excellent example of MADism:

[clefty]

I understand what you are saying. Like I said, Paul's word is just confusing. It is easily taken he is teaching against His word.

Why do you think there are so many heretics using Paul's teachings instead of Jesus' word?

OSAS is one of them, and faith or grace onlyism too.

Peter warned us the unstable would use Paul to destroy the gospel...

Even in acts there were those already spreading slander and false testimony of what the apostles were teaching...

I encourage you to please prayerfully study this:

http://www.fogwhistle.ca/acts/evidence.pdf

It really gets to the core of Paul remaining faithful to what was taught Him and previous tradition.

May He lead...

 

[meshak]

Peter warned us the unstable would use Paul to destroy the gospel...

I think Peter wanted to believe Paul is genuine servant. Peter is truly faithful one, and even he thought Paul's teaching is hard to understand.

Let me ask you this:

Do you think we need Paul's word to follow Jesus' teaching or His gospel?

 

[marhig]

I understand what you are saying. Like I said, Paul's word is just confusing. It is easily taken he is teaching against His word.

Why do you think there are so many heretics using Paul's teachings instead of Jesus' word?

OSAS is one of them, and faith or grace onlyism too.

Hi meshak,

They are twisting the gospel to suit their flesh, and remember, they don't only twist what Paul taught but Jesus too!

Going so far as to say that the teachings of Jesus aren't for them and only for the Jews. And why? Because those who set up their church have changed the gospel including what Paul preaches to suit man, gone is obedience to God and Christ even though Paul teaches that we are to obey, gone is to do Gods will. Gone is being a doer of the word, thats just for the Jews, gone is enduring to the end, again for the Jews only, gone is denying themselves or baring their cross to follow Jesus, thats for Jews only.

And what have they come up with? They twist the meaning of being saved by grace to mean to do nothing, and that's all they believe in, their do nothing gospel, and most of the time they miss out through faith! They can lie, cheat, deceive and do whatever their flesh desires, and why? Because Jesus was crucified to save them and all their sins are in hell and God doesn't see their sins he only sees Jesus. Well I'm afraid they do greatly err, because if we are living by our flesh and loving the world, not living by the will of God, then Jesus Christ is nowhere in sight!

Matthew 7:21-23

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?*And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Matthew 12:50
For whosoever shall do the will of my Fatherwhich is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

God only sees Christ in us, he doesn't want to see our flesh he wants that dead and gone, he wants to see the life of his son and his righteousness in and through us. And if Christ is within our hearts by the power of the spirit we will begin to overcome the sins of our flesh.

Please don't disbelieve Paul because others have twisted his word. They don't speak the truth. I'm sure it would break Paul's heart to know that some have twisted what he said to make an excuse to love their flesh.

If we didn't have to do anything, then Paul, Peter, James, John and all the other apostles wouldn't have had to do anything either, they would only have had to believe, but that didn't happen. They obeyed God and lived by his will and followed Christ. And if we truly follow Christ then we are to lay down our lives, obey God, do his will becoming a living sacrifice and God will dwell in our hearts and his love will be in and through us and the life and light of Christ will shine through us in this dark world with the hope through Christ, of bringing as many back to God as possible.

Jesus Christ came as an example for us to follow him, so if Christ is an example to follow, then we are to live as he did and love God with all our hearts and minds and our neighbours as ourselves, and live by the will of the living God

 

[Tambora]

You have confessed that you are an unclean rat

All are guilty. None are sinless but Christ.

and think scripture justifies you in being that

Justifies being that?????

as well by your opinion of all other believers.

What do you think my opinion of ALL other believers is?

One must be clean and Holy to enter the first resurrection.

Who said otherwise?

 

[Tambora]

Should Paul's writings be removed from the Bible??

Hi GM,

They are twisting the gospel to suit their flesh, and remember, they don't only twist what Paul taught but Jesus too!

 

[Tambora]

The Ascended Lord Jesus Christ Gave Paul "The Grace Gospel." It's the ONLY Gospel that saves today. So, you're NOT saved.

They don't speak the truth. I'm sure it would break Paul's heart to know that some have twisted what he said to make an excuse to rely on their own flesh instead of the one.

 

[marhig]

Hi GM,

They are twisting the gospel to suit their flesh, and remember, they don't only twist what Paul taught but Jesus too!

And what I've said which you have quoted is the truth, because you have a do nothing gospel, just live how you please and Christ has done it all for you, you can do any sin you please and God won't see it. Utter nonsense. Once we say we see, our sin remains! Unless we repent and be converted

 

[marhig]

They don't speak the truth. I'm sure it would break Paul's heart to know that some have twisted what he said to make an excuse to rely on their own flesh instead of the one.

Don't add on to what I've said! I can hear the wrong Spirit in you!

 

[Tambora]

you have a do nothing gospel

The gospel I have is found in scripture.
You're still relying on the righteous and obedience of two instead one, aren't ya.

just live how you please

As you do, o pompous one that also continues to sin.

and Christ has done it all for you,

Hallelujah!
Because none of us could.

you can do any sin you please and God won't see it. Utter nonsense.

Yes, you have spoken utter nonsense.
Of course GOD sees when we sin.
How can GOD cover our sin if He doesn't know about it?

Once we say we see, our sin remains! Unless we repent and be converted

My sins are covered by the only one with perfect righteousness and obedience.
Hallelujah for GOD's infinite grace (UNMERITED favor).

You can go right ahead and trust in your own righteousness and obedience.
Nobody is gonna stop ya.

 

[Tambora]

Don't add on to what I've said! I can hear the wrong Spirit in you!

It's me talking, not you, silly.

 

[marhig]

It's me talking, not you, silly.

Anyone who believes that they can live how they please, not obey God and not live by his will, and it's all done for them by Christ Jesus and they have nothing to do are believing a false gospel, and from what I'm reading here that's what your church teaches. And it's not the truth!

You keep saying about Christs righteousness, and not mine, which I keep telling you I know! Without Christ by the power of the spirit I could do nothing! But you choose to ignore that.

And if Christ is in you, you would live by the will of God, deny your flesh and the sins of it, and Christ by the Spirit would be helping you to overcome. If not, then Christs righteousness won't be in you or seen through you, and others will only the dust of your flesh in you!

 

[meshak]

Marhig,

let me ask you the same thing:

Do you think we need Paul's word to follow Jesus' teaching or His gospel?

 

[marhig]

Marhig,

let me ask you the same thing:

Do you think we need Paul's word to follow Jesus' teaching or His gospel?

Isn't that like asking do we need what peter, James, Jude or John etc. preached. Because, if we didn't have what the apostles preached, including Paul then we wouldn't know about Jesus.

Also, I believe that Paul is preaching the same gospel as Jesus so it's the same word.

 

[meshak]

Isn't that like asking do we need what peter, James, Jude or John etc. preached. Because, if we didn't have what the apostles preached, including Paul then we wouldn't know about Jesus.

Also, I believe that Paul is preaching the same gospel as Jesus so it's the same word.

I am asking this because so many man-made doctrines are using mainly Paul's word instead of Jesus'.

And the NT is mainly Paul's teaching instead of Jesus, the Teacher, the Savior of the world.

 

[Tambora]

Anyone who believes that they can live how they please

We are both living lives that continue to sin.
Sin is sin, and every single sin must be paid for (whether your sin pleased you or not).

not obey God

You continue to sin. Is that obeying GOD?

and not live by his will

You continue to sin. Is that living by His will?

and it's all done for them by Christ Jesus

YES!
Christ paid the price in full.
Done deal.

and they have nothing to do

Still relying on the righteousness and obedience of two instead of one, I see.

are believing a false gospel

It's a false gospel to believe that the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ paid the price in full for me??????
Oh yeah, I forget that you still rely on yourself paying the price.
I'll stick with the one.

Romans 5:18-19 KJV
(18) Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
(19) For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

and from what I'm reading here that's what your church teaches.

You have not been paying attention and are still stuck on relying on yourself.
The ONE is not you, it is the Lord Jesus Christ.

You keep saying about Christs righteousness, and not mine,

Scripture says it.

which I keep telling you I know!

If you do indeed KNOW it, then why do you keep trying to add in your own righteousness and obedience into the mix?
Why do you act as though the DBR of Christ did not pay the price in full, and that you still need to help Him finish???

Without Christ by the power of the spirit I could do nothing! But you choose to ignore that.

Ignore it?????
I'm the one that keeps pointing out that scripture does not include our righteousness and obedience that saves us.

And if Christ is in you, you would live by the will of God, deny your flesh and the sins of it, and Christ by the Spirit would be helping you to overcome. If not, then Christs righteousness won't be in you or seen through you, and others will only the dust of your flesh in you!

I have much more than just "help".
I have the reliance of the only one with perfect righteousness and obedience that saves.
What on earth do you think was lacking in what Christ did that you think you have to make up the difference?????
If you want folks to see Christ, then tell them to look at Christ and what He did, not at you and what you do.
If anyone is looking more towards their flesh, it's you.
You keep bringing up what you think you do and don't do.
And as long as you are still sinning, you cannot look anything like Christ.
And apparently you don't see Christ in anyone, because if you did you would see Christ as He is ---- the perfect spotless substitute that paid the full price.
But no, you would rather concentrate on the behavior of man.

Point people to Christ and His righteousness and obedience, not yours.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I am asking this because so many man-made doctrines are using mainly Paul's word instead of Jesus'.

And the NT is mainly Paul's teaching instead of Jesus, the Teacher, the Savior of the world.

Would Paul's writings be taken out of the Bible if you had your way??

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Marhig,

let me ask you the same thing:

Do you think we need Paul's word to follow Jesus' teaching or His gospel?

You'll ONLY find salvation and eternal life through the Gospel that Paul taught.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Anyone who believes that they can live how they please, not obey God and not live by his will, and it's all done for them by Christ Jesus and they have nothing to do are believing a false gospel, and from what I'm reading here that's what your church teaches. And it's not the truth!

You keep saying about Christs righteousness, and not mine, which I keep telling you I know! Without Christ by the power of the spirit I could do nothing! But you choose to ignore that.

And if Christ is in you, you would live by the will of God, deny your flesh and the sins of it, and Christ by the Spirit would be helping you to overcome. If not, then Christs righteousness won't be in you or seen through you, and others will only the dust of your flesh in you!

You're way out in left field.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

And what I've said which you have quoted is the truth, because you have a do nothing gospel, just live how you please and Christ has done it all for you, you can do any sin you please and God won't see it. Utter nonsense. Once we say we see, our sin remains! Unless we repent and be converted

The "True Christian's" only prerequisite is, that they place ALL their faith in Christ and none in themselves. You're what I call a "WORKER." There are Workers and Faithers. Only Faithers are truly saved.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

They don't speak the truth. I'm sure it would break Paul's heart to know that some have twisted what he said to make an excuse to rely on their own flesh instead of the one.

Hi Tam, bless you.