ECT How is Paul's message different?

[God's Truth]

Her view on salvation, like Cain before her-Genesis 4 KJV(to be delivered, preserved, from a danger):"I'm a rat, but, when compared to my fellow rats, I am not 'as dirty' as my fellow rats, as I am a 'bit cleaner,' so I must be saved."

It is that simple.

Cain was jealous and angry and hated his brother for thinking he was better. It is what you do to me.

 

[lifeisgood]

I repeat what Jesus says and teach others that it is what Paul says too.

Yeah, you do. :nono:

 

[Jerry Shugart]

JESUS PREACHED to the JEWS when he walked the earth to repent and to have faith in him for the forgiveness of sins.

Paul taught the same thing to the Gentiles.

John the baptizer preached it all first. He said repent of your sins and believe in the Lamb who takes away the sins of the world.

All you do is to EVADE what I said:

It is imposible that the Twelve were preaching the same gospel which Paul preached to the Gentiles ("Christ died for your sins") because at the time when they were preaching that gospel they didn't even know that the Lord Jesus was going to die (Lk.18:33-34).

Tell me how it is possible that at Luke 9:6 the Twelve were preaching that Christ died for their sins since they didn't even know that He was going to die.

 

[lifeisgood]

It is what you do to me.

There goes that persecution spirit rearing his head again.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Can you dig it?

No, I am embarrassed for you because you say that the Lord Jesus was made like His brethren in only "some" things even though you have been shown that He was made like His brethren "in all things":

"Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people" (Heb.2:17).​

Pay attention, sonny boy. It says "in all things" and not "in some things," as you imagine!

 

[john w]

No, I am embarrassed for you because you say that the Lord Jesus was made like His brethren in only "some" things even though you have been shown that He was made like His brethren "in all things":

"Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people" (Heb.2:17).​

Pay attention, sonny boy. It says "in all things" and not "in some things," as you imagine!

Confirmed-the old man is so clueless, he does not even know that TOL is laughing at his "Don't you believe 'Jesus'/Paul/the Scriptures?...Who should we believe-you or Paul?....You deny what Paul said here.... Why don't believe what is written at(fill in the blank)?..." gimmick, sophistry.


Slower, Mr. Peepers:As much as you like to draw my fire, given my authority, clout, on TOL, to attempt to garner attention to your quite irrelevant, ignored, "ministry, as not many are paying attention to you, on the circuit, it won't work. And I feel so cheap, you "using" me like that, frail old man, sower of discourse amongst the brethren, on TOL, and other sites, being banned from them.....



I only engage bible believers, and do not engage bible correctors/mystics/agnostics, and humanists, such as yourself, Mr. Peepers, in debates, persuasion, disputes, and certainly not admitted Acts 2 blenders, "Replacement Theology" proponents, "it all says the same thing" proponents, such as yourself.


Can you dig it?

Jesus was a man before he came to earth, and was not conceived by the Holy Spirit, and thus is not God......God is done with Israel.....Per early Acts, you must be water baptized to be saved, which is why I am a Church of Christ member...Babies have the identical sinless nature as Jesus, and do not need salvation...I do not believe the bible, as I correct it, since it was written by men, not God....

 

[Jerry Shugart]

The Bible: "in all things."

john weenie: "in some things but not all things."

 

[john w]

The Bible: "in all things."

john weenie: "in some things but not all things."

Jesus was a man before he came to earth, and was not conceived by the Holy Spirit, and thus is not God......God is done with Israel.....Per early Acts, you must be water baptized to be saved, which is why I am a Church of Christ member...Babies have the identical sinless nature as Jesus, and do not need salvation...I do not believe the bible, as I correct it, since it was written by men, not God....

Once Saved Always Saved is a doctrine from hell...

 

[God's Truth]

All you do is to EVADE what I said:

That is not true, because I don't evade anything we talk about.

It is imposible that the Twelve were preaching the same gospel which Paul preached to the Gentiles ("Christ died for your sins") because at the time when they were preaching that gospel they didn't even know that the Lord Jesus was going to die (Lk.18:33-34).

Even if they did not understand, when they did not understand---the truth was still taught and that was to have faith in Jesus for the forgiveness of sins.

Tell me how it is possible that at Luke 9:6 the Twelve were preaching that Christ died for their sins since they didn't even know that He was going to die.

The good news was Jesus Christ coming and teaching how to be saved by having faith in him for the forgiveness of sins.

 

[john w]

Cain was jealous and angry and hated his brother for thinking he was better. It is what you do to me.

No, Cain was sad,angry, and wanted to kill his brother, as all self righteous devil children, like yourself do, and want, as they hate the Abel's of the world, who, instead of embracing works,as a basis of acceptance before a holy LORD God, "a tiller of the ground...Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord," which the Lord rejected, Genesis 4:5 KJV,offered the required sacrifice,death by blood, "brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof," ,being a type of the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ, the antitype, and it was accepted, Genesis 4:4 KJV. You Cain's, just hate that your works, as dirty as filthy rags, are rejected, and, in satanic pride, want to "kill" Ephesians 2:8 KJV, Romans 6:23 KJV ..............


Genesis 4 KJV

1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord.

2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.

3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord.

4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offering:

5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.

6 And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?


But, you are a blatant perverter, not a subtil one, an admitted wolf, whom almost everyone can recognize, and be prepared for, so you are quite harmless, not a real threat. The real danger, threat, to the babes/sheep, are the wolves, in sheeps clothing,posing, like Satan, as "Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light"(2 Cor. 11:14 KJV).

Rat poison is 99% cornmeal-it is the 1%, the small amount of truth, that gets the rat.


Go away, shoo, pest, gnat.

 

[God's Truth]

No, Cain was sad,angry, and wanted to kill his brother, as all self righteous devil children, like yourself do, and want, as they hate the Abel's of the world, who, instead of embracing works,as a basis of acceptance before a holy LORD God, "a tiller of the ground...Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord," which the Lord rejected, Genesis 4:5 KJV,offered the required sacrifice,death by blood, "brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof," ,being a type of the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ, the antitype, and it was accepted, Genesis 4:4 KJV. You Cain's, just hate that your works, as dirty as filthy rags, are rejected, and, in satanic pride, want to "kill" Ephesians 2:8 KJV, Romans 6:23 KJV ..............


Genesis 4 KJV

1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord.

2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.

3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord.

4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offering:

5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.

6 And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?


But, you are a blatant perverter, not a subtil one, an admitted wolf, whom almost everyone can recognize, and be prepared for, so you are quite harmless, not a real threat. The real danger, threat, to the babes/sheep, are the wolves, in sheeps clothing,posing, like Satan, as "Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light"(2 Cor. 11:14 KJV).

Rat poison is 99% cornmeal-it is the 1%, the small amount of truth, that gets the rat.


Go away, shoo, pest, gnat.

Abel gave a better sacrifice than the one Cain gave. Cain was jealous and hateful just as you are.

 

[john w]

Abel gave a better sacrifice than the one Cain gave. Cain was jealous and hateful just as you are.

Made up, deceiver:

3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord.

4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offering:

5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.

 

[God's Truth]

Made up, deceiver:

3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord.

4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offering:

5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.

Just like I said.

 

[God's Truth]

I preach the truth that we have to believe and obey.

John W. says we only have to believe.

Think for yourself what is better.

Is it better to go against someone who preaches to not obey?

 

[God's Truth]

Faith without obedience is dead and cannot save anyone, it is not unlike the filthy rag scripture where when the people would give a blood offering but not really be sorry for their sins and repent.

Believing in Jesus and not repenting of sins is like that filthy rag offering.

 

[Tambora]

Galatians 2 KJV
(21) I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Spoiler

That last post reminded me of another old post of mine. I once compiled a list of some of the books I've read that have had a significant impact on the way I think and on what I believe. I repost it here for your consideration. By the way, it is a very old post and so I have no idea if any of the links will work....



Here's a list of some of the best and most influential books I've read. It isn't a complete list, by any means, but as I remember other important books I will add them to the list. Also if I read anything new that I feel is deserving I'll add that as well. I hope that this will be a valuable resource for some of you. Let me know what you think!


1. The Plot by Bob Enyart
No matter what, read this one first! It's expensive but worth it. If you cannot afford it call 1-888-8Enyart and talk to Bob about it. He's more interested in getting the information out than he is about making money so he'll take whatever you can afford. I cannot over stress this enough. You must read this book. If you do not understand the teachings in The Plot (whether you've read the book or not) then you do not understand the Bible. It's as simple as that.

2. The Complete Green Letters by Miles J. Stanford
This one will be lots cheaper in fact the whole first section of the book is available online for free HERE.
When I first read this book it totally glazed my eyes over. I hated it! But I picked it up again after having read The Plot and it totally changed my life! What a difference it makes when you understand the plot of the Bible and the distinctive nature of Paul's ministry and message. This book has had the largest impact on how I live my life day to day than any other extra-biblical book. In fact, while The Plot covers similar material it was this books presentation of the Gospel of Grace that really made me see it and understand how it is supposed to work on a practical day to day level. Awesome!

3. Things That Differ - by C.R. Stam
This one further establishes the biblical validity of Acts 9 Dispensationalism. There are actually several such books but this one does the best job I've seen aside from The Plot and I like to recommend it because it gives you a thorough presentation of the Biblical material from someone who is not associated in any way with Bob Enyart or his ministry.
I remember thinking that it was odd that Bob was the only one who had ever figured this stuff out and was relieved to find that he is not and that, in fact, there are world-wide ministries (i.e. The Berean Bible Society) which teach nearly identical theology.

4. Bob Enyart's Bible Studies – by Bob Enyart
This is the only departure from actual books on my list. These are Bible studies that Bob has recorded on tape or CD. I recommend all of them. Simply call 1-888-8Enyart and get them started coming to your house every month. Unless you end up going Derby School of Theology, these will give you the most in depth Biblical teaching you will every get, period. In addition to that, if you read the rest of what's on my list and accept its teaching, some Bible teaching that actually teaches you something will be in desperate demand, as some of you have already discovered. When I came to understand these teachings, I found a new appreciation for the saying "ignorance is bliss". Be warned, the truth has the effect of isolating you in a sea of ignorance and apathy. A nice place to be for those who are wise.

5. The Normal Christian Life - by Watchman Nee
This one I recommend with a bit of trepidation. This is the ONLY volume written by Nee that anyone should ever read. Everything else he wrote is worthless. It is amazing that someone so confused about everything else could get this one so right! So read this AFTER you've read the others already listed and get from it what you can (which is a lot) and then forget that Nee existed. Truly, his other books are almost completely worthless.

6. Romans: Verse by Verse - by William Newell
Simply the best commentary on Romans in existence (that I know of). Brilliant!

7. Does God Have a Future? – by Chris Hall & John Sanders
This one is a discussion/debate between Hall and Sanders. They are friends and besides some excellent argumentation on both sides, it's just a terrific example of how such debates should be carried out. The respect these two have for one another is obvious and the result is a terrific example of how Biblical disagreements should be handled between men of good character and conscience.

8. Mere Christianity – by C.S. Lewis
This is a classic that every Christian should read. Enough said.

9. The Chronicles of Narnia – by C.S. Lewis
This is a must, especially if you have kids or sometimes feel like a kid inside. This isn't a theological book but rather a Christian allegory. I only mention it here because I just had Lewis on my mind and couldn't resist. The only word of warning on these books is that in the finale Lewis presents what basically amounts to a sort of universalism which is obviously an error of his theology that crept into the work. If you can over look that one problem, this is an exceptional work of fiction that everyone seems to love.

10. The Big Questions: Philosophy for Everyone – by Nils Ch. Rauhut
This book is for those of you who have never taken a philosophy course. In fact, it reads very much like you are sitting in a philosophy class. It is very readable, very understandable and very down to Earth; the subtitle is perfectly right. Anyone can pick up this book and have a solid working knowledge of the basics of philosophy and logic. This book will definitely make you a better debater because you will understand more clearly the underlying issues of a question usually before the person who asked the question does.

11. Please Understand Me – by Kersey & Bates
This is a secular work about personality profiles. It has a test in it that tells you what your personality profile is and a lot about why you do the things you do. Once you become familiar with the principles in the book you'll be able to "size people up" with relative ease and will thereby be able to understand where they are coming from and can anticipate their behavior. Absolutely invaluable for married couples as well as anyone else who has close personal relationships with people they sometimes don't understand.

12. God of the Possible: A Biblical Introduction to the Open View of God – by Gregory Boyd
The title pretty much tells the story on this one. Brilliant book!

13. The God Who Risks: A Theology of Providence – by John Sanders
If you read this one and God of the Possible, you'll have Open Theism down pat!

14. Divine Foreknowledge: Four Views – by Gregory Boyd, David Hunt, William Lane Graig & Paul Helm
Each author presents their view on the divine foreknowledge debate and a response to the other views. Boyd presents some of the best Open View arguments I've ever heard of in this book (aside from Bob's of course ).

15. The Witness of the Stars – by E.W. Bullinger
This one is all about how the Gospel story is found in the Zodiac of all places. As it turns out the stars were the Bible before there was the Bible. Others have published very similar material but this is by far the best. I love the old English that Bullinger used (the book was written in 1893).

16. Can Man Live Without God - by Ravi Zacharias
This is a brilliant apologetic for the Christian faith. Better perhaps than even Mere Christianity.

17. You Cannot Live the Christian Life - by Bob Hill
This is a sermon that Pastor Hill preached that has been converted into booklet form. The teaching here is crucial for the Christian to understand. The key to the Christian life is not performance but relationship. Love God and become more and more aware of His immediate presence in every moment of your life. This booklet goes along perfectly with The Complete Green Letters.
You'll have to contact Pastor Hill in order to get a copy of this one. You can contact him through his website - BiblicalAnswers.com.

18. Charismatic Chaos - by John MacArthur
If my father in-law had read and paid any attention to this book at all, he would still be alive today. This book exposes Benny Hinn and the other crack-pots like him for the con artists they are.

19. Classic Christianity: Life's Too Short to Miss the Real Thinghttp://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/s...ords=Classic+Christianity&Go.x=0&Go.y=0&Go=Go - by Bob George
Disapointed in your Christian walk? This is the book for you.
For a man who isn't an Acts 9 Dispensationalist George comes as close as anyone can to getting the answers to the following questions right...

• What does it mean to have Christ living in me?
• How can I experience the joy of the Lord daily?
• If I'm a new creation, why do I still struggle with sin?

20. To Train Up A Childhttp://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-form/104-1513849-6259138 - by Michael Pearl
Perhaps the best book written on the subject of raising Godly children.

21. Christian Child-Rearing and Personality Developmenthttp://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...f=sr_1_1/104-1513849-6259138?v=glance&s=books - by Paul Meier
This is also an excellent book for any parent to read. It is more clinical and scientific than To Train Up a Child and is chop full of very interesting and useful information about why children do the things they do.

22. Rich Dad Poor Dad - by by Sharon L. Lechter, Robert T. Kiyosaki
This book will change the way you think about money forever.

23. The Richest Man in Babylon - by George S. Clason
What a great book this one is! If the Christian reader can get past the fact that it is set in ancient Babylon, there is a wealth of really terrific information about how people get money and more importantly how they keep it. This one is even better than Rich Dad Poor Dad really and I would recommend reading it first.

24. Liberty and Tyranny: A Conservative Manifesto - by Mark Levin
The best book on modern American politics in existence. The only book you need to read to understand what it means to be politically conservative in America today. Simply brilliant.

25. Atlas Shrugged - by Ayn Rand
I "read" this book via the audio book version. Its the only way to go. I started to actually read it several times and gave up. Listening to it on my lunch hour and on the way to and from work was the ticket
Simply the best book I've ever read, bar none - period - end of sentence.

Beware! This book is written by a BRILLIANT atheist. If you understand the book, it WILL challenge your faith. I don't recommend this for new Christians nor for anyone who is particularly sensitive to anything that mentions human sexuality in any emotionally meaningful way. Ayn pulls no punches with this book and she is brutally rational. Interestingly, in my view, this brutal intellectual adherence to rationality (i.e. reality) is precisely what makes this book more consistent with Biblical truth than any other work of fiction I've ever read.

Well that's it for now! More to come soon.

Oh! By the way, except for the first few, these are not in any particular order.

God bless!

Resting in Him,
Clete

Here's some updated links:

1. http://store.kgov.com/the-plot/
2. https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/complete-green-letters-miles-j-stanford/1101953324
3. https://www.amazon.com/dp/0964454157/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_0obZAbJ2D3EQX
4. http://store.kgov.com/bible-studies-audio/

.... and I just realized how many links there are, so there's the first four.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Peter:

Acts 11:18 When they heard this, they had no further objections and praised God, saying, “So then, even to Gentiles God has granted repentance that leads to life.”


Paul:


Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus and Jerusalem, then to everyone in the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, I declared that they should repent and turn to God ,performing deeds worthy of their repentance.


Paul teaches the same thing that Jesus and Peter taught:


Paul teaches the same thing that Jesus taught:

Romans 13:10 Love does no harm to a neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.

Romans 13:8
Be indebted to no one, except to one another in love, for he who loves his neighbor has fulfilled the Law.

Galatians 5:14
The entire Law is fulfilled in a single decree: "Love your neighbor as yourself."

James 2:8
If you really keep the royal law stated in Scripture, "Love your neighbor as yourself," you are doing well.

Love is the fulfillment of the law means you are obeying everything that Jesus taught.

Your personal paradigm prevents you from seeing the difference.

 

[God's Truth]

Your personal paradigm prevents you from seeing the difference.

Maybe you are speaking about yourself.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Maybe you are speaking about yourself.

Pretty sure my paradigm shows the difference, expects it even, between what Paul and Peter taught.

Therefore what I said above cannot apply to me. It certainly applies to you, who says that what they taught was/is the same.

Things that differ are not the same.