ECT What does Acts 15:11 mean today ??

I

Interplanner

Well-known member
turbosixx said:
If you take one verse out of context, you can prove all kinds of things.

The "they" are the Gentiles, that is what they are talking about, the conversion of Cornelius. It took an intervention by God for them to realize the Gentiles are now saved just as the Jews. Look at the first meeting on this.

Acts 11:17 Therefore if God gave to them the same gift as He gave to us also after believing in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God's way?" 18 When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, "Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life."

Gentiles saved the same way as the Jews. NO DIFFERENCE.
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That's correct, there is the same basis of salvation. Dan P has shifted reference from one basis to one of the people-groups. Total mistake. the solution? Read Gal 1 10x.
 
D

DAN P

Well-known member
Interplanner said:
That's correct, there is the same basis of salvation. Dan P has shifted reference from one basis to one of the people-groups. Total mistake. the solution? Read Gal 1 10x.
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Hi and where did I take Acts 15:11 OUT of CONTEXT ??

#1 , Will you explain why Peter says we shall be saved as they ALSO ??

#2 , If they are the " WE " then they are Jews !!

#3 , The "THEY " are the Gentiles saved by Grace !!

#4 , This means there are at least 2 different salvation GOSPELS which is Un-deniable !!

dan p
 
patrick jane

patrick jane

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DAN P said:
Hi and where did I take Acts 15:11 OUT of CONTEXT ??

#1 , Will you explain why Peter says we shall be saved as they ALSO ??

#2 , If they are the " WE " then they are Jews !!

#3 , The "THEY " are the Gentiles saved by Grace !!

#4 , This means there are at least 2 different salvation GOSPELS which is Un-deniable !!

dan p
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I think you nailed it Dan P :luigi:
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
heir said:
Peter knows that he (included in the we) shall be saved (as in future) even as they (also future). Simple stuff.
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Something's got derailed here. There are no future tenses in Acts 15:11. "Saved" means to have the debt of one's sins taken away.

The Christian message of justification (Rom 3:21+) from the debt of sin makes it as though the future day of judgement has already taken place.
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
DAN P said:
Hi and where did I take Acts 15:11 OUT of CONTEXT ??

#1 , Will you explain why Peter says we shall be saved as they ALSO ??

#2 , If they are the " WE " then they are Jews !!

#3 , The "THEY " are the Gentiles saved by Grace !!

#4 , This means there are at least 2 different salvation GOSPELS which is Un-deniable !!

dan p
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If one preaches another Gospel different from the one Paul preached let them be accursed ,whether it be Peter or an Angel from Heaven Gal 1:8-9! :)
 
T

Truster

New member
DAN P said:
Hi to all and we will always see , many who will never believe that there at LEAST 2 Gospels , and I can show 6 Gospels , regardless what the Holy Spirit has written !

Today we are saved by Grace as recorded in Rom 10:9 ans in Eph 2:8 !!

But in Acts 15:11 we have , we have Peter says this , But we believe through the GRACE of ( the ) Lord Jesus Christ TO BE SAVED as THEY ALSO !!

This tells me that all OT Saints like the 12 Preached a different message , have a different Hope and different Promises and will rule in a LITERAL Kingdom on earth !!

You will have to see what Peter means by " WE " ??

And what does " THEY " mean and who are " THEY " ???

It is obvious that Peter is the " WE " and that one day Jews will be saved by Grace !!

dan p
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Reading from Acts 15:7 gives a clear account of who they and we are.
 
heir

heir

TOL Subscriber
Interplanner said:
Something's got derailed here. There are no future tenses in Acts 15:11. "Saved" means to have the debt of one's sins taken away.
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"shall be" is future! :duh:

And it's certainly future for them!

1 Peter 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

1 Peter 1:8 Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:

1 Peter 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

1 Peter 1:10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
The verbs that matter in Acts 15:11 are present completed tense (ie perfect). But as I said, the Christian teaching about justification "moves" the judgement day forward as though it had passed.
 
heir

heir

TOL Subscriber
Interplanner said:
The verbs that matter in Acts 15:11 are present completed tense (ie perfect). But as I said, the Christian teaching about justification "moves" the judgement day forward as though it had passed.
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Hebrews 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

Hebrews 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

Hebrews 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
 
L

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
heir said:
"shall be" is future! :duh:

And it's certainly future for them!

1 Peter 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

1 Peter 1:8 Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:

1 Peter 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

1 Peter 1:10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
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Is there some other prophecies in the OT to cover the Grace which should come to Paul and the gentiles?

Lets hear them.

There are none, they all refer to those in Christ regardless of Jew or Gentile, before or after Paul.



LA
 
L

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
heir said:
Hebrews 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

Hebrews 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

Hebrews 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
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The verses are not saying it is impossible to fall away, but rather that if they do then they can not find repentance. God will not allow it.

Heb 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
Heb 12:16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
Heb 12:17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.


LA
 
turbosixx

turbosixx

New member
Lazy afternoon said:
The verses are not saying it is impossible to fall away, but rather that if they do then they can not find repentance. God will not allow it.

Heb 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
Heb 12:16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
Heb 12:17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.


LA
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I don't see it as God won't allow it but more as what else can they be offered if Christ's blood wasn't good enough. By falling away they show they don't want to be a follower of Christ and are basically in agreement with his crucifixion.

Heb. 6:6......since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.
 
L

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Act 11:18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Lazy afternoon said:
Is there some other prophecies in the OT to cover the Grace which should come to Paul and the gentiles?

Lets hear them.

There are none, they all refer to those in Christ regardless of Jew or Gentile, before or after Paul.



LA
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You must have a very narrow idea of grace if you don't know that most of the Messianic material is crammed with grace.
 
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