the church in the Old Testament and the church Israel in the New Testament?

This is inconsistent unless you are a student of John MacArthur. Which is it?


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

 

[God's Truth]

The Remnant refers to the Remnant of believing Jews of which all of the apostles are members.

You seem to have an inconsistency.

If you recognize a difference between Israel and the church then how is it that you can call Israel the church in the Old Testament and the church Israel in the New Testament?

This is inconsistent unless you are a student of John MacArthur. Which is it?


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

All who overcome through faith in Jesus are Israel.

Earthy land and ethnicity does not matter anymore.

 

[God's Truth]

There's that ridiculous argument of yours, yet again.

I have never read anywhere on this forum or others that anyone has ever claimed that the Lord Jesus will come back to bear sin. This, He did once and for all, on the cross two-thousand years ago.

This is what beameup said:

It just states the He (Jesus) will forgive their sins (when He returns). However, there will only be a "remnant" left when He returns.

 

[God's Truth]

Since Jesus' shed blood on the cross, there is a NEW COVENANT.

Covenants are made by BLOOD.

ALL those of Israel/Jews, they were CUT OFF and are in the same POSITION as the GENTILES.

Do you believe and understand that?

God bound Israel over with the GENTILES.

How do Gentiles get saved?

THEY GET SAVED BY COMING TO JESUS IN REPENTANCE. THE REPENTANCE through his blood which washes away sins.

How does earthly Israel/Jews get saved? The SAME WAY AS THE GENTILES. THROUGH JESUS BLOOD.

That is how Jesus bears sins---that is HOW ONE IS FORGIVEN.

When Jesus comes again, it will NOT be to forgive/bear sins.

That means it is TOO LATE FOR ANYONE TO BE FORGIVEN.

 

[God's Truth]

At least investigate what I am saying, your opponent. Stop responding to me with rote replies!

 

[steko]

This is what beameup said:

It just states the He (Jesus) will forgive their sins (when He returns). However, there will only be a "remnant" left when He returns.

All sin, no matter when forgiveness is received in human history, is forgiven only on the basis of the blood of Christ on the cross. Beameup knows that.

Prophecy declares in both the OT prophets and in Paul that there will be a remnant called Israel saved in the period described as the Day of the LORD. Still, the forgiveness in that event is based solely on the blood of Christ on the cross two thousand years ago.

To say that Christ must bear sin again in order for Israel to be saved in the future would be the same as saying that Christ would have to go back in time to the time of Abraham and bear sin in order for Abraham to be saved. Abraham became saved by the work of Christ on the cross even though Abraham lived two thousand years before Christ died on the cross.

You are correct that Christ is not coming back to bear sin a second time.
You are mistaken in thinking that anyone is claiming that He will.