WHAT DOES BAPTIZED FOR THE DEAD MEAN ?

[DougE]

Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead? 1 Corinthians 15:29

Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead? 1 Corinthians 15:12

The apostle Paul is writing to correct the teaching of some that there is no resurrection of the dead.

For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:

And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished. 1 Corinthians 15:16-18

Paul is asserting that if Christ is not risen those who fall asleep (die) are perished, there is no resurrection, no eternal life, only an eternal nothingness.

For has many definitions and uses. The use of for “as being” expresses the intention of it's use in 1 Corinthians 15:29.

We can then understand that the verse is asking;

what shall the baptized believers, whose hope is eternal life, do, if being baptized is for nothing; since there is no hope, all there is, is death: what shall they do if they are baptized as being dead.

 

[Bradley D]

Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
"The only tenable interpretation is that there existed amongst some of the Christians at Corinth a practice of baptising a living person in the stead of some convert who had died before that sacrament had been administered to him. Such a practice existed amongst the Marcionites in the second century, and still earlier amongst a sect called the Corinthians."

 

[DAN P]

Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
"The only tenable interpretation is that there existed amongst some of the Christians at Corinth a practice of baptising a living person in the stead of some convert who had died before that sacrament had been administered to him. Such a practice existed amongst the Marcionites in the second century, and still earlier amongst a sect called the Corinthians."

Hi and did they give a verse for that INTERPRETATION ?

And did they say that 1 Cor 15:29 is talking about WATER BAPTISM ?

dan p

 

[Bradley D]

Hi and did they give a verse for that INTERPRETATION ?

And did they say that 1 Cor 15:29 is talking about WATER BAPTISM ?

dan p

Yes, that was a commentary on 1 Cor. 15:29.

https://biblehub.com/commentaries/1_...ians/15-29.htm

 

[DAN P]

Yes, that was a commentary on 1 Cor. 15:29.

https://biblehub.com/commentaries/1_...ians/15-29.htm

Hi and this is what I believe today !

#1 It is not WATER BAPTISM . :4 4 4

#2 I believe that 1 Cor 15 is talking about the RESURRECTION .and Paul here is talking to the BODY OF CHRIST .and not to Israel .

#3 To be RESURRECTED , Rom 12:13 says believers are to be raised , 2 Thess 2:1

#4 Rom 6: 4 says that , therefore we are buried with HIM by BAPTISM / BAPTISMA INTO THE DEATH .

#5 This means to me that we as the B O C ARE BAPTIZED FOR THE DEAD !

dan p

 

[Bradley D]

Are there still water baptisms?

"I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire" (Matthew 3:11).

What is B O C?

 

[DAN P]

Are there still water baptisms?

"I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire" (Matthew 3:11).

What is B O C?

Hi and B O C means BODY OF CHRIST .

All BAPTISMS are called BAPTISMA and BAPTISMA is used 22 times from MATTHEW ---- Eph 4:5 .

BAPTISMA only speaks about the HOLY SPIRIT as a BAPTIZER !

dan p

 

[Derf]

Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead? 1 Corinthians 15:29

Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead? 1 Corinthians 15:12

The apostle Paul is writing to correct the teaching of some that there is no resurrection of the dead.

For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:

And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished. 1 Corinthians 15:16-18

Paul is asserting that if Christ is not risen those who fall asleep (die) are perished, there is no resurrection, no eternal life, only an eternal nothingness.

For has many definitions and uses. The use of for “as being” expresses the intention of it's use in 1 Corinthians 15:29.

We can then understand that the verse is asking;

what shall the baptized believers, whose hope is eternal life, do, if being baptized is for nothing; since there is no hope, all there is, is death: what shall they do if they are baptized as being dead.

Here's another way to punctuate the verse:
Derf's punctuation:
1 Corinthians 15:29 KJV — Else what shall they do which are baptized? for the dead. If the dead rise not at all, why are they then baptized for the dead?

KJV for comparison:
1 Corinthians 15:29 KJV — Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?

The idea being that it makes no sense to get baptized if there's no resurrection--you're still just dead when you die. But if there really is a resurrection, you have hope for after death, and baptism actually means something as a symbol of the resurrection.

Ref: Bullinger's pamphlet on the parable of the rich man and Lazarus

https://www.fellowshipbiblechurchorlando.org/_files/ugd/d21e04_c1c03710d3df4c489391975e1ddd4739.pdf

 

[DAN P]

Hi and this is what I believe today !

#1 It is not WATER BAPTISM . :4 4 4

#2 I believe that 1 Cor 15 is talking about the RESURRECTION .and Paul here is talking to the BODY OF CHRIST .and not to Israel .

#3 To be RESURRECTED , Rom 12:13 says believers are to be raised , 2 Thess 2:1

#4 Rom 6: 4 says that , therefore we are buried with HIM by BAPTISM / BAPTISMA INTO THE DEATH .

#5 This means to me that we as the B O C ARE BAPTIZED FOR THE DEAD !

dan p

This is what baptism for the dead really means .

In Rom 6:4 , therefore , we were buried together with Him through this Baptisma / by the Holy Spirit , into the death , in other words , if not saved by grace , then the Holy Spirit will not place that person into Jesus death , then that person cannot be raised from the dead .

Col 2:12 say the same thing and that Greek word having been buried together with him in the Baptisma and anyone checking the Greek will see that word is Baptisma and means it is the One Baptisma of Eph 4:5.

dan p

 

[Derf]

This is what baptism for the dead really means .

In Rom 6:4 , therefore , we were buried together with Him through this Baptisma / by the Holy Spirit , into the death , in other words , if not saved by grace , then the Holy Spirit will not place that person into Jesus death , then that person cannot be raised from the dead .

Col 2:12 say the same thing and that Greek word having been buried together with him in the Baptisma and anyone checking the Greek will see that word is Baptisma and means it is the One Baptisma of Eph 4:5.

dan p

Shouldn't Paul have then said, "there is no such thing as baptism, if the dead are not raised"? If the baptism being addressed is purely the baptism of the Holy Spirit, then that baptism would be of no account at all, and therefore God would not waste His time. This speaks powerfully that the baptism Paul is talking about here is a physical symbol of something spiritual, rather than merely a spiritual action that physical beings can't effect on themselves.

But besides that, I think you are agreeing with my post.

 

[Thine Inwardly]

1Co 15:29

επει Because - τι who - ποιησουσιν they will be - οι the - βαπτιζομενοι baptized - υπερ for - των this - νεκρων death - ει also - ολως at all - νεκροι dead - ουκ not - εγειρονται risen - τι who - και also - βαπτιζονται baptized - υπερ for - των this - νεκρων death


:29
Because whom they will be the baptized for this death, also at / of all the dead not risen, who also are baptized for this death

basically, the manuscripts message from the Authors are explaining that the people who are righteous and saved and in the Salvation of Jesus Anointing will all be considered " BAPTIZED : into his death, even though they be dead they are

When also submitting him this all, then the Son submits the submission to himself this all... for is the God this all in all.

1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death

of all the dead not risen, who " they " also are baptized for this death
everyone who is called will be baptized into him, regardless and no matter how long ago they lived.

baptized OR BURRIED WITH HIM - in him - and in his triumph of the death and destruction of death itself , basically

 

[Derf]

1Co 15:29

επει Because - τι who - ποιησουσιν they will be - οι the - βαπτιζομενοι baptized - υπερ for - των this - νεκρων death - ει also - ολως at all - νεκροι dead - ουκ not - εγειρονται risen - τι who - και also - βαπτιζονται baptized - υπερ for - των this - νεκρων death


:29
Because whom they will be the baptized for this death, also at / of all the dead not risen, who also are baptized for this death

basically, the manuscripts message from the Authors are explaining that the people who are righteous and saved and in the Salvation of Jesus Anointing will all be considered " BAPTIZED : into his death, even though they be dead they are

When also submitting him this all, then the Son submits the submission to himself this all... for is the God this all in all.

1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death

of all the dead not risen, who " they " also are baptized for this death
everyone who is called will be baptized into him, regardless and no matter how long ago they lived.

baptized OR BURRIED WITH HIM - in him - and in his triumph of the death and destruction of death itself , basically

So, what's your point? It's harder to decipher your sentence structure than the straight word for word translations you quoted.

 

[Thine Inwardly]

yes, of course

Imagine the old black and white tv shows with the cowboys and Indians and recall the way the native Indians spoke.

the Native American Indian would say something like - " ME PRARIE TEPEE YOU TREE HOME "

what the Indian is saying is that " he will live on the prairie in a tepee and that you will live in a wooden house "

.... this is the exact way the Hebrew and Greek language existed when it was written. Ancient Hebrew and Greek
is a very, very basic simple, very simple sentence structure -

sometimes I have to take 15 minutes just looking at one single sentence to figure out how simple it is and push out all complexity and take it word for word..... i believe that no matter how simple the manuscript sentence - that simple sentence is exactly what the author intended to say. period

:29 Because whom they will be the baptized for this death, also at / of all the dead not risen, who also are baptized for this death.

this chapter is about death and the subject of dealing with death. When Jesus submits all things to himself and brings his Kingdom the God and Father.

shall all be made ALIVE. :23 resurrected - ✒ Everyone also in their own order, the first fruit The Anointing afterward them the Anointings in the returning of him. everyone in their own order from the beginning of the world will be resurrected - all :29 ✒ they will be the baptized for this death, also at / of all the dead not risen, who also are baptized for this death.

 

[Nick M]

The context is the resurrection of the dead. It is salvation, or this is all in vain.

16 For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen. 17 And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!

 

[Lon]

The way I was instructed in seminary: They did it (right or wrong). Hence the question from Paul: "Why do it if there is no after-life?" Thus it meant they did it, not necessarily that it was of effect, just the idea of "Hey you guys, don't you realize you have a quirk in your ideas?"

 

[Thine Inwardly]

so sorry, its just saying that the believers who died before Jesus would also be buried with him in his death

if we translate from the Greek as i presented - i am most certain this is the message about


✒ they will be the baptized for this death, also of all the dead not risen, - also are baptized for this death.

all time ----- all believers are baptized for this death - the death of Jesus / /

buried with him in his death - baptized for this death -

 

[Derf]

so sorry, its just saying that the believers who died before Jesus would also be buried with him in his death

if we translate from the Greek as i presented - i am most certain this is the message about


✒ they will be the baptized for this death, also of all the dead not risen, - also are baptized for this death.

all time ----- all believers are baptized for this death - the death of Jesus / /

buried with him in his death - baptized for this death -

Don't you think the passage is referring to a special group of people--"those who are baptised for the dead"--that did not include all believers, nor Paul himself (since he didn't say "we")?

 

[Thine Inwardly]

i believe that

the chapter is about the RESURECTION - CONCERNING THE 2 ND COMING - THE RAPTURE - and all dead whom have died in the past whom will be resurrected

this is what the Chapter seems to be about ?

about in dealing with the death and resurrection of the believers - leading to this event .

in Verse :23 Everyone also in their own order, :” THE FIRST FRUITS THE ANOINTING :“ afterward “ THEM THE ANOINTING “ in the returning of him.

the resurrection of the dead

concerning the dead - all dead whom will be raised to everlasting life from the past - meaning dead before Christ came

✒ they will be the baptized for this death, also of all the dead not risen, - also are baptized for this death

everyone in God will be baptized unto his death - even those before Jesus was born

 

[Derf]

i believe that

the chapter is about the RESURECTION - CONCERNING THE 2 ND COMING - THE RAPTURE - and all dead whom have died in the past whom will be resurrected

this is what the Chapter seems to be about ?

about in dealing with the death and resurrection of the believers - leading to this event .

in Verse :23 Everyone also in their own order, :” THE FIRST FRUITS THE ANOINTING :“ afterward “ THEM THE ANOINTING “ in the returning of him.

the resurrection of the dead

concerning the dead - all dead whom will be raised to everlasting life from the past - meaning dead before Christ came

✒ they will be the baptized for this death, also of all the dead not risen, - also are baptized for this death

everyone in God will be baptized unto his death - even those before Jesus was born

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