Church government is not hierarchical
- Thread starter iouae
- Start date
Translations.
It stared from the apostles and jesus but it is allowed to spread like a wild fire. The fire burned outside the woods of rcc. Still burning. Rcc are nothing but lifeless ashes. Traditions are dark, black and messy
The "we" also includes fringe catholics
iouae
Well-known member
Christianity is like a very resilient plant. It loves to be tended and watered and to receive a foliage spray now and then.
But it is the plant that springs up after a raging wildfire.
It is the office plant in the corner which people at the office party pour drinks into, and flick their litter.
It is the pot plant on Grandma's window sill which Grandma tends to when she remembers.
It is the plant you neglected to ask somebody to water when you went on holiday, yet it survived.
Christianity can thrive in the day, and survive in the night.
Filtered sunlight through stained glass windows is enough to keep it alive.
It can survive a sprinkling, or it can thrive by being baptised.
Folks trample it under foot, and it survives as a stunted shoot with a few leaves.
Or it can take pride of place as a much prized feature.
In the most terrible church environment, there is still hope for the individual believer.
Under the most ignorant preaching, the Holy Spirit can still bring something of value to remembrance in the heart of the listener.
Under the most oppressive of cult hierarchies, the truth of God can survive as a bonsai tree. When the cult shuns and casts out that despised and stunted tree, it can finally cast down roots, and tap into an unlimited supply of Living Water, and finally grow into what God intended to be.
In the most oppressive church environment, roots still find their way down to the True Source.
And its not all to the plant's credit. That Great Gardener comes by night and waters the plant when no man is looking, without which it would have died at the hands of men.
I am an optimist that Christ is found to some degree in all Christian Churches.
But it is the plant that springs up after a raging wildfire.
It is the office plant in the corner which people at the office party pour drinks into, and flick their litter.
It is the pot plant on Grandma's window sill which Grandma tends to when she remembers.
It is the plant you neglected to ask somebody to water when you went on holiday, yet it survived.
Christianity can thrive in the day, and survive in the night.
Filtered sunlight through stained glass windows is enough to keep it alive.
It can survive a sprinkling, or it can thrive by being baptised.
Folks trample it under foot, and it survives as a stunted shoot with a few leaves.
Or it can take pride of place as a much prized feature.
In the most terrible church environment, there is still hope for the individual believer.
Under the most ignorant preaching, the Holy Spirit can still bring something of value to remembrance in the heart of the listener.
Under the most oppressive of cult hierarchies, the truth of God can survive as a bonsai tree. When the cult shuns and casts out that despised and stunted tree, it can finally cast down roots, and tap into an unlimited supply of Living Water, and finally grow into what God intended to be.
In the most oppressive church environment, roots still find their way down to the True Source.
And its not all to the plant's credit. That Great Gardener comes by night and waters the plant when no man is looking, without which it would have died at the hands of men.
I am an optimist that Christ is found to some degree in all Christian Churches.
brewmama
New member
What scripture says Peter never went to Rome? Where does God say that?
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
brewmama
New member
So you think that what the Apostles were doing before the Crucifixion still is some kind of inviolate command that negates everything that came after the Resurrection? That is such bizarre thinking that it hardly bears a response. And guess what, it proves nothing. Because the Apostles went out, like Jesus told them to.
PureX
Well-known member
Nicely stated.
And there is a reason for this fortitude. The reason is that Christ is a reality, not a religion. Nd if a person has his heart and mind open, that reality will become clear to him/her. Regardless of the the authority-driven religiosity they may be bombarded with, or the total lack of religiosity.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Show me.
8 And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria, except the apostles
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Matthew 10:23 (KJV).
The truth of this statement was not canceled out by,
Matthew 28:19 (KJV).
The first statement spanned until the time the LORD returns. Think.
The truth of this statement was not canceled out by,
Matthew 28:19 (KJV).
The first statement spanned until the time the LORD returns. Think.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
It is bizzarre thinking, and rank unbelief, to think the apostles disregarded the LORD's words.
Matthew 20:23 (KJV)
They had no intention of going into all the world until the Son of Man be come. This is his Second Coming, as anyone who had read the Bible recognizes.
It is just possible that what you have been fed by your church for years does not correspond to reality.
iouae
Well-known member
brewmama
New member
It actually makes much more sense that it is his resurrection, not his second coming.Your "proof" is nonsensical and ignores history. St. James went to Spain. St. Thomas went to India. St. Peter also went to
Antioch. St. John went to Ephesus.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Look at the context of Matthew 10, and explain how this "makes more sense" as his resurrection.
Matthew 10
21 And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.
22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.
Matthew 24
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
He spoke specifically to the eleven and they are named in verse 13
iouae
Well-known member
In Revelation Christ gives instructions to 7 churches.
These are obviously Christ's churches.
All have problems and issues.
Christ always seems to be appealing to the individual believer to overcome.
Christ never seems to be appealing to a hierarchy to sort out the problem.
One always gets the feeling that it boils down to individual responsibility.
These are obviously Christ's churches.
All have problems and issues.
Christ always seems to be appealing to the individual believer to overcome.
Christ never seems to be appealing to a hierarchy to sort out the problem.
One always gets the feeling that it boils down to individual responsibility.
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