God's Truth
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False accuser.
Rules Governing The Gift Of Tongues
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False accuser.
God's Truth
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Since you say you can do the same works as Jesus...
Tell me who you have raised from the dead after four days.
God's Truth
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That was during the laying of the foundation.
We only need God's words now and we all can find them.
SimpleMan77
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Quote one verse saying that "tongues have ceased".
If you use 1 Cor 13:8 and say that has already been fulfilled, also address how knowledge has vanished away.
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God's Truth
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Aren't you paying attention to the people here you debate? I have already explained what you asked me to explain.
SimpleMan77
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Rules Governing The Gift Of Tongues
Much of what you posted was true, but you never gave me a scripture to bridge between God using miracles to validate His word, and your statement that God no longer does that.
I'm asking you for one scripture that justifies that. It's not enough to say "God did that then" (which is historically and biblically correct), then to say "the foundation is complete, so God stopped doing miracles" (which is your interpretation, and is neither historically nor scripturally correct).
The Bible never says God used miracles and signs to validate the first revelation of His Word - it says he "confirmed His Word". Anywhere His Word is preached, He still can and does do miracles to confirm it.
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Much of what you posted was true, but you never gave me a scripture to bridge between God using miracles to validate His word, and your statement that God no longer does that.
I'm asking you for one scripture that justifies that. It's not enough to say "God did that then" (which is historically and biblically correct), then to say "the foundation is complete, so God stopped doing miracles" (which is your interpretation, and is neither historically nor scripturally correct).
The Bible never says God used miracles and signs to validate the first revelation of His Word - it says he "confirmed His Word". Anywhere His Word is preached, He still can and does do miracles to confirm it.
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God's Truth
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God says He testified to what Jesus and the apostles said, He testified to it with signs and miracles.
It was testified to during the laying of the foundation.
The foundation has already been laid.
The message has already been testified to.
Yes there are but GT does not need them.
She is truly a great person who needs nothing but her brain to work out that Paul was wasting his time giving instructions to the church on the use of tongues in the assembly.
1Co 14:34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
1Co 14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
1Co 14:36 What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?
1Co 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
1Co 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.
1Co 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
LA
God's Truth
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Do you know what an apostle is?
oatmeal
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Why didn't you understand what I posted?
Not only can I and any believer do the same works as Jesus Christ but I can do what Jesus Christ's believing predecessors did. Joshua had the sun and moon stop in the sky for about a day, Hezekiah had the sun dial move backwards ten degrees and slay a thousand of God's people's enemies with the jawbone of an ***.
Since Joshua had the sun and moon stop in the sky, why didn't Jesus Christ or Paul or Peter or Ananias do it?
Since Moses parted the Red Sea, why didn't Jesus Christ or Paul or Peter or Silas do it?
Why don't you raise some one from the dead? Why did Jesus raise Lazarus from the dead? Why not read what I posted in my previous post instead of asking what I already answered?
Is it the Father's will or your will that I raise someone that is four days dead?
If God wanted me to do that, He would be the one to tell me, your opinion on the matter is irrelevant.
Jesus was a prophet like unto Moses.
Why did Moses part the Red Sea?
Because God told him to.
Why did Moses lead the children of Israel out of Egypt?
Because God told him to.
Why did Moses do the ten plagues?
Because God told him to.
Why did Abraham leave his homeland?
Because God told him to
Why did Joseph believe that his family would bow to him?
Because God showed him that they would.
Why did Ananias go to minister healing to Saul of Tarsus?
Because God told him to
Why didn't Paul preach the word in Asia nor in Bithynia in Acts 16?
Because God told him not to.
Why did Paul go to Macedonia?
Because God showed him a vision of a man of Macedonia?
Who is it that I am supposed to obey?
You?
Or God?
I choose to believe and obey God.
oatmeal
Well-known member
You wouldn't know one God's ministers was talking to you face to face.
Why limit what God can do for you?
What God has done for believers in the past He is willing and able to do today.
oatmeal
Well-known member
Those verses are as true and viable today as the day God had Paul write them down.
SimpleMan77
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I believe you are saying that the foundation is laid now that we have the written word of God.
What about missionaries to places where the Bible hasn't been translated into their language yet - can God not do signs and wonders there to confirm His word?
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God's Truth
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Speaking in tongues were a sign to the Jews.
Jews were dispersed among many nations and they spoke the language of the nations they lived.
God's Truth
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What don't you get that you are not doing any of that?
SimpleMan77
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Rules Governing The Gift Of Tongues
Only one time that was recorded the languages were understood as recognized languages. Only once.
What about edifying your spirit by praying in a language you don't know? 1 Cor 14:2 says that speaking in a tongue results in no man understanding. The Bible speaks of speaking in tongues of angels.
Don't confuse the tongues of Pentecost with other passages - passages that explicitly talk of tongues not understood by any man.
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Only one time that was recorded the languages were understood as recognized languages. Only once.
What about edifying your spirit by praying in a language you don't know? 1 Cor 14:2 says that speaking in a tongue results in no man understanding. The Bible speaks of speaking in tongues of angels.
Don't confuse the tongues of Pentecost with other passages - passages that explicitly talk of tongues not understood by any man.
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oatmeal
Well-known member
Wow. Where did I claim that I am doing any of that?
What I did claim is that Jesus Christ said any believer, including me, can do it according to John 14:12
Why don't you believe what Jesus Christ said?
Did he lie or did he tell the truth?
He told the truth and I believe it.
God's Truth
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You are playing games.
No one is doing those things but it was done in the New Testament times.
God's Truth
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In the Old Testament, we read this about tongues...
Isaiah 28:11 Very well then, with foreign lips
and strange tongues God will speak to this people,
12 to whom he said, "This is the resting place, let the weary rest";
and, "This is the place of repose"—
but they would not listen.
Now read what the New Testament says about tongues...
1 Corinthians 14:21 In the Law it is written:
"Through men of strange tongues
and through the lips of foreigners
I will speak to this people,
but even then they will not listen to me," says the Lord.
22Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is for believers, not for unbelievers.
In Acts 2:5 we see that there were JEWS from EVERY NATION. The Jews are the people God said that He would speak to through men of strange tongues...
Acts 2:5 Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven.
In addition, in Acts 2:6 we see that the Jews from every nation spoke in many different languages...
Acts 2:6 When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment, because each one heard them speaking in his own language.
Just look at the list of places the Jews had come from...
Acts 2:8-Then how is it that each of us hears them in his own native language? 9Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, 10Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome 11 (both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs-we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!"
We can see from the scriptures that speaking in tongues was prophesied about in the Old Testament, that the Lord would speak to the Jews, as stated in Isaiah 28. In the New Testament, we can see that this is a fulfilled prophecy, as confirmed by Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 14:21. Since the biblical speaking in tongues were for a sign, and God gave the sign for the purpose as prophesied in the Old Testament, it would make sense to believe that speaking in tongues is a gift that would stop.
This scripture tells us that tongues “will be stilled”:
1 Corinthians 13:8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.
Tongues did not stop during the time Jesus Christ, the Apostles and Prophets were laying down the foundation because the Apostles were still writing the scriptures. Imagine if tongues had stopped in the people who had the gift, others would erroneously believe that God also took salvation away from them, since the Jews believed God accepted Gentiles as was evident by their speaking in words of God in different languages.
However, tongues have since ceased. Jesus, the prophets and the apostles have laid the foundation; the Bible is finished. New prophecies and new knowledge have ceased also, just as the Bible says they would, for you know you cannot add new prophecies and new knowledge to the Bible.
God's Truth
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Calling the false tongue speaking a "prayer language" is from an error in understanding of the scriptures explaining speaking in tongues when no one is around who understands. It is important to realize that after the believers in the bible had the gift of speaking in tongues for the sign to the Jews...they kept the gift even when the Jews of other languages were not around. Therefore, the tongue speakers spoke only to God when they spoke in tongues they did not understand and when no Jews from other languages were there, because, God, of course, can understand all the earthly languages.
Again, if there were no one of other languages around to understand the tongue speaker, and if the tongue speaker themselves cannot interpret what they say, then they are speaking only to God, and this speaking edified (nurtures) only the tongue speakers themselves.
Tongue speaking edifies (nurtures) only the tongue speaker when no understands; they are edified in knowing that God gave them an amazing gift (the real tongues is an amazing gift). How edifying it is for oneself just to have a gift such as speaking in tongues; that alone is what edifies. It is a false edification when one is performing nonsense babbling.
Nowadays tongue speakers, while trying to copy cat the real tongue speaking as is in the Bible, they discount completely that if they do not interpret what they say, even when praying in tongues to God only...then their mind is fruitless. Surely, a fruitless mind is not something one should be aiming for in personal prayer times.