When does the biblical day begin?

[Jerry Shugart]

The Lord's supper was not a passover meal...cant eat the sacrifice without killing it first...

Why was the Passover lamb killed before the meal that night?:

"Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed. And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat" (Lk.22:7-8).​

"And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?" (Mk.14:12).​

Are you saying that the Apostles had the Passover lamb killed in order that they could eat it with the Lord Jesus that night but they never ate it? For what reason would they kill it unless they were going to eat it?

 

[clefty]

Why was the Passover lamb killed before the meal that night?:

it wasn't killed...you only read into it something you assume as occuring...preparing the passover does not just mean killing and roasting the lamb

Passover was a massive annual national holiday where all jews were to be in Jerusalem to celebrate...much anticipation and preparation was in order. Even nowadays when we say holiday season we include other days not just the day of Christmas...and much anticipation and preparation occurs...we may even say we "with fervent desire i have desired to celebrate this Christmas Day day with you" weeks before the actual day...right?

Now let's try reading this more as if it was written namely without punctuation as it is in greek.

"Then came the day of unleavened bread when the passover must be killed" there now that describes the annual holiday season "And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat"[/I] (Lk.22:7-8). Now you infer or assume or insist that this means they are headed up to the temple having got a lamb and then having it killed by the priest waiting in Who knows how long a line and returning that same day to eat THAT night...when it just as easily could mean find the place make sure it is cleaned of leaven food stocked with drink food etc for the holiday week they were to spend there...

Same with the other text...your argument is from silence

To prepare the passover does not necessarily mean to buy the lamb walk it up to the temple stand in line have it killed drained of blood proper come back and roast the lamb...how long does it take to fire pit roast a lamb anyway?

Are you saying that the Apostles had the Passover lamb killed in order that they could eat it with the Lord Jesus that night but they never ate it? For what reason would they kill it unless they were going to eat it?

You are assuming it means they ate lamb when no mention of lamb was made or bitters...the instruction is to eat standing with sandals on and staff in hand and burn the leftovers and NOT go out of the house that night...but they went out singing to the garden...the bread they ate was not unleavened as all that occurred the next night after He was killed

 

[Jerry Shugart]

it wasn't killed...you only read into it something you assume as occuring...preparing the passover does not just mean killing and roasting the lamb

What day of the month is being spoken of here?:

"Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed. And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat" (Lk.22:7-8).​

It says that "then" came they day when the passover must be killed.

The day when the passover lamb was killed was on the 14th and that is exactly the same day when the passover was eaten (Ex.12:6-8).

According to your strange idea the Lord Jesus told His Apostles to go and prepare the passover that "we may eat" but they did not even kill it!

You just refuse to believe the obvious--they ate the Passover Seder on the 14th and the next day on the 15th the Lord Jesus was crucified.

 

[intojoy]

..."many Christians"...so by island you mean like the size of Australia?...lol

Evidence beyond genesis...

1 Sam 19:

"10Saul tried to pin David to the wall with the spear, but he slipped away out of Saul's presence, so that he stuck the spear into the wall. And David fled and escaped that night. 11Then Saul sent messengers to David's house to watch him, in order to put him to death in the morning. But Michal, David's wife, told him, saying, "If you do not save your life tonight, tomorrow you will be put to death." 12So Michal let David down through a window, and he went out and fled and escaped..."

Notice she did not say "today in the morning you will be put to death"...

Biblical days begin in the morning. Thus the only thing which occurred that first (day) of seven...Mia ton sabbaton...was the tomb was found empty...He WAS risen indeed that day...He rose the day before...

No Sunday resurrection but it was on the Previous day the Sabbath...

Resurrection sundown Saturday


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[Jerry Shugart]

Resurrection sundown Saturday

Are you serious?

Are you not aware of the "type" of the first fruits and its relationship to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus?:

"Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest unto the priest: And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it" (Lev.23:10-11).​

The "morrow after the sabbath" is Sunday, the day of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus.

 

[intojoy]

Are you serious?

Are you not aware of the "type" of the first fruits and its relationship to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus?:

"Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest unto the priest: And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it" (Lev.23:10-11).​

The "morrow after the sabbath" is Sunday, the day of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus.

Lil kiss for ya Jerry


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[chair]

Jewish tradition is that the day starts in the evening. Despite the claim that this is a later Rabbinic invention, I haven't seen any proof that this is the case.

Leviticus 23,32 indicates that the traditional Jewish view started in Biblical times:
"It is a day of sabbath rest for you, and you must deny yourselves. From the evening of the ninth day of the month until the following evening you are to observe your sabbath.”

 

[clefty]

What day of the month is being spoken of here?:

"Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed. And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat" (Lk.22:7-8).​

It says that "then" came they day when the passover must be killed.

The day when the passover lamb was killed was on the 14th and that is exactly the same day when the passover was eaten (Ex.12:6-8).

According to your strange idea the Lord Jesus told His Apostles to go and prepare the passover that "we may eat" but they did not even kill it!

You just refuse to believe the obvious--they ate the Passover Seder on the 14th and the next day on the 15th the Lord Jesus was crucified.

I work in retail and if somebody came in this week to say "so it's christmas time" that is easily understood that the once a year event is occuring and we are already deep into preparing for it...

The passover is a once a year event...a highlight and much was to be done for it...

The passover when the Wrath actually passed over actually occured the midnight after the killing of the lambs...still the 14th

 

[clefty]

Are you serious?

Are you not aware of the "type" of the first fruits and its relationship to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus?:

"Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest unto the priest: And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it" (Lev.23:10-11).​

The "morrow after the sabbath" is Sunday, the day of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus.

Only thing that happened after that Sabbath as the sun was rising on that morrow after the sabbath was the tomb was discovered empty...He was risen...the day before...as morning begins a new day...

Had not even presented Himself as first fruits yet meaning dont hold on to Him as He had yet to ascend...

 

[clefty]

Jewish tradition is that the day starts in the evening. Despite the claim that this is a later Rabbinic invention, I haven't seen any proof that this is the case.

Leviticus 23,32 indicates that the traditional Jewish view started in Biblical times:
"It is a day of sabbath rest for you, and you must deny yourselves. From the evening of the ninth day of the month until the following evening you are to observe your sabbath.”

Besides the genesis account where light is created then it was evening then it was morning the the day is counted as complete...how about this

1 Sam 19:11Saul sent men to David's house to watch it and to kill him in the morning. But Michal, David's wife, warned him, "If you don't run for your life tonight, tomorrow you'll be killed."

If biblical days started in the evening she would have said "today you'll be killed"

There is more scriptural evidence but maybe you are content with Jewish tradition? They are men yes?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

The passover when the Wrath actually passed over actually occured the midnight after the killing of the lambs...still the 14th

Yes, and it was also Passover, the 14th, when they killed the lambs:

"Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed. And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat" (Lk.22:7-8).

They killed the passover lamb on the 14th and then later that night they ate the Passover Seder (Mk.14:17-18).

 

[intojoy]

Are you serious?

Are you not aware of the "type" of the first fruits and its relationship to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus?:

"Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest unto the priest: And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it" (Lev.23:10-11).​

The "morrow after the sabbath" is Sunday, the day of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus.

The morrow after the sabbath begins sundown Saturday


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[rstrats]

Jerry Shugart,
re: "Are you not aware of the 'type' of the first fruits and its relationship to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus?:

Just so it's understood that first fruits is not appropriate for determining the day of the resurrection.

 

[clefty]

Yes, and it was also Passover, the 14th, when they killed the lambs:

"Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed. And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat" (Lk.22:7-8).

They killed the passover lamb on the 14th and then later that night they ate the Passover Seder (Mk.14:17-18).

You can't have it both ways...you insist He ate the passover lamb which is killed on the 14th before the 15th...He died on the 14th as the lambs were being killed

But for you that means He ate a lamb killed on the 13th before the evening of the 14th the day the lambs are killed...

You ignore that He went out into the garden after eating and yet no one is to go outside after eating the passover lamb as that is the same and very night the wrath of Yah passes over...the 14th the same day as when the lambs were killed and eaten...burning the leftovers before morning the 15th

For 8 centuries christendom celebrated this last supper with leavened bread (one half still does) but Rome changed it to unleavened.

There is a reason for that. Specifically the early church did not consider the eucharist a passover/unleavened festival.

Changes were made...many changes...

 

[clefty]

The morrow after the sabbath begins sundown Saturday


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You missed most of this thread then...

 

[jamie]

You missed most of this thread then...

"And you shall count for yourselves from the day after the Sabbath, from the day that you brought the sheaf of the wave offering seven Sabbaths shall be completed. Count fifty days to the day after the seventh Sabbath" (Leviticus 23:15-16)

Seven Sabbaths shall be completed. For seven Sabbaths to be completed requires 49 consecutive days. The next day is Pentecost.

 

[Ktoyou]

Day begins in the morning. God said sun up is day and sun down is night. I do not care about Jewish traditions because I am not Jewish.

 

[clefty]

"And you shall count for yourselves from the day after the Sabbath, from the day that you brought the sheaf of the wave offering seven Sabbaths shall be completed. Count fifty days to the day after the seventh Sabbath" (Leviticus 23:15-16)

Seven Sabbaths shall be completed. For seven Sabbaths to be completed requires 49 consecutive days. The next day is Pentecost.

And? Count to the next DAY...as in daylight portion...not count to the next evening beginning with the night time portion but count to the next day beginning morning into the day light portion...count to the next DAY not night...

 

[jamie]

And? Count to the next DAY...as in daylight portion...not count to the next evening beginning with the night time portion but count to the next day beginning morning into the day light portion...count to the next DAY not night...

"In the Bible, the season of light (Gen. i. 5), lasting "from dawn [lit. "the rising of the morning"] to the coming forth of the stars" (Neh. iv. 15, 17). The term "day" is used also to denote a period of twenty-four hours (Ex. xxi. 21)."
http://jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/5007-day

 

[chair]

Besides the genesis account where light is created then it was evening then it was morning the the day is counted as complete...how about this

1 Sam 19:11Saul sent men to David's house to watch it and to kill him in the morning. But Michal, David's wife, warned him, "If you don't run for your life tonight, tomorrow you'll be killed."

If biblical days started in the evening she would have said "today you'll be killed"

There is more scriptural evidence but maybe you are content with Jewish tradition? They are men yes?

You do not know what the Hebrew word that is translated as "tomorrow" means in the Bible. You assume that it means "the day after today", but it could just as easily mean "the next daytime".

Human tradition is all we have. It the only reason to think that the Hebrew Bible is of any value. The usual response to this is "yes, but Jesus is God, and Jesus said..."- think for a minute. How do you know that "Jesus is God"? Only from human tradition. Even if it is written in a book.