Why Don't the Liberals Want a Wall?

[The Barbarian]

What?

I'm not talking about someone getting angry or occasionally loosing their temper or even sometimes being wrong or whatever else. The libs on this thread and other like it are certifiably stupid! I mean flat out slobber mouthed, grunting Neanderthals who can barely put a coherent sentence together, never mind make a rational defense of the abject stupidity they claim to believe!

Hmm... that doesn't sound like a rational defense of your position, Clete.

One idiot suggested that she was fine with a border wall so long as Trump paid for it out of his own pocket!

Perhaps she remembers that he pledged to have Mexico pay for it. It may seem strange to that she expects him to take responsibility for his error, but that's the way it used to be in America. Apparently, no longer for some.

That's laughable because he could easily afford to do it

No, he couldn't.

The price tab projected by Trump’s opponents far exceeds previous estimates, which topped out at $21.6 billion. The Democrats’ report is based on extrapolations, not hard data. It says that although the Department of Homeland Security and Customs and Border Patrol have not provided a “reliable cost estimate” for President Trump’s signature campaign promise, the party has reached its projections using information provided by CBP officials, including the Trump administration’s 2017 budget request and 2018 budget proposal.
http://time.com/4745350/donald-trump-border-wall-cost-billions/

With an estimated net worth of $3.1 billion on Forbes's list of the world's billionaires, Trump has a fortune that's declined by $400 million in the past year.

https://www.townandcountrymag.com/society/money-and-power/a9162094/donald-trump-net-worth/

Not even close.

and would probably do it if it were legal (which it isn't)

Actually, it is. If he could somehow scrape up the 20 to 70 billion dollars it will cost (depending on whether you believe Trump or his critics), he could donate the wall to the United States, and Congress could accept it.

and the same moron who wants Trump to pay for the totally inexpensive border wall

Twenty billion here, twenty billion there; it adds up.

is probably just fine with Obama having taken over a 6th of the economy with his fantastically stupid health care debacle

The favorable rating for ObamaCare has reached its highest level since the law was enacted in 2010, according to a Kaiser Family Foundation (KFF) poll.

The poll finds that 54 percent of the public has a favorable view of the law, compared to 42 percent who have an unfavorable view. That is the highest favorable rating in a KFF poll since it began asking the question in 2010.

The rise is driven by independents, the KFF found, with 55 percent now having a favorable view of the law, a significant jump from 48 percent last month. Nearly eight in ten Republicans still have an unfavorable view of the law.
http://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/376210-poll-obamacare-favorability-reaches-all-time-high

Ironically, Trump probably has a lot to do with this; voter approval of Obamacare shot up when Trump tried to repeal it. That's the major reason that he failed.

not to mention the 530 million dollars PER YEAR that we all pay to Planned Parenthood!

Trump says Planned Parenthood "does some very good work." He has switched back and forth from pro-abortion to pro-life, depending on who he's talking to at the time.

You are all dumb as a sack of bricks and would destroy this entire nation if given half a chance.

There are many decent conservatives who don't want to destroy America. There are many decent liberals who don't want to destroy America. The problem is, neither of those are running things, now.

But don't let anything like sound reason persuade you!

See above. Give it some thought. And put your guns away for now. Things might be really messed up, but violence won't make it better.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

I don't presume to know the best solution until I study all the pertinent facts. I was hoping to glean some info on the issue you raised...but you seem to have concluded upon the overall issue by your own undisclosed methods, however biased and limited those may appear.

Yes, I am biased toward all the women who are being kidnapped and sold into prostitution on their way to the border and building a wall will stop that.

But you seem to not care because all you can say is that you want to study all the pertinent facts!

Exactly which facts do you think are more pertinent than the facts concerning the way these poor women are being abused?

There is a solution and Trump has that solution but you want nothing to do with that solution.

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."--Edmund Burke​

 

[Foxfire]

Maybe we should build a moat too!

Oh! Wait! We tried that with the Rio Grande!

How did THAT work?

:rotfl:

 

[ok doser]

we built the rio grande? :freak:


you sure about that?

 

[quip]

Yes, I am biased toward all the women who are being kidnapped and sold into prostitution on their way to the border and building a wall will stop that.

But you seem to not care because all you can say is that you want to study all the pertinent facts!

Exactly which facts do you think are more pertinent than the facts concerning the way these poor women are being abused?

There is a solution and Trump has that solution but you want nothing to do with that solution.

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."--Edmund Burke​

Well, if nothing else you're persistent but you seem to be avoiding the point. Evaluating the evidence IS the point or in your case... entertaining an emotional appeal in lieu of exploring all appropriate considerations.

 

[The Barbarian]

Maybe we should build a moat too!

Oh! Wait! We tried that with the Rio Grande!

How did THAT work?

:rotfl:

There's this:

The "moat" really doesn't work much better than a wall would. This is, BTW, a legal crossing at Los Ebanos, in the valley. A little nervous about it, but it works pretty well.

 

[Clete]

Hmm... that doesn't sound like a rational defense of your position, Clete.

I wasn't defending my position, moron! I was simply restating it because you seemed to miss the point the first time.

Besides, you wouldn't know a rational argument from Sasquatch

Perhaps she remembers that he pledged to have Mexico pay for it.

Which they will do, one way or another. He never intended them to right a check for it.

It may seem strange to that she expects him to take responsibility for his error, but that's the way it used to be in America. Apparently, no longer for some.

A liberal talking about personal responsibility! :rotfl:

No, he couldn't.

The price tab projected by Trump’s opponents far exceeds previous estimates, which topped out at $21.6 billion. The Democrats’ report is based on extrapolations, not hard data. It says that although the Department of Homeland Security and Customs and Border Patrol have not provided a “reliable cost estimate” for President Trump’s signature campaign promise, the party has reached its projections using information provided by CBP officials, including the Trump administration’s 2017 budget request and 2018 budget proposal.
http://time.com/4745350/donald-trump-border-wall-cost-billions/

With an estimated net worth of $3.1 billion on Forbes's list of the world's billionaires, Trump has a fortune that's declined by $400 million in the past year.

https://www.townandcountrymag.com/society/money-and-power/a9162094/donald-trump-net-worth/

Not even close.

I wasn't suggesting that he could write a personal check you moron!

What the hell am I even doing here? It is not possible to have a rational conversation with a leftist. They're all just so intensely stupid!

Actually, it is. If he could somehow scrape up the 20 to 70 billion dollars it will cost (depending on whether you believe Trump or his critics), he could donate the wall to the United States, and Congress could accept it.

You're a buffoon. It would NOT be even close to legal for anyone to simply decide that they are going to start a major construction project on land owned by the federal government.

Twenty billion here, twenty billion there; it adds up.

The government spends more money than that EVERY YEAR doing nothing at all other than maintaining VACANT federal buildings!

STUPID!

The favorable rating for ObamaCare has reached its highest level since the law was enacted in 2010, according to a Kaiser Family Foundation (KFF) poll.

The poll finds that 54 percent of the public has a favorable view of the law, compared to 42 percent who have an unfavorable view. That is the highest favorable rating in a KFF poll since it began asking the question in 2010.

The rise is driven by independents, the KFF found, with 55 percent now having a favorable view of the law, a significant jump from 48 percent last month. Nearly eight in ten Republicans still have an unfavorable view of the law.
http://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/376210-poll-obamacare-favorability-reaches-all-time-high

Ironically, Trump probably has a lot to do with this; voter approval of Obamacare shot up when Trump tried to repeal it. That's the major reason that he failed.

He didn't fail. The Republicans in Congress failed. If it were up to Trump, it would have been gone on day one. Trump is the President, not the King.

And I couldn't care less how popular it is. Nazism was popular in the 1930s Germany. Communism in popular in China. Socialism is STILL popular in places like Venezuela!

This is America where what I earn is (ought to be) mine by right. It's people like you and Obama who think it right to take what I've earned by force and give it to people who didn't earn it in exchange for their vote.

Trump says Planned Parenthood "does some very good work." He has switched back and forth from pro-abortion to pro-life, depending on who he's talking to at the time.

So what? This is not relevant to the point I made.

Like I said, stupid!

There are many decent conservatives who don't want to destroy America. There are many decent liberals who don't want to destroy America. The problem is, neither of those are running things, now.

It isn't a question of want, although I reject your premise and believe entirely that Democrats in the vein of Obama and Clinton want very much to destroy America. They despise the idea of a free people with a government that stays mostly out of their lives. Democrats are Socialists and would and do enact socialists policies whenever given the chance to do it. And whether they want for these policies to destroy the country or not, they will do exactly that. They always have and they always will. Liberals are simply too stupid to learn from history. Either that, or it's worse and they know precisely what their policies will do.

See above. Give it some thought. And put your guns away for now. Things might be really messed up, but violence won't make it better.

You're so stupid!

My guns will only come out when the left becomes violent, which they will do eventually (again - the lessons of history). They're on the verge of it now.

Only an idiot leftist would take a comment about self-defense as an incitement to violence.


Don't bother responding. I won't waste any more time reading anything you have to say about anything.

:wave2:

 

[Arthur Brain]

Oh take a chill pill and get over yourself Clete. Your gormless rants are tedious beyond words.

:yawn:

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Well, if nothing else you're persistent but you seem to be avoiding the point. Evaluating the evidence IS the point or in your case... entertaining an emotional appeal in lieu of exploring all appropriate considerations.

I am not avoiding the point because there exists now a solution which will serve to stop the evil that is happening to women on the way to the border.

You seem content to let them continue to suffer because you support the obstructionists whose only purpose on the earth is to make sure that the problem is not fixed while Trump is in office!

 

[Kit the Coyote]

It would NOT be even close to legal for anyone to simply decide that they are going to start a major construction project on land owned by the federal government.

Actually, a lot of the land is privately owned which is a major problem, particularly in Texas. Building Trump's wall will require one of the largest use of eminent domain in history. There is also the problem that we have treaty obligations that forbid building any barrier inside the floodplains of the Rio Grande which means a wall along there will have to be well inside the US border cutting off Texas farmers and landowners from a major watershed, ceding the Rio Grand to Mexico. In a part of the country where wars have been fought over water rights that will go over well.

 

[The Barbarian]

Barbarian observes:
Hmm... that doesn't sound like a rational defense of your position, Clete.

I wasn't defending my position, moron! I was simply restating it because you seemed to miss the point the first time.

You were talking to AB, not me. This is Barbarian.

Besides, you wouldn't know a rational argument from Sasquatch

I'm suggesting that you can do (and have done) better than that.

Perhaps she remembers that he pledged to have Mexico pay for it. It may seem strange to that she expects him to take responsibility for his error, but that's the way it used to be in America. Apparently, no longer for some.

Which they will do, one way or another. He never intended them to right a check for it.

He promises a lot of stuff to a lot of people, and rarely delivers. There's no way to do it. Taxing Mexican products will merely extort money from American citizens.

(Barbarian points out that there's no way Trump could pay for the wall himself)

No, he couldn't.

The price tab projected by Trump’s opponents far exceeds previous estimates, which topped out at $21.6 billion. The Democrats’ report is based on extrapolations, not hard data. It says that although the Department of Homeland Security and Customs and Border Patrol have not provided a “reliable cost estimate” for President Trump’s signature campaign promise, the party has reached its projections using information provided by CBP officials, including the Trump administration’s 2017 budget request and 2018 budget proposal.
http://time.com/4745350/donald-trump...cost-billions/

With an estimated net worth of $3.1 billion on Forbes's list of the world's billionaires, Trump has a fortune that's declined by $400 million in the past year.

https://www.townandcountrymag.com/so...ump-net-worth/

Not even close.

I wasn't suggesting that he could write a personal check you moron!

Darn right, he couldn't. If he totally liquidated all of his holdings he couldn't pay for it.

Barbarian observes:
Actually, it is. If he could somehow scrape up the 20 to 70 billion dollars it will cost (depending on whether you believe Trump or his critics), he could donate the wall to the United States, and Congress could accept it.

You're a buffoon. It would NOT be even close to legal for anyone to simply decide that they are going to start a major construction project on land owned by the federal government.

Actually, such things have been accepted by the federal government, as donations by private citizens. Completely legal.

He didn't fail.

He promised to get it done. He couldn't do it. That's called "failure."

And I couldn't care less how popular it is. Nazism was popular in the 1930s Germany.

However, it's only popular in the republican party in the United States.

Communism in popular in China.

You think China has a communist system? Seriously? It's runaway capitalism. They have a stock market. They have gigantic corporations and billionaire businessmen. How is that communistic?

Socialism is STILL popular in places like Venezuela!

Doesn't look much like it. Socialism is what they do in Sweden and Finland where citizens have a very nice safety net and all sorts of welfare benefits. A military dictatorship which can't even provide enough food and medicine for it's people doesn't seem to fit.

You're so stupid!

Well, you know how dumb barbarians can be.

My guns will only come out when the left becomes violent, which they will do eventually (again - the lessons of history). They're on the verge of it now.

Let's hope you don't have any provocations that cause you to resort to violence. I like you, and I'd really hate to see you get yourself in that kind of mess.

Only an idiot leftist would take a comment about self-defense as an incitement to violence.

Just be careful, hear?

 

[Rusha]

Perhaps she remembers that he pledged to have Mexico pay for it. It may seem strange to that she expects him to take responsibility for his error, but that's the way it used to be in America. Apparently, no longer for some.

I didn't believe that lie then ... and I don't believe it now. However, that doesn't make it any less of *another* broken promise. Most likely Hillary or Obama's fault. Remember how Obamacare would be repealed and replaced on day one with "something fabulous"? lain:

"What do you have to lose?"

Now they know.

 

[Foxfire]

There's this:

The "moat" really doesn't work much better than a wall would. This is, BTW, a legal crossing at Los Ebanos, in the valley. A little nervous about it, but it works pretty well.

The Panama Canal hasn't slowed the flow of immigration from South America.

The number of South American immigrants grew from 90,000 in 1960 to around 2.9 million in 2014, representing a 32-fold increase.

https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/south-american-immigrants-united-states/

And WE BUILT THAT!!!

 

[ok doser]

The Panama Canal hasn't slowed the flow of immigration from South America.



https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/south-american-immigrants-united-states/

And WE BUILT THAT!!!

The atlantic ocean dint prevent the flow of immigrants from europe

 

[The Barbarian]

The atlantic ocean dint prevent the flow of immigrants from europe

Maybe the Indians should have put up a wall?

How'd that work out for the Chinese?

Yep. Wasn't even a speed bump. Today, in China, there are many millions of Mongols and Manchus, who found the wall to be no obstacle at all, and poured through, each conquering China in turn.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Maybe the Indians should have put up a wall?

How'd that work out for the Chinese?

Yep. Wasn't even a speed bump. Today, in China, there are many millions of Mongols and Manchus, who found the wall to be no obstacle at all, and poured through, each conquering China in turn.

So what solution do you suggest?

 

[ok doser]

Maybe the Indians should have put up a wall?

How'd that work out for the Chinese?

Yep. Wasn't even a speed bump. Today, in China, there are many millions of Mongols and Manchus, who found the wall to be no obstacle at all, and poured through, each conquering China in turn.

Effective walls:
Berlin wall
Gaza strip wall
The walls at the detention centers you see on tv

 

[Foxfire]

The atlantic ocean dint prevent the flow of immigrants from europe

:mock: and YOU think a measly wall will do the trick with Mexico? :rotfl:

 

[The Barbarian]

Barbarian observes:
Maybe the Indians should have put up a wall?

How'd that work out for the Chinese?

Yep. Wasn't even a speed bump. Today, in China, there are many millions of Mongols and Manchus, who found the wall to be no obstacle at all, and poured through, each conquering China in turn.

Effective walls:
Berlin wall

Total length 87 miles

Gaza strip wall

It's a fence. Like the ones we have on the border.

And more effective because you can see what's going on, on the back of it. Wall wouldn't work.

The walls at the detention centers you see on tv

Couple of hundred yards, maybe.

Ineffective walls:
Great Wall of China
1300 miles

Maginot line
900 miles

Trump's wall
Maybe 900 miles, depending on Trump's story du jour.

You've rather handily undermined your own argument.

 

[ok doser]

:mock: and YOU think a measly wall will do the trick with Mexico? :rotfl:

A measly wall, unstaffed and unmonitored?

No, i dont think that